Salt water the new fuel?

Burn baby burn (http://www.engadget.com/2007/09/11/can-saltwater-be-burned-as-fuel/) - there is a video further down the page.

I wonder if the oil industry would try to squash this asap if it was in fact a viable solution to powering cars in the future. Pretty awesome find when trying to find a cure for cancer.

I wonder if there is water left after the salt molecules are broken. Interesting none the less.

seen a crap load of this guys work on you tube.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI

His name is John Kanzius
Like stated previously I'm sure the medicine companies will have him killed off.
But damn , first he finds "the cure" for cancer, and afterwards, he can make fire with salt water.... simply AMAZING.

seen a crap load of this guys work on you tube.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=4kKtKSEQBeI

His name is John Kanzius
Like stated previously I'm sure the medicine companies will have him killed off.
But damn , first he finds "the cure" for cancer, and afterwards, he can make fire with salt water.... simply AMAZING.

Um, I hate to tell you but there is no "the cure" for cancer. Cancer has many different forms and different causes. There will never be a magic pill to cure all cancer.

W/ that being said I haven't looked into this work but I really doubt it is all that the initial claims say, the initial claims are always overblown. For example how much energy is required to 'ignite' the salt water? The radio waves are causing the 'ignition' and I gotta think they require quite a bit of energy to generate themselves.

Actually he was searching for a cure to some types of cancer and discovered the ability to burn salt water as a side effect. He has offered to sell his designs to Detroit and use the proceeds to further his cancer research.

I'll be keeping my cell phone away from my dinner in future...

Sounds as promising as ZeroShift. :D

Really cool with huge possibilities. Would there be a way to prevent rust as this is salt water? Plastic parts?

btw it looks like they were powering an external combustion sterling engine. That would be perfect. Use the Sterling as a generator to constantly charge a battery in a Volt like car that runs solely off of electric motor. Voila!

The oil companies will kill him.

Really cool with huge possibilities. Would there be a way to prevent rust as this is salt water? Plastic parts?

btw it looks like they were powering an external combustion sterling engine. That would be perfect. Use the Sterling as a generator to constantly charge a battery in a Volt like car that runs solely off of electric motor. Voila!

But where is the electricity going to come from to power the radio wave generator?;)

But where is the electricity going to come from to power the radio wave generator?;)

I would use the battery used to power the vehicle or a seperate battery. You could use The sterling, solar roof and regenerative braking to help charge it. You dont need an spark to start a gas engine just momentum. On the same token if the cars battery has a charge it could power the radio generator to start it. Once started the power from the sterling would recharge that battery using saltwater as fuel. Yeah it could get expensive, but thats what concepts are for. The other thing I didnt get was do you continue to need to radio frequency to burn it or only initially? Get the cost out once the concept is solid. I didnt think of that though. Of course Im no engineer.

It is probably just another form of electrolysis.

But where is the electricity going to come from to power the radio wave generator?;)
From the perpetual motion machine he also invented.

If he is burning H2 and O2 produced by breaking the H2O into said molecules via RF, then you don't gain any energy.

If he is burning H2 and O2 produced by breaking the H2O into said molecules via RF, then you don't gain any energy.

Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner!

To the surprise of no one with a functioning brain in their head, the inventor of this technology has admitted it consumes more energy than it releases

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Kanzius

I really wish the media would apply a few minutes' worth of critical thought before publishing sensational stories like this. Somewhere in the newsroom someone should have thought to ask whether they honestly thought this guy figured out how to break the laws of thermodynamics. But I guess searching for the truth is not high on most media outlet's priorities.

I'll take this guys discovery with a 'grain of salt' ;)

In the end he's just burning sodium:confused:

Somewhere in the newsroom someone should have thought to ask whether they honestly thought this guy figured out how to break the laws of thermodynamics.
I did in fact invent a device that extracted energy from nowhere out of water, but the energy companies paid me $50 billion to destroy it. Sucks for you guys.

I really wish the media would apply a few minutes' worth of critical thought before publishing sensational stories like this.
That doesn't get ratings. ;)

To the surprise of no one with a functioning brain in their head, the inventor of this technology has admitted it consumes more energy than it releases

Early versions of most technologies including fuel cells are inefficent. Were still refining the 4 cycle engine. The device is not perpetual motion as it uses a finite fuel(when the water in your tank is gone). My question is could this be practical one day?

No but it is nearly the same thing from a thermodynamic point of view because the hydrogen and oxygen in the water molecule is at a lower energy state than the component hydrogen and oxygen. It takes energy to split it, which is the same as the energy you get back when you recombine them. If you could split water for free, you could simply route the exhaust pipe back into the gas tank and it would never empty. You would then have a perpetual motion machine.

No but it is nearly the same thing from a thermodynamic point of view because the hydrogen and oxygen in the water molecule is at a lower energy state than the component hydrogen and oxygen. It takes energy to split it, which is the same as the energy you get back when you recombine them. If you could split water for free, you could simply route the exhaust pipe back into the gas tank and it would never empty. You would then have a perpetual motion machine.

You could recombine them which would yield energy? The result being the same salt water to deposit in the tank even after the burn?

He isn't burning water... he is breaking the water into hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen then combusts, recombining with oxygen to form water.

He isn't burning water... he is breaking the water into hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen then combusts, recombining with oxygen to form water.

But either way more energy is being put into the system that is gotten out of it.

But either way more energy is being put into the system that is gotten out of it.

Was creating a theoretical argument against this...
The device is not perpetual motion as it uses a finite fuel(when the water in your tank is gone).
Was just saying that the only way you could get energy from the water was if you could split the water in oxygen and hydrogen for free. But if that was the case then you could route the exhaust back into the gas tank and that would make it essentially a perpetual motion machine.

Or if it took less energy to split the water than it did to recombine the hydrogen and oxygen back into water and you are still getting free energy out of nowhere and could still recycle the exhaust into the fuel tank... again perpetual motion.

Was just saying that the only way you could get energy from the water was if you could split the water in oxygen and hydrogen for free. But if that was the case then you could route the exhaust back into the gas tank and that would make it essentially a perpetual motion machine.

Or if it took less energy to split the water than it did to recombine the hydrogen and oxygen back into water and you are still getting free energy out of nowhere and could still recycle the exhaust into the fuel tank... again perpetual motion.

I thought you were saying that because currently it took more energy to split the hydrogen and oxygen that there was no use for it. And also being that Prepetual motion machines defy the law of thermo dynamics, this thing will never have a practical use. I hope they at least try to refine it so that they seperate it with less energy than it produces.

The problem I was having with routing the exhaust back to the tank in my head was this; You seperate Hydrogen and Oxygen to burn the Hydrogen. During the burn of the Hydrogen, I assumed some chemical reaction would happen to the hydrogen giving you the burn and preventing it from bonding with the oxygen to create water again. Or at least the same water you started out with. I suck at understanding chemistry. It would be awesome if something could come of this...

I should have included if I did not the fact that you absolutely cannot split the water for less energy than you get out of recombining the oxygen and hydrogen to form water again. That would require a whole new set of thermodynamics and a greatly different understanding of physics as far as I know. Without rewriting physics however there is no way to make this a net positive energy gain.

Perhaps you could use a battery that you plug in at night to run the RF generator that splits the water that is then combusted in the ICE. But then again that is far less efficient than just putting liquid dinosaurs in your tank and burning them. Or you could just use a fuel cell.