In afew days, GM and Chrysler submit their plans to the feds...

What can we expect?

No more Detroit? :shrug:

TOYOTA'S FOR EVERYONE!

Do you think a LSA Camaro Z28 will be in the plan?

Do you think a LSA Camaro Z28 will be in the plan?

I think that we can consider the Z/28 dead on this gen.


Beyond that, I think we're going to see plans for restructuring, (organizations and debt), and lots of downsizing. Probably some radical stuff --especially from Chrysler.

We can expect GM to cut divisions and dealers. GM is also looking to buy back more of Delphi as it seems that will give them bidding rights to more Gov. loans. I think it's fair to say even if GM gets the full value of the loans available it probably won't be enough. Even they admit problems in staying stable with total US auto sales projections under 10 millions annually.

The Stimulus (spending) bill has just passed and there are some provisions to remove some tax liability associated to the bailout loans issued in December.

In the end they will both get the loans after another round of humbling media pressure and Congressional brow beating. A Car Czar will be assigned and then the real downsizing pains will come to bear.

This is how I feel about things right now..

I wish I could zap myself 5 years into the future to see how all of this pans out.

I'm tired of talking about business plans. I want to go back to the days of talking about cars, and cars alone.

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f37/chrysler-faces-radical-shake-up-75396/

Washington Circus Round Three.

I think we can expect an 'updated' viability plan similar to the one submitted a couple months ago...no more, no less. Without intricate details, all I've got to go on is faith...and for all GM's failings -- I'm confident they'll pull this off.

Chrysler...they've almost died once, sold their soul a dozen times, make crappy products (imo), and are still around to talk about it. They don't seem to be able to die...I don't expect this time to be any different....for better or worse.:think:

Looks like the UAW is balking before the deadline and talks have ended. I hope they can work something out and pull out of this mess.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/02/14/news/companies/uaw_gm_talks.reut/index.htm?postversion=2009021417

There are all sorts of scenarios floating around, almost all of them involve Chapter 11.

One scenario has operations like Chevy, Cadillac, GM Powertrain, and some others, consolidating and forming a new company free of GM's baggage. All other assets to be liquidated.


I think GM stockholders will be left with nothing...

Any guess's on what GM's stock will do this week???

I'm thinking, MAJOR TANK.

I think alot of people are going to get rid of their GM stock, figuring something is better than nothing. I also think alot of people who are talking about Chapter 11, like it will be this great thing, that just washes all of the ugliness out of GM, and they will be back, better than ever, in 6 months............. are only fooling themselves. I see years of lawsuits in their future.

Any guess's on what GM's stock will do this week???

I'm thinking, MAJOR TANK.

I think alot of people are going to get rid of their GM stock, figuring something is better than nothing. I also think alot of people who are talking about Chapter 11, like it will be this great thing, that just washes all of the ugliness out of GM, and they will be back, better than ever, in 6 months............. are only fooling themselves. I see years of lawsuits in their future.


Well, I for one bought a bunch of GM stock when it was $60+ per share, and bought more at $30 per share. What's it now? About 3 bucks? Personally, I'm not selling jack.

I agree with you though. Chapter 11 won't be clean or easy. But I think GM might be out of options.

OTOH, this year will be a bloodbath for the auto industry, especially if projections for a 9 million unit year come true. EVERYONE will lose money. Maybe this is a good time for the radical restructering which only Chapter 11 will allow - because it's certain GM will lose billions in '09 one way or the other.

Any guess's on what GM's stock will do this week???

I'm thinking, MAJOR TANK.

I think alot of people are going to get rid of their GM stock, figuring something is better than nothing. I also think alot of people who are talking about Chapter 11, like it will be this great thing, that just washes all of the ugliness out of GM, and they will be back, better than ever, in 6 months............. are only fooling themselves. I see years of lawsuits in their future.

It will take more than 6 months to come out of Chapter 11 (if ever) but the process will strip away the contract rights of everyone who would be inclined to sue GM, so years of future lawsuits probably won't happen. Absolutely everyone who has a claim against GM will line up for their share at the bankruptcy court.

One scenario has operations like Chevy, Cadillac, GM Powertrain, and some others, consolidating and forming a new company free of GM's baggage. All other assets to be liquidated.

GM needs to right size, the company you describe would be positioned well for the future. Would this new company still use the GM name?

Would this new company still use the GM name?

No idea.

It will take more than 6 months to come out of Chapter 11 (if ever) but the process will strip away the contract rights of everyone who would be inclined to sue GM, so years of future lawsuits probably won't happen. Absolutely everyone who has a claim against GM will line up for their share at the bankruptcy court.

Which in short, means the liquidation of the General Motors Corperation.

A certainty when the value of everything you have is less than the money you owe people.

As I said before, forget Chapter 11. Once we see Chapter 11, we're likely see things deteriorate quickly to Chapter 7, and what's left afterwards not only being foreign owned, but barely any bigger overall globally than Honda.

It will take more than 6 months to come out of Chapter 11 (if ever) but the process will strip away the contract rights of everyone who would be inclined to sue GM, so years of future lawsuits probably won't happen. Absolutely everyone who has a claim against GM will line up for their share at the bankruptcy court.

My talk about lawsuits has to do with the gest of the articles being written, about how GM will go about restructuring............... as in, splitting the company into two, and leaving one part with all the toxic assets, while the other basically is not affected.

On a thread in GMI, this is a huge discussion. One person who chimed in, was very familiar with BK law, and told how the above scenerio would play out.

Basically, if it is all done in a short period of time, it would be seen as fraud. Not only would there be lawsuit after lawsuit, but people involved in perpetuating said fraud, would risk going to prison.

Also, there was alot of discussion about franchise laws and contracts. Just because you are in BK, it does not automatically mean that all of your contracts are null and void, that the UAW will go away, and that franchisees will have no rights. This is also where the lawsuits could come from.

One scenario has operations like Chevy, Cadillac, GM Powertrain, and some others, consolidating and forming a new company free of GM's baggage. All other assets to be liquidated.What, with Buick's popularity and success in China? Sorry, but I just don't see it.

What, with Buick's popularity and success in China? Sorry, but I just don't see it.


Buick could stay in a Buick-Opel-Holden alignment.