Posted by Fbodfather on another forum:
(Spread the word!)

Tax Fairness for U.S. Auto Makers – The Wall Street Journal
December 16, 2008
Your Dec. 1 editorial "America's Other Auto Industry" questions whether taxpayers should provide temporary federal loans to American automakers, but conveniently ignores one fact: Our taxpayers already give huge sums of financial assistance to foreign car companies right here in the U.S.
As proposed, the requested bridge loans represent roughly $4 billion in assistance to U.S. auto makers, that is, the cost of a low-interest loan. With 240,000 employees spread among the three U.S. companies, that works out to less than $16,000 in temporary taxpayer assistance per job.
By contrast, foreign auto makers receive far more from U.S. taxpayers in various forms of government assistance. In Tennessee, for example, state and local authorities offered Volkswagen $577 million in lowered taxes and other benefits in exchange for the plants it is constructing, at a staggering cost of $288,000 per job created.
Similarly, Toyota is receiving $300 million in support for its plant in Texas, or $150,000 per job created. Alabama provided Hyundai, Toyota, Honda and Mercedes an average of $111,000 in incentives per job. The list goes on. Unlike the temporary assistance GM, Ford and Chrysler are seeking, in almost all the cases, U.S. taxpayer subsidies to foreign companies never need to be paid back.
Let's make sure to keep the discussion balanced. Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Mercedes, BMW, Kia and Hyundai already receive far more in permanent financial support from our own taxpayers than what the U.S. auto industry is seeking. Our own companies deserve equal consideration, no more, no less.
Stephen Collins
President
Automotive Trade Policy Council
Washington

 

Yet another aspect that gets little to no attention.

 

Oh Jesus, not this line of sh*t again. The domestics never get any similar tax breaks, right?

GM tax break package is state's biggest since '93

July 29, 2008

Keating signs bill giving GM tax break

Mar 3, 2000

Flint OKs tax breaks to lure GM's Volt engine production

August 25, 2008

Ford gets tax breaks for Louisville plants

October 31, 2008

Ford to Invest in Plants and Get Tax Breaks

December 23, 2006

And this one is particularly sickening:

Ford Takes a Tax Holiday for 'Jobs Creation'

January 24, 2006

This doesn't account for any federal programs, such as the very lucrative R&D tax credit.

 

Seriously, I'm getting sick of the berating of people on here that don't agree with the bailout, it doesn't make you un-American to not support he bailout. Nobody made the Big 3 neglect their passenger car market the past 15 years, but they were all too happy to cash in on the SUV and truck craze in order to make a quick buck instead of looking into the future. Toyota sells just as many cars as GM yet they can make money and GM can't? What is the problem preventing GM from making money? Once they can figure that out maybe more people might support this thing but right now we know they're gonna be right back in a few months asking for more. Don't blame the Southern senators form Alabama, Kentucky, South Carolina, etc.... they didn't run one of the greatest American companies into the ground. At least Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, Kia, are all building plants or expanding in this country. GM, Ford, and Chrysler seem to be sending more and more to Mexico so it's not sa cut and dry as everyone wants to believe. Yes I think we should help the Big 3 but most people on this board seem to want to attack anyone who doesn't tow the line and that's just wrong. And as for the "you bailed out the banks line of BS", just because you did something wrong once doesn't mean you should keep doing it. Everyone gets the mentality that they should be next and it never stops. How much of every car sold goes to pay for benefits? I heard $4k but I'm not sure of the real number but it's gonna be hard to compete with that kind of legacy cost. I bet the Big 3 are gonna be pushing hard for universal health care so they can push the costs off to you and me.

 

Tax breaks for a group of jobs that support a foreign company that provides a relative handful of American jobs vs tax breaks for a group of jobs that support a domestic company that provides a huge amount of American jobs.

 

im getting sick of the automakers begging for handouts like little puppy dogs. yea the economy's down the ****ter right now, but find a way to make it work. thats what ford's doing. u don't see them down on their knees telling their Congressmen whatever they wanna hear for a reward. the successful companies are the ones that can solve problems and stay on their feet. the companies that don't know what to do or mismanage themselves fall apart. such is capitalism. deal with it

 

That is hilarious. You say 15 years and quick buck in the same line of logic!?

Why SHOULDN'T they have made trucks and SUV's?!?!? Good Lord.

 

You realize that if GM and probably even Chrysler "fall apart" that the way Ford will have to "deal with it" is very likely that they will "fall apart" too, right?

 

So what ?


Foreign companies get subsidies and incentives ? Ok, good. Government is offering money and incentives to encourage growth and expansion of profitable companies. The governments investment in these companies encourages expansion with job creation and other improvements on the state and community level.

Thats whats called a GOOD investment ! The government and tax payer are getting a return on this.

The big three get there own assistance as well. Heck, UAW and the Big three are repeat Democrat contributors. They have millions invested in there own special interests. They are not without power and lobbying like anyone else.
It's not an issue of fairness, never was.

 

I didn't say they shouldn't have built those vehicles but they neglected their passenger car line in order to divert resources to the cash cows. Hows that working out for them now?

 

So, in your line of thinking, they should not have put extra resources into something that was making them lots of money!?!

If you think that not putting quite so much money into trucks and SUV's int he past would make a huge difference in today's situation, I'd argue you are qrong. I can't prove that because I can't change the past, but nothing would be different, IMO.

It's all about perception, and not the actual product. I will always point back to the old Chevy/Geo Prizm quality ratings vs the Toyota Corolla quality ratings of that era. The Chevy/Geo got blasted for problems (and rightfully so), the identical Corolla got a pass on the exact same problems. This has been discussed here before years and years ago.

 

Yes I know all about the old Geo Prizm fiasco, but that still doesn't make it right to neglect your passenger cars for years without updates. Anyone that thinks a Cavalier and a Civic were built to the same standard is delusional. As for American cars that's about all I have ever had and ever really wanted but they did take advantage of our loyalty for years with sub par vehicles, I'm actually looking in to getting a Cobalt SS sedan i the next few months if GM stays afloat because it has a good build and reputation for cheap speed.

 

I'll never say that there were not mistakes made, but, in general, imported nameplates get much bigger passes on problems than domestics.

Imported vehicles have issues too, but the general public perceive them as flawless and perfect.

Fact is, just about ANY car from ANY manufacturer today is incredibly reliable and of good or better quality.

 

Is the bailout really going to save jobs. It didn't in the financial industry. I got laid off from the Wells Fargo auto division in August and have not found a job yet for even 1/2 my old pay. My severence package ran out in Oct and unemployment is not getting the job done. Everyday you read the paper or watch the news and another Bank or Financial company is laying off. Citibank laying off 53,000, Bank of America 35,000 and they all received bailout money. I am lusting over a new Challenger r/t in red with a 6 speed but myself and the millions of others out of work can't buy any car foreign or domestic. Detroit is building some of the best and most exciting cars ever but millions out of work can't buy anthing.

 

That is true today, GM and Ford quality is just as good if not better than anyone else out there, unfortunately next to your house a car is your second biggest purchase and when someone lays down $30k+ they're making an ivestment in the next few years and when one company has had issues in the past and the other really hasn't which one are they gonna buy. I think one of the biggest reasons people buy foreign cars now is because of the resale value holding better on foreign over domestic. I've traded in domestic vehicles and foreign and I can tell you from personal experience I had much less depreciation with the foreign. to me Toyota has about the worst quality right now of anyone.