is a 455 outa the question?

so i got a 1987 z28 camaro with a 86 chev malibu 305 5spd and im looking to build up a new engine.. in a previous post i mentioned a 350 and got estimated around $3800 CDN..

since i am in a quest for power, is a 455 to much? im not trying to make a dragster here, it's going to be a car i will drive daily (somewhat) and take to the track here and there. but not to much abuse. i just want raw power, something that can give a new z06 a run for its money.

and for those experiance fellas.. how fast in the 1/4 mile would i get with a 350 and a 455?

would i have to get a new diferential if i went with the 455?

constructive input is welcome

thanks,

smokey :bow:

small blocks rule:bow: :metal:

is it out of the question... no. would i advise it.. not really. I have seen a few 3rd gens with BBC's in them.. 454 @ 502's mainly. it can be done, but i beleive u have to do alot of suspention work to that front end so it can handle the extra weight, plus u will need a new hood *sowl hood* cause more then likely that BBC ur looking at is carbed so the aircleaner wont fit. ur best bet is to do some sort of 350. 350, 355, 377, 383, ect. if u want the cubes *and have a bit more $ to spend*do a 400 or 406. if u have money to blow just do a SBC 422 or 427.. or hell, buy a C5R block and go from there.

anywho.. as far as 1/4 mile times.. it all depends on how u build each motor, traction, ect. there are alot of different things that play 1 main roll. a good rule of thumb i use for how much HP an engine can take n/a is to use 1:1. ie 350 cu in engine can make 350 hp. a 400 cu in can make 400 hp. granted u can prob get more hp out of the engine (i use a max of 1:1.3) but thats what i use to guestimate till i get a dyno sheet done. *sorry got off topic* im not sure of ur age or income amount. but when i got my iroc at 17 i wanted the best of the best. but $$ wasnt there. so when my 305 went out i put ur basic 300 hp 350. it was ok.. till 1 day my tranny went out on the freeway and threw itself into 1st gear at 65 mph. *but thats another story* so u may want to look at maybe some GM crate ZZx motor and if u have TPI put it on the ZZx motor, because they are pretty chep engines and i beleive the zz4 engines have like 330 hp. so that be enough hp to play with stock and then mod it out. when i went from my 190 hp 305 to a 300 hp 350 i thought it was doing 11's all day.. well the first day :) so u may just want to go that route.

if ur on AIM, IM me @ falcon978

I have a friend who put a mild 455 BUICK in his 86 Trans Am. Its a tight fit, but he hooked up everything including the air conditioning. The car can be changed back to the TPI 305 if he ever needs to do it. Nothing hacked or ruined. Fast? It runs high 11's consistently. Mild cam, no headers. free flowing 3" exhaust. He is running the 700r4. The suspension has been worked with a bit, I think he either has sub frame connectors or a lift kit set up. He has had a few people at the drags ask him if it was supercharged or NOS because its pretty quiet-and fast.

A Big Block Chevy would be 100 times easier. THe only part of the front suspension that needs to be replaced is the front springs. I have seen people fit Big-Blocks under stock hoods. IT would be a hell of alot cheaper than a BOP 455.

I dont know if you really ment 455 or if its a typo and you ment 454 but anyway I ll go with what you gave me.

First of all a 455 is NOT a big block. Its a Pontiac block or some call it a mid-block. And since you are trying to put it in a chevy you will prolly run into a few problems but it can be done. I belive the Pontiac wiring harness is on the oposite side that the Chevy one is on so you have to move that over, and other little diferences like that.

If you want to go big displacement just go pull a 454 out of an old truck or somehting and build that. In my experience old Pontiac motors like the 455 dont wind very high they are all torque monsters.

sorry for any confusion.. but i am going to go with a chevy big block, 454 i guess.. typed in the wrong thing, was looking at some pontiacs with 455 a couple min before i posted..

what kind of suspension work would be need to be done? i dont really care about getting a new hood. and i was thinking of doing some suspension work anyways. im guessing i would need stiffer springs and shocks?

what else?

thanks for the info so far

bump, wanna get some input regarding beefing up suspension.. do i really need to get a new hood? and how much can spring/shocks set me back?

what's going to happen if i leave the car as is (suspension wise) and drop in a 454?

the front end will sag a little... handling will be reduced too


now the ideal swap would be an aluminum big block... i think this weighs a few pounds less than an all iron smallblock
unfortunately these are a little hard to find and tend to be on the expensive side


also, keep in mind, the extra power and torque of a 454 is nice, but if you don't do any suspension mods, you will never hook up

if you really want to roast the tires off, but dont care about having much top end, you may want to look at a cadillac 500. there actually not much bigger that a 350, not too sore about the weight but definnitly a lot lighter than a BBC. there is a company that specialzes in the big inch cad motors. they make massive amounts of low end torque. i think it was hot rod i saw it in, this guy had one in a 1st gen, the thing was "only" making like 300-350 horse but had like 600 foot pounds at like 1800 rpm. crazy. youd definitlly be different. just make sure you can afford tires for it :)

i really wanna go with a bbc 454.. probably bore it out and raise the compression 9:1 or 10:1.. and id get suspension mods for sure.. but what things should i look at replacing the most (suspension wise)?

i only got so much $ i wanna dump into the engine, and im thinking of i go with a bbc i will get more power outa it after my done up 350.. after all, there is no replacement for displacement :metal:

for starters should i just get heavy springs and stronger front shocks? eventually id replace all steering components and struts maybe

not really sure about that. probally just stiffer springs and struts. from what ive heard and read putting a BBC in a 3rd gen is almost bolt in.

sweet, thats what i like to here.. almost a bolt on :metal:

but i have a major concern about the transmission... i dunno exactly what type.. but its a 5spd that came with a 1986 chev malibu 305... do i need a new tranny? i know i'll probably need a new clutch with all the extra torque

Dont sell the BOP or Buick, Olds, Pontiac 455 engines short. They are great performers and respond to hot rodding as well as any motor. I am not recommending the Buick 455. I just stated that my friends car has the 455, looks like a factory installation, and runs 11's. Big Buicks are cheap at the junk yards. Big Chevys are not. There are other bulletin boards out there that offer lots of information on various engines, from the ricers to American iron. Dont be close minded, take the time to look around a bit.

One more note, the Buick 455 weighs about 80 pounds more than a Chevy small block. What suspension rework....? Move the battery to the trunk for some balance. A glass hood. Etc...

^i agree
a BBC isn't that much more heavy either

but better springs would help
if you are going the big block route, i suggest looking into some fat tires for the back... drag radials would be great
also look at getting a built up T5 or T56... better a T56 because the extra overdrive gear will really save fuel

how much power do you want to be making?

Originally posted by l_bilyk
^i agree
a BBC isn't that much more heavy either

but better springs would help
if you are going the big block route, i suggest looking into some fat tires for the back... drag radials would be great
also look at getting a built up T5 or T56... better a T56 because the extra overdrive gear will really save fuel

how much power do you want to be making?

i am going to get some sticky rubber for the rear for sure.. how much could i expect to get a decent t56 tranny for? those are 5spd right?

i just went to Canadian Tire and asked them how much some heavy springs would be.. buddy said $280 CDN for fully adjustable coilovers.. he said i could raise the front a bit... keep it the way it is.. or lower the car..

i don't really have a set mind for power right now.. but id would be nice to be running 12s.. or pretty close.. i dunno how much stock hp/tq a chev 454 has.. anyone know for sure? i know making power with a 454 wont be a hard job by raising compression.. cams, full exhaust, etc

my neighbor has an 86 Z28 with a 454 BB, 4 speed Muncie, and 273's in the rear and it sure rapes my car!! I can't wait till I see what it does in the quarter.

A big block Chevy only weighs around 100 pounds more than a small block, there would be no need for different springs or shocks. Hell how many of you guys have removed a hundred pounds from under the hood of your car? Did you go out and buy lighter springs??? The stiffer springs with a big block is and old wives tale.

As for the 455 Buick with a TH700R4 behind it, did he use an adaptor plate or just hold it together with the only two bolts that line up in comparision to a Chevy and BOP tranny pattern???

Smokey Z28, if you have the time and money to do it right I'd say go for it if you want to put the big block in, I've seen it done and it is kind of neat. Myself I'll just stick to wingin small blocks.

Martin

Ok where to begin

First off no one said that the 455's are junk. They may be cheaper coming out of a junkyard but parts for them are considerably more than a BBC.

My friend swapp in a BBC 396 from a SBC 305 in his MOnte Carlo with new springs. The front end sagged considerably more than with the SB and the suspension was all over the place when he takes corners.

OH an no T-5 tranny will handle a BB. A built T-56 would have more of a chance.

I seen a GTA with a 455 in it in a magazine a couple years back. Hot Rod?

T5 - 4 speed + 1 overdrive
T56 - 4 speed + 2 overdrive gears (which is ideal if you have a huge engine or really tall gearing)

whereabouts are you located? i've seen slightly used T56s go for 3 - 4 grand
it may seem like alot for a tranny... but keep in mind these babies will handle alot of power... that is why they are used in pretty much every single flagship sports car from an american company

Originally posted by l_bilyk
T5 - 4 speed + 1 overdrive
T56 - 4 speed + 2 overdrive gears (which is ideal if you have a huge engine or really tall gearing)

whereabouts are you located? i've seen slightly used T56s go for 3 - 4 grand
it may seem like alot for a tranny... but keep in mind these babies will handle alot of power... that is why they are used in pretty much every single flagship sports car from an american company

holy **** that's alot.. i can't afford that :mad:
i live in kelowna, bc

I don't know about 3 or 4 grand. I got mine with everything for $1500. My buddy got one with everything delivered to his house for $1300 w/everything needed aside from the crossmember. I don't know how much that comes to in Canadian but just call around some local junkyards.

hmm i suppose if you hunt around you can find it for less
but i know a guy who went through a few of these, and it cost him about $3000 can. a pop
i think that might have included installation but i am not sure

just remember guys hes talking canadian. not too sure on the exchange rate as of late but its usually arould 1.5 to 2 to the dollar. that means 3000 can is around 2000-1500 american. sounds pretty average to me.

Ok i just went down the hole road of doing this.....for the front end u just got replace the srpings u can get them thro summit. who ever said u need all kinds of other stuff is hitten the pipe. u will need a set of headers to fit that they r like 480$ outa summit. if u got a good big block that throw out some crazy hp get a good turbo 400 to back it and a 12 bolt rear. You will need some type of ram air hood and a 3 row radiator to keep it cool. comon sense u will put frame connectors in. and it whould help to put in a roll cage. for you 454 u will need a 68 chevelle oil pan to clear the cross member. i got a 650hp 427 i was gona drop in mine but it whould have shreded my turbo 350 to pices and my 10bolt rear whould be history.

whiteminqua I still want to know how your buddy connected a 455 Buick with a BOP pattern to a TH700-R4??? Did he use an adaptor plate or just use two bolts to connect engine to tranny? I think I am smeeling a little BS

Martin

Hey, its common knowledge. You need an adapter for the 700r4 to be used with the BOP engines. I think Mike used one from TCI.

Mike has over 30 years of Buick performance experience and knows how to make a 455 run. The installation in the Trans AM is tight, and he had to use the factory cast iron exhaust manifolds.

If you really want specific information, I am willing to forward an email from you if you want. :D

The big Buicks make lots of torque. The GS 455 had 510 ft. lbs. of torque in 1970. A stock GS can easily run low 14 second times with no problem. (At about 4100+ lbs. of steel) My brother had a restified 71 GSX that ran 12.90s on street tires, through the mufflers, no headers-stock appearing motor.

If I was ever to put a big block in my 86 IROC, it would be a 454 Chevy. Its a common engine, lots of parts available, and the swap has been documented over and over. There is a ton of information out there. But, thats what makes cars and hot rodding so much fun. Lots of spins on the same ideas. GO FASTER.

Have fun. And by the way, its not BS, its just the truth.