What's everyone's thoughts on the future?

There's a lot of hysteria atm wrt fuel prices and CAFE etc... (not to mention the depressing economy) it's forcing manufacturers to rethink their game plane for the next decade very, very carefully.

With news that GM are considering not marketing Camaro as a muscle car, I wonder what will happen to the muscle car in the near term? Will we still be driving V8s a mere decade from now? Will hybrids be dominating buyers' shopping lists? Will GM be able to readily adjust to the changing automotive climate?

Hybrids are going to be the muscle car of the future. An electrical motor offers 100% of its torque all of the time, and combined with a efficient turbo'd or supercharged 4-6 cyl, I think it's a very real possibility they can be made to be excellent performers.
I'm really not too worried about the economy. It goes, up, then it goes back down, it's a normal cycle. This downturn seems worse only because of the overly high highs we experienced, especially in real estate. There was no real reason real estate should have gone up 200%-300%, no supporting wage increases, no housing shortages, nothing. Much of it was rampant speculation (just like crude oil now) and emotionally based panic buying. Coupled with bad financial decisions, both by lenders and borrowers, and there was going to eventually be a crash. It will come back up, and the economy will recover.

Will we still be driving V8s a mere decade from now? Will hybrids be dominating buyers' shopping lists?

Unless you're wealthy, you will probably only be driving a V8 powered car that is old.

I think that turbocharged small displacement 4 cylinder engines will replace most of the 2.0L and larger 4 cylinder engines now common in C and CD class cars, and I think that hybrid versions of those small displacement turbos will replace most of the V6's now common in CD class cars.

I could see the V8's being replaced with V6 turbos and eventually V6 engines combined with hybrids or even turbocharged four cylinder engines combined around 2.3 to 2.5L combined with hybrids.

I think that the only cars with V8's will be Corvettes or premium Cadillacs and maybe Buicks. I think that sales of full size pickups and SUV's will be a fraction of what they are today and will mostly use V6 or V8 turbo diesels.

Cars will be more expensive, and, unless wages begin to increase again, most buyers will be pushed into B and C class cars.

Well, it looks really bad for GM unless they can churn out a new 1.4L or >1.4L motor that gets better mileage than the current E-TEC II in the Aveo.

From the forefront of the ecnobox battlefield, this is DAKMOR for NobodycaresIwantmyV8.

I think the federal gov't could make some ballsy trade law changes to bring some industry back and spending back here. Our eventual (i think) decrease in war spending should help out a bunch and thats still a big variable to me. Slowly withdraw from Iraq... balance out the international trading a little... and continue to cut petroleum use and we might be alright after all.

I think the federal gov't could make some ballsy trade law changes to bring some industry back and spending back here. Our eventual (i think) decrease in war spending should help out a bunch and thats still a big variable to me. Slowly withdraw from Iraq... balance out the international trading a little... and continue to cut petroleum use and we might be alright after all.

1. Trade law won't work. The US has now become one of the cheapest 1st world nations for manufacture due to the plunging dollar versus the rest of the world's currency. If that doesn't bring business to the US, legislation won't likely either.

2. $12 billion per month is going to Iraq. That's money going towards something that has no return (ie: roads or education) and by what's going on, no benefit to national security either. So basically, we're pouring money into a pit. That drags down the value of our currency because we are borrowing 100% of the cost for that war. That's what you and I are going to be paying back in taxes.... with intrest.

3. A large part of our trade deficit is due to our importing so much oil to feed that Tahoe that's everyone's god-given right (according to some here) to buy if we want to. When the dollar falls compared to other currencies, even if the world doesn't increase the price of oil, we see an increase because it takes more of our currency to buy it (as well as everything else imported). Meanwhile, the real value of what's made here decreases on the world market (again the falling dollar) making our goods cheap...... guess what that does to our trade deficit?? Yep..... It increases.

4. As far as petroleum usage, if we cut our useage to what we produce on our own (we're the 3rd largest producer) plus what we buy from Canada & Mexico (our biggest importers), we'd be OK security-wise. But given the volume of oil we use, that's far beyond impossible.


If that isn't enough to get you to worry about the immediate future in the US, how about inflation.

A falling dollar plus high imports alone equals inflation. Add in the explosive price of fuel (only in the US... the rest of the world the price of fuel is pretty stable!), Federal intrest rates cut to the dirt which in effect devalues money more, the fact that countries that originally purchased US dollars to help their own markets and to finance our debt are starting to dump US dollars (plunging it even more), and the trillion $$$ we tax payers are going to owe China when this Iraq BS is over, and we're looking at the potential of returning to 70s era double digit inflation.... only this time, fueled by a bit more than energy costs and a hangover from a war.

1. Trade law won't work. The US has now become one of the cheapest 1st world nations for manufacture due to the plunging dollar versus the rest of the world's currency. If that doesn't bring business to the US, legislation won't likely either.
I tend to agree with graham here. We ought to at least be able to tweak our laws and trade agreements, to make things a little more fair. Why are Japan's extreme trade barriers to our autos allowed to remain sky-high?
2. $12 billion per month is going to Iraq. That's money going towards something that has no return (ie: roads or education) and by what's going on, no benefit to national security either. So basically, we're pouring money into a pit. That drags down the value of our currency because we are borrowing 100% of the cost for that war. That's what you and I are going to be paying back in taxes.... with intrest.
A lot of people don't really understand what the free world is facing today. Our enemy in the mideast is not a rag-tag little crew of thugs who randomly blow things up. It's an international, widely funded political movement to undermine and destroy freedom. It's perhaps the biggest threat the US has faced since the Cold War. Cost? I don't care what the cost is. We have got to stop Islamo-fascist terrorism cold as a political movement and military strategy, or we're going to face a lot of future problems. I wish people would keep some perspective here. $12B per month? We lost much more national wealth in our Civil War... in stopping Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan in WW II... and stopping the march of Soviet aggression in the Cold War. Freedom has never been 'cheap'. The US lost 400,000 military personnel in WW II. Every loss was tragic, but every loss was necessary.
3. A large part of our trade deficit is due to our importing so much oil to feed that Tahoe that's everyone's god-given right (according to some here) to buy if we want to. When the dollar falls compared to other currencies, even if the world doesn't increase the price of oil, we see an increase because it takes more of our currency to buy it (as well as everything else imported). Meanwhile, the real value of what's made here decreases on the world market (again the falling dollar) making our goods cheap...... guess what that does to our trade deficit?? Yep..... It increases.

4. As far as petroleum usage, if we cut our useage to what we produce on our own (we're the 3rd largest producer) plus what we buy from Canada & Mexico (our biggest importers), we'd be OK security-wise. But given the volume of oil we use, that's far beyond impossible.
We have plenty of energy options right here in America. Massive coal reserves... oil off our coasts and in Alaska... and nuclear tech to name a few. All we are waiting for is the political will to stand up to the greenies and use our options. It's just a matter of time (likely 5-10 years) until the farce of man-made global warming is exposed and we become rational, logical users of our available national resources.
If that isn't enough to get you to worry about the immediate future in the US, how about inflation.

A falling dollar plus high imports alone equals inflation. Add in the explosive price of fuel (only in the US... the rest of the world the price of fuel is pretty stable!), Federal intrest rates cut to the dirt which in effect devalues money more, the fact that countries that originally purchased US dollars to help their own markets and to finance our debt are starting to dump US dollars (plunging it even more), and the trillion $$$ we tax payers are going to owe China when this Iraq BS is over, and we're looking at the potential of returning to 70s era double digit inflation.... only this time, fueled by a bit more than energy costs and a hangover from a war.
I'm frankly, sick of people counting America out. I'm sick of the doom and gloom preached daily by our predominantly liberal talking heads on network news. I'm sick of France, Germany and other countries we spilled huge amounts of blood for, whining and suing us and saying "Oh well. The magic is over for America." You know what? America has been thru a lot worse. 1780... 1864... 1942... 1979... 2001. Look up a little US history on those years. How did we make it thru those years? It's simple. Our Constitution is an amazing, precious blueprint for a decent, righteous society. We've figured out a way to succeed and prosper, like no other nation on Earth. I think we'll find our way out of our current trifling troubles :usa:

I'm frankly, sick of people counting America out. I'm sick of the doom and gloom preached daily by our predominantly liberal talking heads on network news. I'm sick of France, Germany and other countries we spilled huge amounts of blood for, whining and suing us and saying "Oh well. The magic is over for America." You know what? America has been thru a lot worse. 1780... 1864... 1942... 1979... 2001. Look up a little US history on those years. How did we make it thru those years? It's simple. Our Constitution is an amazing, precious blueprint for a decent, righteous society. We've figured out a way to succeed and prosper, like no other nation on Earth. I think we'll find our way out of our current trifling troubles :usa:

I couldn't agree more. It's hard to dicern weather a large portion of the population wants America to fall on it's face or they are just very pessimistic about the country, or if it is all for political power. That's pretty sad really.

Bicycle time

Well said BDF!

A "non-muscle car" Camaro and G8 that is rumored is a 260HP 2.0L DI Turbo out of the Solstice with an 8 speed automatic. I'd be very happy with that in my Camaro/G8.

Lutz has already said that a 1.6L + Turbo in the G8 could give the same performance as the current HF 3.6L V6 while giving 4-5 more MPG. (http://www.leftlanenews.com/pontiac-g8-to-use-four-cylinder-engine.html) Proof that all the crying about CAFE is over nothing.

I think the next few years are going to be very exciting. There are lots of new technology's coming out.

I'm frankly, sick of people counting America out. I'm sick of the doom and gloom preached daily by our predominantly liberal talking heads on network news. I'm sick of France, Germany and other countries we spilled huge amounts of blood for, whining and suing us and saying "Oh well. The magic is over for America." You know what? America has been thru a lot worse. 1780... 1864... 1942... 1979... 2001. Look up a little US history on those years. How did we make it thru those years? It's simple. Our Constitution is an amazing, precious blueprint for a decent, righteous society. We've figured out a way to succeed and prosper, like no other nation on Earth. I think we'll find our way out of our current trifling troubles :usa:

Numbers don't lie. You can wave a flag and blame the boogy man all you want but that won't fix the problems on our nations balance sheet.

Lutz has already said that a 1.6L + Turbo in the G8 could give the same performance as the current HF 3.6L V6 while giving 4-5 more MPG. (http://www.leftlanenews.com/pontiac-g8-to-use-four-cylinder-engine.html) Proof that all the crying about CAFE is over nothing.

A 240hp+ I4 with a serious transmission *might* feel pretty good, but it would take some getting used to.

But for another 4-5mpg, its *certainly* worth a shot. :)

My 240hp GTP has more than enough power to get me into trouble with speed for a daily driver. The same power in a [heavier] G8 might not do so well, but for a base model engine, it certainly would be something to look at.

A lot of people don't really understand what the free world is facing today. Our enemy in the mideast is not a rag-tag little crew of thugs who randomly blow things up. It's an international, widely funded political movement to undermine and destroy freedom. It's perhaps the biggest threat the US has faced since the Cold War.

:rolleyes:


Cost? I don't care what the cost is. We have got to stop Islamo-fascist terrorism cold as a political movement and military strategy, or we're going to face a lot of future problems. I wish people would keep some perspective here. $12B per month? We lost much more national wealth in our Civil War... in stopping Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan in WW II... and stopping the march of Soviet aggression in the Cold War. Freedom has never been 'cheap'.

I don't care about the cost either. Why should I? My grandchildren are going to be the ones who have to figure out how to pay for everything.


We have plenty of energy options right here in America. Massive coal reserves... oil off our coasts and in Alaska... and nuclear tech to name a few. All we are waiting for is the political will to stand up to the greenies and use our options. It's just a matter of time (likely 5-10 years) until the farce of man-made global warming is exposed and we become rational, logical users of our available national resources.

Alternatively, we could start taking the 'greenies' a little more seriously and start cutting back consumption across the board.

"Oh well. The magic is over for America." You know what? America has been thru a lot worse. 1780... 1864... 1942... 1979... 2001. Look up a little US history on those years. How did we make it thru those years? It's simple. Our Constitution is an amazing, precious blueprint for a decent, righteous society.


Shame, then, that we haven't taken our constitution (or the advice of the men who wrote it) seriously. I refer to our "hope" based currency and our involvement with just about every other nation's politics.


We've figured out a way to succeed and prosper, like no other nation on Earth. I think we'll find our way out of our current trifling troubles :usa:

If only we could convert rampant optimism into crude oil or currency.

Although I fail to see much reason or logic in your post, I will say that positive outlooks never hurt anything. The world could use more positive outlooks.

Lutz has already said that a 1.6L + Turbo in the G8 could give the same performance as the current HF 3.6L V6 while giving 4-5 more MPG. (http://www.leftlanenews.com/pontiac-g8-to-use-four-cylinder-engine.html) Proof that all the crying about CAFE is over nothing.


Why do I not believe that for a second. I just don't see that I-4 combo giving the same area under the curve as the bigger V6. That seems like a very "peaky" powereplant where daily driving would suffer greatly.

If we are in a recession, I think it will be short lived.

1. Trade law won't work. The US has now become one of the cheapest 1st world nations for manufacture due to the plunging dollar versus the rest of the world's currency. If that doesn't bring business to the US, legislation won't likely either.

I think it will bring business to the US. This can be seen in some of the shifting of Zeta production.

2. $12 billion per month is going to Iraq. That's money going towards something that has no return (ie: roads or education) and by what's going on, no benefit to national security either. So basically, we're pouring money into a pit. That drags down the value of our currency because we are borrowing 100% of the cost for that war. That's what you and I are going to be paying back in taxes.... with intrest.

It is not being thrown into a "pit". It is being thrown at defense contractors, suppliers, etc. Most of these are in the US. This helps the economy. See WWII and its effect on the Great Depression.

3. A large part of our trade deficit is due to our importing so much oil to feed that Tahoe that's everyone's god-given right (according to some here) to buy if we want to. When the dollar falls compared to other currencies, even if the world doesn't increase the price of oil, we see an increase because it takes more of our currency to buy it (as well as everything else imported). Meanwhile, the real value of what's made here decreases on the world market (again the falling dollar) making our goods cheap...... guess what that does to our trade deficit?? Yep..... It increases.

It isn't our "god-given" right, but our US constitution-given right. If the price of fuel goes up, then sales of larger, thirstier vehicles will go down.

If our goods become cheaper on the international market, the trade deficit should decrease, not increase. More people will want to buy our stuff.

4. As far as petroleum usage, if we cut our useage to what we produce on our own (we're the 3rd largest producer) plus what we buy from Canada & Mexico (our biggest importers), we'd be OK security-wise. But given the volume of oil we use, that's far beyond impossible.

I don't think it is impossible, it will just take a very long time. What needs to happen is for alternative energy sources to become cost-benefitial compared to petroleum.

If that isn't enough to get you to worry about the immediate future in the US, how about inflation.

A falling dollar plus high imports alone equals inflation. Add in the explosive price of fuel (only in the US... the rest of the world the price of fuel is pretty stable!), Federal intrest rates cut to the dirt which in effect devalues money more, the fact that countries that originally purchased US dollars to help their own markets and to finance our debt are starting to dump US dollars (plunging it even more), and the trillion $$$ we tax payers are going to owe China when this Iraq BS is over, and we're looking at the potential of returning to 70s era double digit inflation.... only this time, fueled by a bit more than energy costs and a hangover from a war.

I think the Fed is doing an okay job with managing inflation. As long as they don't lose control of it, we should be okay.

Owing money to China is a little unnerving. However, business is booming there, and US companies will profit.


My thoughts and concerns:

We need to diversify our energy sources. If there is a true competitor to fossil fuels, then supply and demand should stabilize prices.

The situation in Iraq needs to be stabilized. This will help to stabilize the entire region. Once stabilized, it will help to control prices. The current funding will help the economy in the short term, but it should not be counted on for the long term.

Also, we don't want any knee-jerk reactions. It could have an opposite effect. Lawmakers should do some small things to nudge the economy in the right direction, but nothing drastic. We should just let things play out.

It is not being thrown into a "pit". It is being thrown at defense contractors, suppliers, etc. Most of these are in the US. This helps the economy. See WWII and its effect on the Great Depression.


It is going into a pit because all those goods and services being consumed are for the destruction not production of wealth. Money going to contractors is just a transfer of wealth from productive industry (taxes on us) to non productive.

On a personal level it would be like hiring a security guard that you don't need for $50,000 instead of putting a $50,000 addition on to your house. Which one is money down the drain and which building personal wealth.

When you talk WWII you have to look at the amount of debt we went into for that. WWII boom was all debt based.


I think the Fed is doing an okay job with managing inflation. As long as they don't lose control of it, we should be okay.

Owing money to China is a little unnerving. However, business is booming there, and US companies will profit.

Fed is increasing the M3 money supply by 16% a year, and other countries are getting tired of holding depreciating US paper assets. Once they start dumping US bonds and cash on the market the dollar will sink even further (price inflation).

It is not being thrown into a "pit". It is being thrown at defense contractors, suppliers, etc. Most of these are in the US. This helps the economy. See WWII and its effect on the Great Depression.


I saw it. I don't see any signs of that situation repeating itself. I see the opposite effect. Every day, our debt to foriegn country's (like China) grows, so that we may fund Iraq.

No. That's a pit.

As for Camaro's future...I really believe this car will be around for some time to come. It's gonna be a smash-hit success, from the 4banger level all the way up to our beloved 8. Plus, Zeta's a relatively new platform. And they've got to have some cars riding on it.

Why do I not believe that for a second. I just don't see that I-4 combo giving the same area under the curve as the bigger V6. That seems like a very "peaky" powereplant where daily driving would suffer greatly.

It's not a bad looking torque curve, at least once you hit 2000 rpm. It actually peaks lower than many NA engines. Of course, dynos are done at full throttle so that doesn't tell you how the engine's going to feel at part throttle or how good its response is.

http://image.automobilemag.com/f/features/news/6697757/0609_c_saturn_sky_dyno.jpg

its amazing how you guys can take a thread about how will car company's like gm deal with changes in the future and turn it into a thread about the war in Iraq and the economy.


in my opinion we will see a decline in muscle cars for a while. i think the push for a 4,6,8 cyl is a great idea in the camaro. i mean common even the new 260hp 4cyl put out more then then 4th gen 160 hp v6 and im sure gets way better gas millage.

i think as car companies move forward it will be ever greater for them to find a viable alternative fuel. there are a lot of people waiting for a good alternative fuel car to come out. i think the momentent one comes along people will jump on it.we only need to lower are consomption of oil and then over time completly get off of it.

On a personal level it would be like hiring a security guard that you don't need for $50,000 instead of putting a $50,000 addition on to your house. Which one is money down the drain and which building personal wealth.

Actually, a more accurate way to look at it would be:
Hire a security guard for $50k/year who pays you rent to live in your house and buys food, clothing, and everything else from you.

When you talk WWII you have to look at the amount of debt we went into for that. WWII boom was all debt based.


How is the current situation any different?

I'm not saying that I agree that we should go to war to further our economy, but it does work.

Government spending can do a lot to support a weak economy. But, it does have its drawbacks.

Also, keep in mind that devalued currency can have benefits as well. It can reduce outsourcing and the trade deficit. Thus, creating more jobs at home.

I think that cars will need to get smaller, lighter, and less powerful, and that people will need to get smarter about how they use them. Driving a single person around in a 3500-5000lb vehicle with 300HP is borderline retarded.

At some point, we'll need to get a whole lot smarter about how we use our hydrocarbon resources. A single barrel of oil contains about 425,000 watt-hours when burned in an internal combustion engine; that's the equivalent of about 3500 man-hours of work at a brisk pace - and yet we bitch about paying $100 for this amount of energy. That's a obvious sign that we're taking this resource for granted. And frankly, I think anyone who doesn't at least consider the possibility of the end of cheap and easy oil - and plans accordingly - is foolish at best.

Frankly, I think we'll be damn lucky if we can afford to be driving around in turbo I4 G8s in another decade.

I also think we'll see an adjustment in how cars are purchased. It takes about of year of average gross pay to afford the average new car, and the only reason that this is somewhat sustainable is that we're awash in easy credit (don't forget to add in the fact that the value of the car is going to depreciate by half in the first four years of ownership, at which point people will gladly take the hit and sell the vehicle so that they can buy something newer and more fashionable). At some point in the future, I suspect that we'll be buying cheaper cars and keeping them longer (indeed, alternative-fuel cars will be built with expensive and exotic materials, and will need to be used to the fullest extent and then recycled properly due to the cost and rarity of the materials involved).

We can probably prolong this future for another decade or so by tapping into what little oil remains in ANWR and the outer continental shelf, but that will only make matters worse.

Fortunately, for smart companies, there exists a lot of potential in this scenario :thumb: Whether GM is one of those companies remains to be seen.

The "extremist" threat is just like the Cold War. Create a boogeyman so you can give a bunch of money to your friends in the defense industry. The extremists though are even less a threat to the United States than the Commies were, and they turned out to be a lot closer to a paper tiger than was believed here (except those commies in countries in which we were fighting unjust wars).

Trying to focus on the V8 topic here... but somehow I think it's a little premature to think the V8 is destined for the scrap heap. If you are realistic you would know that turbos are not really any more economical than V8s.

The GM smallblock is probably the most fuel efficient V8 in the world, not to mention the most affordable. I can't see how the V6 will take the place of the V8, no matter if future powertrains get extra motivation in the form of hybrid power, and fuel prices continue to rise.

Given the right applications, the V8 can be more frugal than the V6 or turbo engine. I guess what I'm saying is that the V8 is not exactly the bane of powertrains that should be immediately killed off for the sake of appeasing the environmentalists.

I hope I'm right but even I need to be convinced, hence my question.

1. Trade law won't work. The US has now become one of the cheapest 1st world nations for manufacture due to the plunging dollar versus the rest of the world's currency. If that doesn't bring business to the US, legislation won't likely either.

You may be right, but I tend to blame the North American Free Trade Agreement for the start of our slide that has brought us to where we are now (except for fuel prices).

Not long after Nafta passed i gave up on business courses at community college and went straight to work for my father selling and mfg'ing corrugated and related products to the furniture industry rich North Mississippi.

Initially they couldn't get to Mexico fast enough but within a year they made several trips to China and found a nest to start building in. We lost about 60% of our sales within a year.

Thus my hate of certain federal legislation, and strive for reverse legislation to bring it back.

I think that cars will need to get smaller, lighter, and less powerful, and that people will need to get smarter about how they use them. Driving a single person around in a 3500-5000lb vehicle with 300HP is borderline retarded.

At some point, we'll need to get a whole lot smarter about how we use our hydrocarbon resources. A single barrel of oil contains about 425,000 watt-hours when burned in an internal combustion engine; that's the equivalent of about 3500 man-hours of work at a brisk pace - and yet we bitch about paying $100 for this amount of energy. That's a obvious sign that we're taking this resource for granted. And frankly, I think anyone who doesn't at least consider the possibility of the end of cheap and easy oil - and plans accordingly - is foolish at best.

Frankly, I think we'll be damn lucky if we can afford to be driving around in turbo I4 G8s in another decade. ....................

Nice post :thumb: I think there is going to be a lot of creative destruction in coming decade. The trend, whether it is Civics, Malibus, Dodge Rams, or Toyota Sequoias, has been to get bigger, heavier, and more powerful with every new generation. At some point this has to end and I think that point is now with the current generation. Hybrids and electrics need to get the most bang for their kWh so we will defiantly see weight dropping now that the practically free energy party that is oil is coming to an end.

As far as V8s go they have been getting bigger and bigger since the mid 90's. 5.7L in 1997 to 7.0L today. I laugh every time I hear the 320HP 5.3L called not powerful enough. I don't see the V8 dieing but I do think it will get smaller, especially when paired with a turbo or hybrid setup. In 2015 a 5.0L might be considered a huge engine. Of course VVT, DI, and HCCI engines will keep power in the 400HP range.

guionM had a great thread about diminishing returns on these ever bigger more powerful V8s. The current HP war has kind of hit its peak.

Imagine a 2015 Z06, 3000lbs. 4.5L Camless/electronic valves, HCCI, 450HP, 8 speed auto, 35mpg hwy :metal:

It's simple. Our Constitution is an amazingly abused, detested blueprint for a greed mongering, festering pit of corruption. We've figured out a way to screw ourselves, like no other nation on Earth. I think we'll find a way to make of our current trifling troubles worse

Fixed that for you Biggie ;)

I'm all for alternative fuels and means of transportation. (Well I do happen to work for a mass transit agency who's vehicles are powered by electricity. :p) I'd buy an electric car today as my primary means of transportation if it met all my needs. (Nothing on the market does.) However, if we are going to go down that road (and I believe we will within the next 20-years) we are going to need to make it affordable for the masses. Otherwise, we'll never get there.

Not to mention convincing people that they want to live in a townhome or an apartment building conviently located next to thier favorite wateringholes while providing centralized areas for shopping that are easily accessed via public transportation.

Not to mention convincing people that they want to live in a townhome or an apartment building conviently located next to thier favorite wateringholes while providing centralized areas for shopping that are easily accessed via public transportation.We're trying out Transit Oriented Development (TOD) here. I'm not convinced it will be easy to sell in the US as it is in Europe. Especially here in California where the automobile is more than an appliance to get you from point A to point B. We're also going all about it the wrong way, but that's a political issue I can't discuss. :p

Imagine a 2015 Z06, 3000lbs. 4.5L Camless/electronic valves, HCCI, 450HP, 8 speed auto, 35mpg hwy :metal:

The concept is great, but the method is flawed :cool:

The concept is great, but the method is flawed :cool:

I suppose swapping the 8 speed out for a T6060 would still give acceptable numbers ;)

I suppose swapping the 8 speed out for a T6060 would still give acceptable numbers ;)

A DCT with a large number of ratios makes more sense than a slushbox or traditional manual in this scenario. One could also make a very strong case for GM's Two Mode, which I think is highly appropriate technology for the sort of powertrain that you propose.