Oil companies conspiring to kill diesel powered cars? MB exec thinks so.......

........ and the evidence may prove he's actually right!

(Old timers here might remember the writer's name :) )

Mercedes exec says Big Oil conspiring to kill U.S. diesel market
Michael Taylor. (Leftlane News June 10th)

Mercedes-Benz has accused profiteering oil companies of ripping off diesel buyers and fears such action may kill the U.S. diesel passenger car market in its infancy. While oil prices have hit new highs, the pump price of diesel has surged to be more than a dollar a gallon higher than gasoline in some U.S. states, even though it is cheaper and less energy intensive to produce.


And Mercedes-Benz, which introduced its E320 BlueTEC diesel passenger car into the U.S. in 2006, is fighting back, with Daimler board member, Dr Thomas Weber, insisting there was no demand-driven reason for diesel prices to be so high.

“We knew this surge was coming in the U.S.,” Dr Weber, who heads up the Mercedes-Benz Research and Development division, told Leftlane.

“I believe there is definitely optimization of earnings by oil companies to take advantage of the higher usage of diesel today. There is not another plausible or economic explanation.”

While diesel sales are up in Europe, the economic downturn has lowered volumes in the U.S., where it is primarily a heavy transport fuel.

Even so, the U.S. Government’s Energy Information Administration reveals that diesel users have suffered more than double the gas price rises in the last year. Once cheaper, diesel is now significantly more expensive than gas everywhere in the United States.

The EIA’s data shows that while gas costs 443 cents a gallon in California, diesel there costs 499.2 cents and, in a nationwide trend, it is 72 cents more expensive on the East Coast and 63 cents more expensive in the Mid West.

While gasoline has risen 113 cents a gallon in California in the last 12 months, diesel has surged by 199.5 cents in the same period and its pump price surge has outstripped gasoline by 95.7 cents on the East Coast and 95.3 cents in the Mid West.

“The most important driver is a huge trend in diesel use in Europe, but that doesn’t explain it,” Dr Weber insisted.

“There are limitations on capacity on the refining sites, but that’s not it, either, really.

“Diesel production costs are less than the gasoline production costs so the only idea you can find is that these companies are in the business of making a profit, so that is what they do now.”

The EIA’s pump price breakdowns seem to confirm Mercedes-Benz’s allegations. While the cost of the basic crude oil accounts for 73 percent of the pump price of gasoline, it only accounts for 61 percent of the diesel price.

Instead, the EIA figures show oil companies are slugging diesel buyers by more than double diesel’s refining costs compared to gasoline. Only 10 percent of the gasoline price is in refining, while that figure leaps to 21 percent for diesel.

Nevertheless, Dr Weber predicted the massive gap between gasoline and diesel prices in the U.S., Australia and Europe would soon come to an end and, even in the meantime, they would not affect Daimler’s upcoming plans to hit the U.S. market in force with its diesel engines.

“For the customer, if they experience the advantages of diesel, they will stay with diesel anyway,” he insisted.

“The technology is 20 to 30 percent more efficient than gasoline and has more torque at lower rpm and that’s what most buyers actually use.”

Benz will launch BlueTEC diesel versions of its R-, GL and ML-class SUVs in October after receiving 50-state registration approval for the technology in March this year.

Diesel is the quickest, easiest, and most painless way to increase automobile fuel economy. Up to 30% according to most estimates.

That's with "right-now" technology, that's cheaper than Hybrids, and less likely to make farmers choose to sell thier crops as food or fuel.

Diesel is $5.09 in New York...

Last I heard Mickey T was over in Italy?

Anyway, just shows how powerful BIG OIL is, if even the best known automobile brand in the world is accusing them of foul play.

Now if only GM became a supplier of Hydrogen fuel and an energy competitor...

You already know how I feel about this topic...


Here's some interesting reading from the lounge...
http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/showthread.php?t=615001

It moved me so much that I finally made my first post in the lounge in my 8 years of being a member on this board.
Does THAT say anything?!?! I did say things there that I would not in this forum - using the more informal setting at an advantage.

In short - Yes - they are fleecing us. :(
Can the next pres do anything about it? That's the $1-million question.

That's with "right-now" technology, that's cheaper than Hybrids, and less likely to make farmers choose to sell thier crops as food or fuel.

I agree with your sentiments overall, but you don't think that widespread diesel adoption in the U.S. won't make some producers look toward turning their soybeans into biodiesel rather than cattle feed?

I continue to stand behind my previous statements. Hybrids are a gimmick and diesel (particularly biodiesel) is a better long term solution.

As consummers we need to demand more improved diesel powered cars and as voters we need to demand that the government step in a regulate the oil industry.

“I believe there is definitely optimization of earnings by oil companies to take advantage of the higher usage of diesel today. There is not another plausible or economic explanation.”

Does anyone else find it odd that Mercedes-Benz is calling out another company for raising prices in order to make a profit? Wow.

I continue to stand behind my previous statements. Hybrids are a gimmick and diesel (particularly biodiesel) is a better long term solution.


All depends on one's driving style. The majority of commuters drive less than 40 miles and 1.2 hours each day, which points to an average speed of around 35 MPH. That makes a compelling argument for a hybrid, with start/stop architectures working best at lower prices and fancier "strong" solutions (like Toyota HSD and GM Two Mode) becoming economical at prices in the $5-6 range.

If you drive a mile, hop on the expressway, and then drive 40 miles at 70 MPH - like my wife does everyday - then a diesel is certainly the right option.

Make fuel expensive enough (or the vehicle big enough), and a diesel/hybrid powertrain will eventually look attractive. That's a ways off for passenger cars and light trucks, but there are people working on it.

They are in fact charging whatever they want for diesel just because they can. The bigger question was why weren't they charging that much for it back in the day?

All depends on one's driving style. The majority of commuters drive less than 40 miles and 1.2 hours each day, which points to an average speed of around 35 MPH. That makes a compelling argument for a hybrid, with start/stop architectures working best at lower prices and fancier "strong" solutions (like Toyota HSD and GM Two Mode) becoming economical at prices in the $5-6 range.

If you drive a mile, hop on the expressway, and then drive 40 miles at 70 MPH - like my wife does everyday - then a diesel is certainly the right option.

Make fuel expensive enough (or the vehicle big enough), and a diesel/hybrid powertrain will eventually look attractive. That's a ways off for passenger cars and light trucks, but there are people working on it.

Let me clarify. I'm not saying hybrid technology doesn't act as a fair mileage extender. What I am saying is suggesting that it is greener than other technologies out there (like biodiesel) and is saving the planet is a gimmick at best.

Here in northern California, many Prius drivers use their cars to commute to San Francisco on a daily basis. Most of them use highways to get there (which means they're not in electric mode), and travel as single occupants, but have special stickers from the State that allow them to use HOV lanes and cross toll bridges into San Francisco for FREE. Gimmick.

...allow them to use HOV lanes ...

I know several areas where that is *not* the case.

The powertrain add-on for a BAS system versus a full hybrid or a dual-mode hybrid is obviously dramatically different. In terms of crunching numbers, usability, or saving the environment, a good diesel makes a *lot* of sense.

A small diesel is going to be simpler, cheaper, more reliable, have more torque, trunk space, and probably be lighter as well- than a full hybrid gasoline engine. Better mpg? That is also possible.

A BAS on a diesel might really have some advantages, as diesels and idling is bad mojo.

You already know how I feel about this topic...


Here's some interesting reading from the lounge...
http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/showthread.php?t=615001

It moved me so much that I finally made my first post in the lounge in my 8 years of being a member on this board.
Does THAT say anything?!?! I did say things there that I would not in this forum - using the more informal setting at an advantage.

In short - Yes - they are fleecing us. :(
Can the next pres do anything about it? That's the $1-million question.

Very interesting. Lindsey Williams' website went offline, his reason given was that he's retiring. His video was pulled from Google. They were also pulled from YouTube just as I was downloading it... I managed to get just 4 out of 8 videos.

Found another website which hosts his video in full still, and managed to rip it (Firefox + DownloadHelper plugin), here:

http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/videos/LindseyWilliams.html

Have not watched it completely yet, but read about it in the thread from the lounge.

I think it's foolish not to think that certain powers control the playing field, and I have been reading up on / following NWO. Very interesting information from your post.

They are in fact charging whatever they want for diesel just because they can. The bigger question was why weren't they charging that much for it back in the day?

I was betting on the fact that before USLD, the US's diesel quality was laughably the worst in the western hemisphere, if not among the worst in the world.

You have to pay for that upgrade somehow and sometimes quick upgrades are a painful bullet to swallow...

I've been saying for years, ever since I saw the price of diesel higher than regular gas, that this is done on purpose. Diesel is consistently cheaper in Europe, and coupled with better fuel economy of diesel vehicles results in diesel vehicles operating at about 50% of gasoline counterparts.

If you buy a diesel vehicle here, the operating advantage goes to about 0-10%, and the additional cost of the diesel engine is not really worth it.

I watched the video in its entirety last night...

Some things I already suspected... like the US waging war on Iraq was as a result of Saddam reverting to selling oil in Euro. I've already posted links regarding this so I won't go there again.

What I didn't "know" about was...

- the invasion of Kuwait was a set up (Bush Snr encouraging Saddam to invade Kuwait... only to have 'valid' reason to declare war on Iraq).

- the oil already discovered on the north slope of Alaska (which would be enough to supply the US for over 200yrs) is known to a few people and is now classified information. On that subject, I learned a few things about oil discovery - like measurements taken in depth, pressure etc... to gauge an estimate of how much oil is apparently available. :)

- that it costs $5/gallon for the Saudis to bring the oil to surface, while it was estimated that it would only cost $3/gallon for the US to bring the Alaskan oil to surface. This figure does not include transportation costs, as stated in the video.

Enough of the summary, what the video seems to highlight is that oil is definitely not a scarce resource as some would have you believe. The real issue is about paying off America's debt, which is hardly news to some.

Very interesting. Lindsey Williams' website went offline, his reason given was that he's retiring. His video was pulled from Google. They were also pulled from YouTube just as I was downloading it... I managed to get just 4 out of 8 videos.

Found another website which hosts his video in full still, and managed to rip it (Firefox + DownloadHelper plugin), here:

http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/videos/LindseyWilliams.html

Have not watched it completely yet, but read about it in the thread from the lounge.

I think it's foolish not to think that certain powers control the playing field, and I have been reading up on / following NWO. Very interesting information from your post.

Thanks for the comment.
I take all that stuff with a grain of salt. I have honestly not found ANYONE who simply stood up and told the truth about anything that they are trying to "promote". They can either overstate the facts in their favor, or understate the ones against their position, or even choose to leave out facts that discredit them alltogether. None are "lies" per-se, but IMO it's not much different than a lie. So I try to find the shred of truth in whatever IS being said and there is typically one there somewhere - it's just our job to have the BS-detector tuned in so well that we can spot the real message. :yes:

I'll never get into my views on the NWO, IMF, World Bank, Federal Reserve, and conspiracy theories that surround them all. This is not the place or the forum. But I will certainly invite anyone who is unhappy with the trends we have seen in the last several years to do their own research with an open mind. It's something that can consume you completely if you are passionate about civics and human rights, so beware if/when you start!

Back to the topic. How 'bout them $137 barrels of oil today, eh?!?! :cool:

And yes - what about MB accusing someone else of making a profit?!?! (good one!)

What conspiracy PP? Some of it is fact...



Presidency

Traditionally, the Bank President has always been a U.S. citizen nominated by the president of the United States, the largest shareholder in the bank. The nominee is subject to confirmation by the Board of Governors, to serve for a five-year, renewable term.[1] Also traditionally, the International Monetary Fund's Managing Director is nominated by its European governors.[1]

[edit] Current President

On May 30, 2007, US President George W. Bush nominated former deputy secretary of state Robert Zoellick to succeed Paul Wolfowitz as President of the World Bank. The Executive Directors unanimously approved Zoellick, effective July 1, 2007, as the 11th President of the Bank for a five-year term.[3] Robert Zoellick is the former Deputy Secretary of the U.S. State Department and the former Chairman of Goldman Sachs' Board of International Advisors. He graduated magna *** laude from Harvard Law School and Phi Beta Kappa from Swarthmore College.[4]

...

The World Bank is supposedly working against corruption both outside and within its organisation. Its website states:

Recognizing that any program to assist in controlling corruption worldwide needs to start with the example of best practices at home, the Bank has taken initiatives to stamp out conflicts of interest and any possible corrupt practices among its own staff.[3]

Beginning in 2005, Paul Wolfowitz, President of the World Bank, allegedly used his position to influence a pay and grade increase for his girlfriend Shaha Riza. Riza, who had held a position at the bank before Wolfowitz was appointed president in June 2005, was required to leave the bank and re-assigned to the State Department to avoid a conflict of interest, working in the office of Liz Cheney, daughter of Dick Cheney, while remaining on the bank's payroll. Her salary was increased from nearly $133,000 to tax-free compensation of $180,000, and eventually reached $193,590 after subsequent raises. The panel concluded that the salary increase "at Mr. Wolfowitz's direction" was "in excess of the range" allowed under bank rules. As a result of this controversy, Paul Wolfowotz has resigned effective June 30, 2007.[citations needed]

Further information: Shaha Riza#Wolfowitz Scandal, Paul Wolfowitz#Wolfowitz's relationship with Shaha Riza, and Paul Wolfowitz#Wolfowitz's leadership of the World Bank.

The World Bank head of "Institutional Integrity" department is Suzanne Folsom. She is the wife of George Folsom who is the President of the International Republican Institute and a personal friend of Paul Wolfowitz. According to the Financial Times her appointment as "a person close to Mr Wolfowitz, and with a political background...to a unit that was seen as independent of the president’s office since it was set up in 2001" was met with great concern by some senior staff. Wolfowitz's efforts to control the bank are seen by some senior staff to have led to "a lack of consultation by Mr Wolfowitz’s advisers, and an atmosphere of suspicion."[11]

[edit] Criticism

The World Bank has long been criticized by a range of non-governmental organizations and academics, notably including its former Chief Economist Joseph Stiglitz, who is equally critical of the International Monetary Fund, the US Treasury Department, and US and other developed country trade negotiators.[12] Critics argue that the so-called free market reform policies – which the Bank advocates in many cases – in practice are often harmful to economic development if implemented badly, too quickly ("shock therapy"), in the wrong sequence, or in very weak, uncompetitive economies.[13]



Ahhh yes, back on topic. M-B complaining about not making enough profits given its maker of prestige cars... Well if M-B is complaining, then GM, Ford etc... are nearing the end.

I watched the video in its entirety last night...

Some things I already suspected... like the US waging war on Iraq was as a result of Saddam reverting to selling oil in Euro. I've already posted links regarding this so I won't go there again.

invading Iran seems like it would be an acid test for the video, certainly making it harder to ignore what Williams has said.

A few points he mentioned really hit home... and it's something I've never considered in detail, until now.

Just about everything we consume is the byproduct of oil...

- plastic
- bitumen
- pharmaceuticals
- shoes
- etc...

Therefore, driving your car every second weekend instead of every weekend does little to conserve gas. The increased cost hits you everywhere you go. If the cost of bitumen has doubled in line with the cost of crude over the past 18 months, what does that do for your taxes? It's not too hard to work out.

And I haven't mentioned the increased cost of transporting abovementioned items.

What conspiracy PP? Some of it is fact...


You're just scratching the surface my friend... you REALLY don't want to get me started on this subject. ;)

You're just scratching the surface my friend... you REALLY don't want to get me started on this subject. ;)

Given we see eye to eye on this very issue, I'm hoping you'd chime in with some of your usual, highly regarded material.

Seriously, if an M-B representative starts "complaining" about fuel/oil related issues, there's something tragic happening in this world, methinks. M-B is at the forefront of automotive technology... it takes a back seat to nobody.

So I'm about 70% done through the video... Very interesting, and eye-opening. I suggest for people to watch it.

This guy was saying that oil would hit $4-5 per gallon, months before it happened, yet he spoke with conviction that it was already planned.

Very interesting too about Iraq invasion of the 1990s. It made complete sense - why single out Saddam? Because of his atrocities in Kuwait? There were and are rulers who committed worse crimes, yet the US never invaded them. What about recent Sudan? How he reveals (claims) that it was a set-up just makes a lot of sense.

The high cost of oil is just the beginning of the massive changes we'll face in our lifetime -it will be interesting to see where it goes and how it gets there :)

I'm not much for conspiracy theories, and won't bother with a "NwO" video. But the idea that Saddam was "set up" for the gulf war was a subject of mainstream reporting.

Did anyone read about Iran trying to set up its own burse? It was supposed to go live this past February, I wonder what happened to it... Apparently, they had been trying to make it go live several times, unsuccessfully.

As for the video, NWO is not in it. Lindsey Williams just talks about Alaska oil field discovery, and alleged cover up, as well as how the market is manipulated. Whether it's true or not, or to what extent, I don't know, obviously, but it is rather an interesting watch.

I'm not much for conspiracy theories, and won't bother with a "NwO" video. But the idea that Saddam was "set up" for the gulf war was a subject of mainstream reporting.

The video we are speaking about has NOTHING in it about the NWO at all.
He refers to the links that the World Bank and IMF have in oil, but never mentions the NWO - that was ME. I can link the NWO into our government and the World Bank.

Regardless - you should watch the video - it's very interesting. I personally do not agree with 100% of what the man says, but I do find common ground with many of his points.

Well, I watched about 5 minutes of it. I wonder how you guys would feel if some guy said he was buddies with GM executives and claimed "they" were trying to keep a 100MPG Carburetor under wraps? Because that sort of magic-bullet speculation is what it seemed like to me.

Besides, all the best conspiracies take place in plain sight ;)

Well, I watched about 5 minutes of it. I wonder how you guys would feel if some guy said he was buddies with GM executives and claimed "they" were trying to keep a 100MPG Carburetor under wraps? Because that sort of magic-bullet speculation is what it seemed like to me.

Besides, all the best conspiracies take place in plain sight ;)
Believe what you want mister. Just because your eyes are wide shut doesn't mean we can't discuss the probability that the story could well be fact.

If an oil bourse were to be introduced, what would be the pros and cons wrt oil prices?

I watched the video in its entirety last night...

Some things I already suspected... like the US waging war on Iraq was as a result of Saddam reverting to selling oil in Euro. I've already posted links regarding this so I won't go there again.

What I didn't "know" about was...



Old conspiracy stuff....

Of course, you can't prove a negative, so this stuff festers out there.

There are plenty of acknowledged reasons for the attack on Iraq (that in hindsight seem even worse), but none of them have to do with selling oil in Euros.

Believe what you want mister. Just because your eyes are wide shut doesn't mean we can't discuss the probability that the story could well be fact.
:rolleyes: Some of us just want to read about what cars the Illuminati are planning on building

If an oil bourse were to be introduced, what would be the pros and cons wrt oil prices?
AFAIK, the Iranian Oil Bourse is already in operation, so you're looking at it.

AFAIK, the Iranian Oil Bourse is already in operation, so you're looking at it.

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Oil_Bourse):

Currently the Kish Bourse is only trading in oil derived products, generally those used as feedstock for the plastics and pharmaceutical industries. However officially published statements by Oil Minister Gholamhossein Nozari indicate that the second phase, to establish trading in crude oil directly, which has been suggested might one day perhaps create a "Caspian Crude" benchmark price analogous to Brent Crude or WTI will only be started after the Bourse has demonstrated a reasonable period of trouble-free running.

There are plenty of acknowledged reasons for the attack on Iraq (that in hindsight seem even worse), but none of them have to do with selling oil in Euros.

It's not Iraq that they said is threatening to sell oil based on the Euro - it's IRAN - totally different scenario, and timing.

Study the conspiracy theories more carefully! :D

It's not Iraq that they said is threatening to sell oil based on the Euro - it's IRAN - totally different scenario, and timing.

Study the conspiracy theories more carefully! :D

I don't think I could bear to. :D

Back in 2003, people were saying that the real reason for the attack on Iraq was that Saddam was threatening to sell in Euros. Apparently now that's a good reason to attack Iran too :rolleyes:

It's not as if the real story looks any better.

:rolleyes: Some of us just want to read about what cars the Illuminati are planning on building


Oh believe me, I just wish we would be discussing cars only but the political climate has hijacked the threads we spent good time discussing as enthusiasts. It's also putting the whole car industry in jeopardy.

Unfortunately, whoever gets into power (US fed)m will be no different as both leaders are pledging alliances with Israel. That means more of the same BS and more pain at the pumps.