Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
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Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Wonder which one? GM seems to me to have the closest ties to NASCAR, but financially they seem most likely to me. Plus, with the comments about wanting only to participate in racing series that have cars that actually look like production cars makes me think of the programs like the ALMS C6-R's, the CTS-V touring car, etc. It also mentions the goal of winning an overall at LeMans, and with Ford GT production ending, Corvette or future Cadillac supercar seems likely to me. Here is the link and article.
http://www.autoextremist.com/page3.shtml
http://www.autoextremist.com/page3.shtml
Originally Posted by Autoextremist.com
Thinking The Unthinkable.
Detroit. It has come to our attention that serious discussions are taking place for the first time in the conference rooms of one domestic manufacturer in particular on a subject heretofore unthinkable in Detroit. The subject? Pulling out of NASCAR. Yes, it has been mentioned before, and I have predicted it for months now - ever since the announcement was made that Toyota would be buying its way into the France family circus - but we have confirmation that not only are the discussions taking place, they're so far down the road that a timetable for a pullout has been created, taking into account the end dates of existing contracts with individual racing teams currently aligned with this particular manufacturer.
The fact that it has finally come to this is no real surprise. Several years ago, we pieced together evidence that each of the Detroit-based car companies were spending in the neighborhood of $140 million each, annually, on their NASCAR endeavors. That figure accounts for engineering and wind-tunnel work, direct payments to the teams, personal services contracts with the drivers, promotional programs, race sponsorships, advertising, etc., etc. In the Big Picture of things, when multinational companies are spending double that amount for the "privilege" of competing in Formula 1, that would seem like no big deal, but taking into account the factors that matter most to the Detroit car companies right now, that dollar figure is a very big deal.
And what are those factors? Beyond the obvious pressures being generated by Detroit's dire financial straits, one thing in particular is driving these "pulling out of NASCAR" discussions to critical levels - and that is NASCAR's full-on push and investment in its much-hyped "Car of Tomorrow." The COT is NASCAR's new "spec" car, and it takes NASCAR's template philosophy to its logical conclusions. The COT could easily be called a "NASCAR Special" or whatever the marketing name that the hype-masters in Daytona Beach will want to call it, because any connection to what the manufacturers are producing has been well and truly broken. I contend, of course, that the connection was broken long ago, but the Detroit manufacturers have been clinging to a shred of a connection and amusing themselves with the annual massaging of their various models' grille openings, nose shapes and headlight decals.
Until now, anyway.
Now, the realization has finally sunk in for one manufacturer, apparently, and taking everything into account and putting everything on the table, there's no longer the blind allegiance to NASCAR at this company, which is a seismic shift if you know anything about this town's slavish devotion to all things NASCAR on and off for the last 50 years.
NASCAR has been living large off the Detroit car companies' cash trough for so long now that they don't even care anymore, as all sense of reality left the NASCAR offices in Daytona Beach and New York long ago. The NASCAR attitude goes something like this: If a Detroit manufacturer drops out, it's "whatever" - because Toyota is stepping up to the plate. And if another manufacturer drops out, no worries, because eventually we'll just market our own NASCAR "Specials" and then we won't have to pay any manufacturer rights fees ever again.
But for one particular Detroit manufacturer it's no longer "whatever" - and messing with the sanctity of the NASCAR budget is no longer unthinkable - it's very real, very calculated and very imminent.
This Detroit manufacturer has decided that if it competes in motorsports in the future, it will only compete in three basic areas: 1. In production-based racing series that by rule and specification retain more than a passing resemblance to the cars they sell and the competitors they compete against in showrooms. 2. "Technical" efforts, in other words, engine programs for open-wheel and prototype racing series, but stopping short of Formula 1. And 3. Developing an effort to compete for the overall victory at Le Mans. Any other efforts, grass-roots racing, drag racing, etc., would be covered as the need and budget allow.
This particular manufacturer has finally come to the stark realization that their NASCAR involvement has done more for NASCAR than anything else. NASCAR exists for its benefit and profitability first and foremost - everything else is secondary to that fundamental premise. The relentless hype of NASCAR and its sponsors by NASCAR itself and its enablers at the TV networks has resulted in dramatically diminished returns for the participating manufacturers - and pretending that NASCAR's popularity has done wonders for these car companies in the showrooms amounts to the Big Lie. The fact of the matter is that the increase in the popularity of NASCAR over the last ten years has seen a corresponding decrease in the participating domestic manufacturers sales fortunes. And there's not one NASCAR-sponsored survey that can possibly suggest otherwise, no matter how hard they try to "cook" the numbers.
Immersed in a battle for the hearts and minds of American consumers, this manufacturer has finally taken the blinders off and decided that the blind devotion to all things NASCAR has run its course and now must come to a stop.
In other words, the $140 million that was previously earmarked for NASCAR, will be put to very good use.
Stay tuned, because we'll have more on this story in the coming weeks.
Detroit. It has come to our attention that serious discussions are taking place for the first time in the conference rooms of one domestic manufacturer in particular on a subject heretofore unthinkable in Detroit. The subject? Pulling out of NASCAR. Yes, it has been mentioned before, and I have predicted it for months now - ever since the announcement was made that Toyota would be buying its way into the France family circus - but we have confirmation that not only are the discussions taking place, they're so far down the road that a timetable for a pullout has been created, taking into account the end dates of existing contracts with individual racing teams currently aligned with this particular manufacturer.
The fact that it has finally come to this is no real surprise. Several years ago, we pieced together evidence that each of the Detroit-based car companies were spending in the neighborhood of $140 million each, annually, on their NASCAR endeavors. That figure accounts for engineering and wind-tunnel work, direct payments to the teams, personal services contracts with the drivers, promotional programs, race sponsorships, advertising, etc., etc. In the Big Picture of things, when multinational companies are spending double that amount for the "privilege" of competing in Formula 1, that would seem like no big deal, but taking into account the factors that matter most to the Detroit car companies right now, that dollar figure is a very big deal.
And what are those factors? Beyond the obvious pressures being generated by Detroit's dire financial straits, one thing in particular is driving these "pulling out of NASCAR" discussions to critical levels - and that is NASCAR's full-on push and investment in its much-hyped "Car of Tomorrow." The COT is NASCAR's new "spec" car, and it takes NASCAR's template philosophy to its logical conclusions. The COT could easily be called a "NASCAR Special" or whatever the marketing name that the hype-masters in Daytona Beach will want to call it, because any connection to what the manufacturers are producing has been well and truly broken. I contend, of course, that the connection was broken long ago, but the Detroit manufacturers have been clinging to a shred of a connection and amusing themselves with the annual massaging of their various models' grille openings, nose shapes and headlight decals.
Until now, anyway.
Now, the realization has finally sunk in for one manufacturer, apparently, and taking everything into account and putting everything on the table, there's no longer the blind allegiance to NASCAR at this company, which is a seismic shift if you know anything about this town's slavish devotion to all things NASCAR on and off for the last 50 years.
NASCAR has been living large off the Detroit car companies' cash trough for so long now that they don't even care anymore, as all sense of reality left the NASCAR offices in Daytona Beach and New York long ago. The NASCAR attitude goes something like this: If a Detroit manufacturer drops out, it's "whatever" - because Toyota is stepping up to the plate. And if another manufacturer drops out, no worries, because eventually we'll just market our own NASCAR "Specials" and then we won't have to pay any manufacturer rights fees ever again.
But for one particular Detroit manufacturer it's no longer "whatever" - and messing with the sanctity of the NASCAR budget is no longer unthinkable - it's very real, very calculated and very imminent.
This Detroit manufacturer has decided that if it competes in motorsports in the future, it will only compete in three basic areas: 1. In production-based racing series that by rule and specification retain more than a passing resemblance to the cars they sell and the competitors they compete against in showrooms. 2. "Technical" efforts, in other words, engine programs for open-wheel and prototype racing series, but stopping short of Formula 1. And 3. Developing an effort to compete for the overall victory at Le Mans. Any other efforts, grass-roots racing, drag racing, etc., would be covered as the need and budget allow.
This particular manufacturer has finally come to the stark realization that their NASCAR involvement has done more for NASCAR than anything else. NASCAR exists for its benefit and profitability first and foremost - everything else is secondary to that fundamental premise. The relentless hype of NASCAR and its sponsors by NASCAR itself and its enablers at the TV networks has resulted in dramatically diminished returns for the participating manufacturers - and pretending that NASCAR's popularity has done wonders for these car companies in the showrooms amounts to the Big Lie. The fact of the matter is that the increase in the popularity of NASCAR over the last ten years has seen a corresponding decrease in the participating domestic manufacturers sales fortunes. And there's not one NASCAR-sponsored survey that can possibly suggest otherwise, no matter how hard they try to "cook" the numbers.
Immersed in a battle for the hearts and minds of American consumers, this manufacturer has finally taken the blinders off and decided that the blind devotion to all things NASCAR has run its course and now must come to a stop.
In other words, the $140 million that was previously earmarked for NASCAR, will be put to very good use.
Stay tuned, because we'll have more on this story in the coming weeks.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,180
From: Yadkinville, NC USA
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Know what? I don't really care anymore.
I used to be a die-hard NASCAR nut, but since the "commercialization" of it, I have lost interest. Now it seems to be an overglorified Sunday afternoon soap opera.
It'd suit me just fine if Ford and GM both pulled out together. Dodge can if they want to - I'm indifferent about Mopar's involvement in NASCAR lately. Maybe the modern cash-cow NASCAR would fade into oblivion... kinda like F1 did a few years back when the IRL was created. I just can't see Billy-Bob and Janie-Joline spending 2 weeks salary on beer and tickets to watch Camrys and Sonatas rubbing fenders at 80mph down the backstretch.
I would ten-fold rather see something like the V8 Supercar series come to the US and displace NASCAR. REAL cars, like you and I can go buy, add safety mods, a few go-fast goodies, and hit the track. Even the Camel GT series is far more entertaining and realistic than the modern "production", carbon-copy, duplicated NASCAR bodies that all manufacturers are running today.
--------> Next.
I used to be a die-hard NASCAR nut, but since the "commercialization" of it, I have lost interest. Now it seems to be an overglorified Sunday afternoon soap opera.
It'd suit me just fine if Ford and GM both pulled out together. Dodge can if they want to - I'm indifferent about Mopar's involvement in NASCAR lately. Maybe the modern cash-cow NASCAR would fade into oblivion... kinda like F1 did a few years back when the IRL was created. I just can't see Billy-Bob and Janie-Joline spending 2 weeks salary on beer and tickets to watch Camrys and Sonatas rubbing fenders at 80mph down the backstretch.
I would ten-fold rather see something like the V8 Supercar series come to the US and displace NASCAR. REAL cars, like you and I can go buy, add safety mods, a few go-fast goodies, and hit the track. Even the Camel GT series is far more entertaining and realistic than the modern "production", carbon-copy, duplicated NASCAR bodies that all manufacturers are running today.
--------> Next.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 12,312
From: Aurora, IL
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
I too used to be a hardcore NASCAR fan, but it has changed quite a bit over the past few years. It comes as no surprise that a Domestic manufacturer wants to pull out, I am just curious which one. Who knows, in a few years, there may be no more Domestics in NASCAR, it may just be a competition between Toyota, Honda, Acura, and Mitsu.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,650
From: Indianapolis, IN
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
That $140 million is obviously a lot of money in layman's terms. However, that is the price of a good-sized advertising campaign for a vehicle launch. I'd say GM, Ford, and Chrysler get LOTS of advertising by being in NASCAR, so I'd be kinda surprised to see them pull out.
I stopped giving a crap about NASCAR a long time ago; I basically just like to hear that a Chevy won, since it is good from a marketing standpoint. From a personal viewpoint, it's fine with me if they pull out. Nothing "stock" about stock car racing anymore. Hell, for Toyota to enter, they have to purpose build an OHV V8, something they don't even sell in the real world. So what is the point of putting some stickers and a name on a body that is basically the same for all the makes?...
If they did pull out and leave it to Toyota, though, it seems like they'd be doing harm from a marketing standpoint by "yielding" the whole arena to Toyota, which is already too prominent right now. Might be a bad move, regardless of how irrelevant NASCAR is in terms of real cars (because it is probably still very relevant from a marketing standpoint).
I stopped giving a crap about NASCAR a long time ago; I basically just like to hear that a Chevy won, since it is good from a marketing standpoint. From a personal viewpoint, it's fine with me if they pull out. Nothing "stock" about stock car racing anymore. Hell, for Toyota to enter, they have to purpose build an OHV V8, something they don't even sell in the real world. So what is the point of putting some stickers and a name on a body that is basically the same for all the makes?...
If they did pull out and leave it to Toyota, though, it seems like they'd be doing harm from a marketing standpoint by "yielding" the whole arena to Toyota, which is already too prominent right now. Might be a bad move, regardless of how irrelevant NASCAR is in terms of real cars (because it is probably still very relevant from a marketing standpoint).
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,958
From: Kansas City, MO
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Chevrolet pulling out of NASCAR would sure provide a convenient reason to discontinue the Monte Carlo though, wouldn't it? Basically, the only reason the Monte Carlo exists now is so that they can call it the "Winningest Nameplate in NASCAR History." Everyone else has switched to sedans. It wouldn't be a big deal for Chevy to switch to Impala if they wanted to - but then they would lose the "winningest" claim - even though the car would probably be identical. If they pulled out of NASCAR, there would be no need for the Monte in the lineup and the Camaro could be the sole mid-size sporty coupe.
Prominent Member
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,282
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Originally Posted by ProudPony
Know what? I don't really care anymore.
I used to be a die-hard NASCAR nut, but since the "commercialization" of it, I have lost interest. Now it seems to be an overglorified Sunday afternoon soap opera.
It'd suit me just fine if Ford and GM both pulled out together. Dodge can if they want to - I'm indifferent about Mopar's involvement in NASCAR lately. Maybe the modern cash-cow NASCAR would fade into oblivion... kinda like F1 did a few years back when the IRL was created. I just can't see Billy-Bob and Janie-Joline spending 2 weeks salary on beer and tickets to watch Camrys and Sonatas rubbing fenders at 80mph down the backstretch.
I would ten-fold rather see something like the V8 Supercar series come to the US and displace NASCAR. REAL cars, like you and I can go buy, add safety mods, a few go-fast goodies, and hit the track. Even the Camel GT series is far more entertaining and realistic than the modern "production", carbon-copy, duplicated NASCAR bodies that all manufacturers are running today.
--------> Next.
I used to be a die-hard NASCAR nut, but since the "commercialization" of it, I have lost interest. Now it seems to be an overglorified Sunday afternoon soap opera.
It'd suit me just fine if Ford and GM both pulled out together. Dodge can if they want to - I'm indifferent about Mopar's involvement in NASCAR lately. Maybe the modern cash-cow NASCAR would fade into oblivion... kinda like F1 did a few years back when the IRL was created. I just can't see Billy-Bob and Janie-Joline spending 2 weeks salary on beer and tickets to watch Camrys and Sonatas rubbing fenders at 80mph down the backstretch.
I would ten-fold rather see something like the V8 Supercar series come to the US and displace NASCAR. REAL cars, like you and I can go buy, add safety mods, a few go-fast goodies, and hit the track. Even the Camel GT series is far more entertaining and realistic than the modern "production", carbon-copy, duplicated NASCAR bodies that all manufacturers are running today.
--------> Next.
It would send a dagger through the heart of NASCAR racing if GM pulled out.....but I wouldn't blame them one bit.
This "COT" is going to KILL NASCAR....who give a rats @$$ about SPEC racing? I sure as hell don't.
If NASCAR truly wanted to "slow the cars down"...then go BACK to STOCK bodied cars!
It all went to hell when they allowed the four dour Taurus / Intrepid...and then the nose cones that weren't even close to stock looking.....and now Toyota who doesn't even offer an OHV engine to the public.
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,232
From: Orlando, FL USA
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
I'm with you guys, I used to be into Nascar, but it seems ever since Earnhardt passed on, the sport has become nothing but an idiotic soap opera. Now we have WIVES of the drivers fighting each other??? C'mon give me a break.
And the whole, last 10 race deal is a crock. If a driver dominates all season long and he wins the championship 11 races out from the end, so be it, hes a kickass driver with a kickass team. Don't even the playing field up just so fans keep coming. Its supposed to be a racing series, not the WWF.
Don't get me wrong, there are alot of drivers in Nascar that are truly great drivers. Tony Stewart seems to do good in just about anything he drives, and Earnhardt Jr. has run a good bit of sports car races on the side as well. Also Jeff Gordon has won in a more than a few different motorsports series. Unfort. their sactioning body has become so distorted that they'll do anything.
I agree with Joe here, the only reason Nascar seems worth it anymore is the advertising dollars being it is the most recognizable motorsports series in the country. So it could be worth staying in for the advertising.
But I'll tell you, if GM or Ford were to pull out, there would be a huge backlash effect from it and the series would lose ALOT of fans. I've been to a ton of races over the years from Daytona to Martinsville and there are alot of fans that are diehards at these tracks when it comes to Chevy and Ford. A Toyota dominated Nascar would pretty much spell the end for the series in its current state.
ok rant mode off now
And the whole, last 10 race deal is a crock. If a driver dominates all season long and he wins the championship 11 races out from the end, so be it, hes a kickass driver with a kickass team. Don't even the playing field up just so fans keep coming. Its supposed to be a racing series, not the WWF.
Don't get me wrong, there are alot of drivers in Nascar that are truly great drivers. Tony Stewart seems to do good in just about anything he drives, and Earnhardt Jr. has run a good bit of sports car races on the side as well. Also Jeff Gordon has won in a more than a few different motorsports series. Unfort. their sactioning body has become so distorted that they'll do anything.
Originally Posted by 96_Camaro_B4C
That $140 million is obviously a lot of money in layman's terms. However, that is the price of a good-sized advertising campaign for a vehicle launch. I'd say GM, Ford, and Chrysler get LOTS of advertising by being in NASCAR, so I'd be kinda surprised to see them pull out.
I stopped giving a crap about NASCAR a long time ago; I basically just like to hear that a Chevy won, since it is good from a marketing standpoint. From a personal viewpoint, it's fine with me if they pull out. Nothing "stock" about stock car racing anymore. Hell, for Toyota to enter, they have to purpose build an OHV V8, something they don't even sell in the real world. So what is the point of putting some stickers and a name on a body that is basically the same for all the makes?...
If they did pull out and leave it to Toyota, though, it seems like they'd be doing harm from a marketing standpoint by "yielding" the whole arena to Toyota, which is already too prominent right now. Might be a bad move, regardless of how irrelevant NASCAR is in terms of real cars (because it is probably still very relevant from a marketing standpoint).
I stopped giving a crap about NASCAR a long time ago; I basically just like to hear that a Chevy won, since it is good from a marketing standpoint. From a personal viewpoint, it's fine with me if they pull out. Nothing "stock" about stock car racing anymore. Hell, for Toyota to enter, they have to purpose build an OHV V8, something they don't even sell in the real world. So what is the point of putting some stickers and a name on a body that is basically the same for all the makes?...
If they did pull out and leave it to Toyota, though, it seems like they'd be doing harm from a marketing standpoint by "yielding" the whole arena to Toyota, which is already too prominent right now. Might be a bad move, regardless of how irrelevant NASCAR is in terms of real cars (because it is probably still very relevant from a marketing standpoint).
But I'll tell you, if GM or Ford were to pull out, there would be a huge backlash effect from it and the series would lose ALOT of fans. I've been to a ton of races over the years from Daytona to Martinsville and there are alot of fans that are diehards at these tracks when it comes to Chevy and Ford. A Toyota dominated Nascar would pretty much spell the end for the series in its current state.
ok rant mode off now
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,232
From: Orlando, FL USA
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Originally Posted by SSbaby
The V8 Supercar category is fantastic... the Americans will love it if they take to circuit racing.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 54
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
I can see it being either Ford or Chevy. Dodge's NASCAR progam is still relatively new, and I don't see them pulling out so soon after they started.
If indeed the W body Monte dies before the end of the decade, then Chevy will have no other car that will benefit from NASCAR. I also don't think Ford gets any benefit from NASCAR in terms of showroom traffic. Both companies would be better off spending their money elsewhere.
I really love the idea of a US version of the V8 Supercars series.
If indeed the W body Monte dies before the end of the decade, then Chevy will have no other car that will benefit from NASCAR. I also don't think Ford gets any benefit from NASCAR in terms of showroom traffic. Both companies would be better off spending their money elsewhere.
I really love the idea of a US version of the V8 Supercars series.
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 574
From: Richmond, TX
Re: Domestic Manufacturer Pulling Out of NASCAR
Real CAR GUYS left nascar about 20 years ago. About when Cale Yarbrough quit.
I don't know what nascar is about. Celebrities? Rednecks? C&W music?
How about the Big 2.5 start a new oval track pony/muscle car series.
Roll cage reinforced production cars running at all the big oval tracks for 500miles. Challengers vs Mustangs vs Camaros. Hemi vs Mod vs LSx.
Win on Sunday Sell on Monday.
I don't know what nascar is about. Celebrities? Rednecks? C&W music?
How about the Big 2.5 start a new oval track pony/muscle car series.
Roll cage reinforced production cars running at all the big oval tracks for 500miles. Challengers vs Mustangs vs Camaros. Hemi vs Mod vs LSx.
Win on Sunday Sell on Monday.