Lutz blog on Camaro

http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/

And for those of you who might say, “Well, the Challenger has 35 hp more,” I would just reply that we have a certified 1OO more on tap from the ZO6 engine, should the need arise.

:lol: What a tease.

http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/

And for those of you who might say, “Well, the Challenger has 35 hp more,” I would just reply that we have a certified 1OO more on tap from the ZO6 engine, should the need arise.


Good god!! :D :eek: :shock:


Anyone else hoping the Challenger does indeed have 435hp in stock form, just so we can get the LS7?

Interesting what he says about "priorities".

I thought Guy had said the Camaro was given top priority :confused:

I posted on it, just thought I would let Bob himself know how important this is too all of us.

did he just say the LS7 might go into the Camaro :eek:

keep talking Maximum bob. Maybe if he says LS7 and Camaro in the same sentence enough times, it will come true! I would love a SS427.

If they fix the interior and put a 427 in I'm game......why is he worried about the Challenger? The Cobra is rated 475!!!!! thats + 75 if the camaro can weight in at around ummm 3400-3600 with the LS7 ....and sell for around 35....I'M DOWN!

did he just say the LS7 might go into the Camaro :eek:

Very interesting.

If they fix the interior and put a 427 in I'm game......why is he worried about the Challenger? The Cobra is rated 475!!!!! thats + 75 if the camaro can weight in at around ummm 3400-3600 with the LS7 ....and sell for around 35....I'M DOWN!


Challenger, GT500.......who cares!

Lutz just mentioned Camaro and LS7 in the same sentence in a good way.

Did anyone else notice it had IRS?

Did anyone else notice it had IRS?
Yes we noticed that about 6 months ago. Thanks.:D

Seriously we knew it would have IRS for quite a while now.

Interesting what he says about "priorities".

I thought Guy had said the Camaro was given top priority :confused:

I think its just jibber jabber from lutz's mouth. remember at the GTO unveiling he said the camaro would come back in maybe 30 years? He just cant say anything toooooo official and make it sound like it is set in stone bc anything can happen... but id say we have a 99.999% chance of it making it to production. Why else would he even mention the challenger... a competitor... in a manner sounding like they were both out and duking it out on the streets

quick question, does anyone know if lutz actually reads the comments responding to his blog?

yup, he claims to read every single one :D

[QUOTE=TrackMagicWS6 And for those of you who might say, “Well, the Challenger has 35 hp more,” I would just reply that we have a certified 1OO more on tap from the ZO6 engine, should the need arise.[/QUOTE]

I need it, I need it, I need it! :D

If Lutz is reading this, I'd like to tell him I don't appreciate him making me cream in my pants at work.

I think it will have IRS because it will be based off a platform to be used for midsized cars (and possibly mid to small SUVs), so it is more economical to put IRS on all of them, instead of a live axle on some, IRS on others.

I think you guys are setting yourselves up for a big let down. An LS7 Camaro for 35? The LS7 Vette comes in at 70k. The LS2 Vette comes in at 44k. Do you really think that GM will sell a Camaro that will stomp the Base vette for less money than the vette? I think it will be near or more than the base vette. You don't take the heart of a 70k car, and put it in a 35k car.

I am not saying they won't do it (put the LS7 in). They did it in the 60s and those are some of the most valuable cars ever made from GM, but even look at the option cost back then, big money. I don't think you should expect it to come in at 35k. Because honestly, you will be able to damn near get a LS7Camaro and LS2Corvette for what the Z06 costs, and that really wouldn't make too much sense if you think about it.

"Make no mistake: We would love to build this car. I would love to have one in my garage. But we cannot commit to it just yet. Circumstances dictate that we have other priorities that come first. For now, we’ll just enjoy what we have, and find out what everybody thinks about it, and we’ll make a final decision on it at our earliest opportunity."

How much longer will they wait? 4 years too long....

Lutz come on quit f***ing with us. You built the concept but now you decide to tease us even more especially with the LS7 comment! Good job though.

I think it will have IRS because it will be based off a platform to be used for midsized cars (and possibly mid to small SUVs), so it is more economical to put IRS on all of them, instead of a live axle on some, IRS on others.

I think you guys are setting yourselves up for a big let down. An LS7 Camaro for 35? The LS7 Vette comes in at 70k. The LS2 Vette comes in at 44k. Do you really think that GM will sell a Camaro that will stomp the Base vette for less money than the vette? I think it will be near or more than the base vette. You don't take the heart of a 70k car, and put it in a 35k car.

I am not saying they won't do it (put the LS7 in). They did it in the 60s and those are some of the most valuable cars ever made from GM, but even look at the option cost back then, big money. I don't think you should expect it to come in at 35k. Because honestly, you will be able to damn near get a LS7Camaro and LS2Corvette for what the Z06 costs, and that really wouldn't make too much sense if you think about it.

Agreed, I expect a TOP OF THE LINE SS Camaro (or Z whatever) to be in the mid-low 30's (33ish) and that is with a LS2/T56.

A LS7 would be a low production like the GT500 and probably mid-low 40's. If they could do it for 39,995 I'd be very suprised... More like 45k.

Ok, where are all the clowns that were laughing at those of us that were suggesting a LS7 in the next gen Camaro?

Ok, where are all the clowns that were laughing at those of us that were suggesting a LS7 in the next gen Camaro?


damn staright!

where's everyone that would flame me when i brought it up and said "no way, GM isn't even thinking about putting an LS7 in there!"

I think you guys are setting yourselves up for a big let down. An LS7 Camaro for 35? The LS7 Vette comes in at 70k. The LS2 Vette comes in at 44k. Do you really think that GM will sell a Camaro that will stomp the Base vette for less money than the vette? I think it will be near or more than the base vette. You don't take the heart of a 70k car, and put it in a 35k car.
When I said 35k in another thread I was thinking more of a downgraded LS7, not really detuned but with less of the race stuff like the dry sump system, etc. Also I was not intending to say I think that price likely at all, only that that is the only way I'd shell out quite that much for the top dawg. I am expecting the standard V8 model (standard as we have come to know the 4thgen Z28) to have the 400+ hp LS2 or better setup for under $30k and if the $33k-$35k model doesn't offer significantly more power I'll be going less than "top dawg". That is of course assuming spending 33-35k won't be the only way to get the LS2 level performer...

When I said 35k in another thread I was thinking more of a downgraded LS7, not really detuned but with less of the race stuff like the dry sump system, etc. Also I was not intending to say I think that price likely at all, only that that is the only way I'd shell out quite that much for the top dawg. I am expecting the standard V8 model (standard as we have come to know the 4thgen Z28) to have the 400+ hp LS2 or better setup for under $30k and if the $33k-$35k model doesn't offer significantly more power I'll be going less than "top dawg". That is of course assuming spending 33-35k won't be the only way to get the LS2 level performer... When you downgrade the LS7 you get an LS2. Not exactly but still it wouldn't be worth it. That tech. allows it to acheive that kind of HP.

I think you guys are setting yourselves up for a big let down. An LS7 Camaro for 35? The LS7 Vette comes in at 70k. The LS2 Vette comes in at 44k. Do you really think that GM will sell a Camaro that will stomp the Base vette for less money than the vette? I think it will be near or more than the base vette. You don't take the heart of a 70k car, and put it in a 35k car.

The LS7 crate motor retails for only $10K more than the LS2 crate motor. So logic would dictate that if they can build an LS2 Camaro for under $35K, they could build an LS7 Camaro for under $45K. However, I seriously doubt the LS2 Camaro would be much more than a similarly equipped Mustang or Challenger.

When I said 35k in another thread I was thinking more of a downgraded LS7, not really detuned but with less of the race stuff like the dry sump system, etc.They already offer the dry sump system as an option on the LS7 crate motor, so why wouldn't they offer it on an LS7 Camaro as well?

When you downgrade the LS7 you get an LS2. Not exactly but still it wouldn't be worth it. That tech. allows it to acheive that kind of HP.
No you don't. The LS7 is a different block with different internals. The LS2 has smaller bore and stroke, hence it is a 6.0L and the LS7 is a 7.0L.

The LS7 crate motor retails for only $10K more than the LS2 crate motor. So logic would dictate that if they can build an LS2 Camaro for under $35K, they could build an LS7 Camaro for under $45K. However, I seriously doubt the LS2 Camaro would be much more than a similarly equipped Mustang or Challenger.

Right on, and $45,000 puts it up there with the cobra (GT500) making an LS7 equiped Camaro equal competition. And if GM paid attention to the special edition 2002 Berger Camaro sales I'm sure they'd see that a limited edition high powered Camaro will sell. Also, a lot of the Z06 cost is in the materials for the chasis and body, this won't be a factor on a Camaro. The question is will GM keep the LS7 around for Camaro once it's replaced by the LS9?

$10k would be for the motor alone. I doubt that they'd stick an extra 100 hp in the car without beefing up the brakes, suspension, cooling, wheels, etc. In the grand scheme of things I would see a ultra-high performing Camaro reaching up in the high $40k area, but if you want to play with the big dogs then you'll have to pony (pun) up the money.

But even at that price, you'd be getting one hell of a car.

btw - everyone get on that blog and respond. Lutz said they made this concept to see how people are reacting and that'll influence if they build it (duh, I guess).

I posted on his blog, and god i hope they read it.

I've posted

The LS7 will be old news by the time the Camaro will get 500HP. It will be gone from the Corvette within a few when the base gets bumped to the 480-500 range and the top model (whatever it is to be called) gets the supercharged 600HP variant of the LSX (as per leaked engine documents).

I'm hoping he (and they) are taking notes from that blog. Rather than re-hash, here is my take and what I posted (in case it is reviewed and canned):

"Sir,
I too have been an "F-Body" fan for quite some time, currently enjoying a 2002 SS Convertable. The concept is an excellent starting point and has made a bold statement that GM really CAN develop a design that gets people talking!

As a "Gen X" 30 something with a family, I would think I am a member of the primary demographic with the means to purchase the new offering. Hope to see this in production VERY SOON, before more market share goes to Ford, MOPAR or worst yet- imports. I am, by no means an expert, but it seems like waiting until some where around MY '09 will have GM playing catch-up again.

As for the production version, I'd offer some comments from a future buyer who has driven everything (sedan and coupe) offered from the various manufacturers:

Fit and finish will be a killer. I have noted a significant improvement from GM's offerings in the last couple years in some lines. A clean, creak-free interior with high quality materials will draw folks like me in. Avoid the busy interiors of the previous Pontiacs (example '05 Bonneville) and the cheap feel of the Mustang and MOPAR offerings (Charger/300M). I can't stress enough, the production model needs clean lines vice retro with quality materials (as opposed to the concept's). I realize this car is not intended to compete with the BMW or Lexus, but I will admit the payments on my '02 would be easier if the car felt a bit more refined.

As for the exterior, the bold styling is a welcome change from (sorry) the more recent offerings from GM (save the Solstice). I did find it disturbing that a Chevy salesman (who I'll keep nameless) today noted the concept looks like a "smiling Mustang". Please look toward progressive vice retro. With that, I lothe the angular styling of the new Cadillac line, but love the direction Pontiac has taken- I'm still a fan of the G6, Grand Prix and the now dead Bonneville (just wish they were RWD/AWD).

Thank you for your time and dedication to this project. I hope I can provide something useful.


PS- Please include a performance RWD sedan soon; the Charger has been calling but the boxy/cheesy interior has kept a sales contract at bay!"


I hope the concept is an indication of the direction of GM as a whole. If so, it has the potential to breathe new life into all of the GM lines- or cripple them if they drag their feet with production.

Allen

100-150k units

base as close as 20k... high end... a little below or a little above 30k...

according to the blog!

posted on the blog.

The LS7 will be old news by the time the Camaro will get 500HP. It will be gone from the Corvette within a few when the base gets bumped to the 480-500 range and the top model (whatever it is to be called) gets the supercharged 600HP variant of the LSX (as per leaked engine documents).
I agree the Camaro will always be second to the Vette,but will always out sell it and out number it for most enthusist's:) On the street it will rule because a bunch of rich guys will buy the vette and car guys will buy the Camaro,mod as needed and overall will spank that ass:bow:

I agree the Camaro will always be second to the Vette,but will always out sell it and out number it for most enthusist's:) On the street it will rule because a bunch of rich guys will buy the vette and car guys will buy the Camaro,mod as needed and overall will spank that ass:bow:


the camaro doesnt out number the corvette enthusiasts...

there are children who grow up all their lives wanting nothing but a corvette...

but they arent really a part of the family until they purchase... or atleast out spoken

The LS7 crate motor retails for only $10K more than the LS2 crate motor. So logic would dictate that if they can build an LS2 Camaro for under $35K, they could build an LS7 Camaro for under $45K. However, I seriously doubt the LS2 Camaro would be much more than a similarly equipped Mustang or Challenger.

$10k for the motor, but wouldn't it require other upgrades? diff tranny and others to handle the extra power? I dunno...just asking...i'd love to have an ls7:bow:

$10k for the motor, but wouldn't it require other upgrades? diff tranny and others to handle the extra power? I dunno...just asking...i'd love to have an ls7:bow:
I think some would agree...

some people want a ultra powerful sports car, but often times need more then just 2 seats...

Ok, where are all the clowns that were laughing at those of us that were suggesting a LS7 in the next gen Camaro?
ya... WHAT NOW!?!?:metal:

Do you really think that GM will sell a Camaro that will stomp the Base vette for less money than the vette?
i expect that the base corvette will get an "upgrade" to 450hp, and about that time we may see a "450hp" LS7 in a camaro for about 40k. that would mean that it's close to the vette in power, but the vette is still "better" due to the rest of the car (weight). yet the camaro's appeal will be that it's a touch cheaper, and it has the almightyl LS7. :bow:

My opinion is on the blog.. the way I figure, they may gauge public opinion partially off this blog.
If not, the worst it could do is give Mr. Lutz more firepower for pushing this car through GM.

For those who don't know, Bob seems like a Camaro lover himself. If I remember correctly, he also owns a few. I think he's already sold on this car, it's more the corporate side at GM that we have to go through to get this baby in production.

I kinda liked the way he pronounces Camaro.

I posted my 2 euro cents worth.

From the press intro yesterday Bob said it was Rick Wagoners decision as to whether or not it's produced. The girl doing the intro asked him but either he didn't answer or didn't answer into the microphone.

Put an LS7 in a Camaro, and I will be there, Chevy.

I posted twise, but don't tell anyone, :D

Anyway, first post I said build it with a V8 for the same or less than a Mustang even with 300 hp, and a usable back seat, and I'll buy it.

Second post said I am a Ford guy and will continue to be until they announce it will be built.

I think statements like my second one will really help their decision.

BTW, Wagoner sucks and I am one of the guys who said it will not come with the LS7, if it does, it still won't equal the Z06 in Power, and it'll be brutally expensive.

BTW, Wagoner sucks and I am one of the guys who said it will not come with the LS7, if it does, it still won't equal the Z06 in Power, and it'll be brutally expensive.


please referrence sig........

please referrence sig........

Right, but if the Challenger weighs 4500 lbs and the 'Maro weighs 3500, it won't be necesary.

Just like the Camaro concept itself, I'll believe it when I see it (in production).
;)

Right, but if the Challenger weighs 4500 lbs and the 'Maro weighs 3500, it won't be necesary.

Just like the Camaro concept itself, I'll believe it when I see it (in production).
;)


fair enough :) .

Right, but if the Challenger weighs 4500 lbs and the 'Maro weighs 3500, it won't be necesary.

Just like the Camaro concept itself, I'll believe it when I see it (in production).
;)

The Challenger won't weigh 4500lbs though, and the Camaro won't weigh 3500lbs.

It would seem that the Camaro will have the weight advantage from the info we have recieved up until this point, but I wouldn't say it will be anywhere near a 1/2 ton advantage.

The Challenger won't weigh 4500lbs though, and the Camaro won't weigh 3500lbs.

It would seem that the Camaro will have the weight advantage from the info we have recieved up until this point, but I wouldn't say it will be anywhere near a 1/2 ton advantage.


Considering it's off a 300 chassis, I may not be far off.

Yes I was exagerating, but I think it's gonna be a fat bastard.

oh, and can some more people post of there? I've run out of names, email addresses.

Perhaps Lutz believes the LS2 is good enough to waste the Challenger... without the need for the LS7?

i think Lutz has his eye on the LS7 for the 5th gen.





and his blog has 269 replies as of now.

ya... WHAT NOW!?!?:metal:

While I wasn't one of those people, all I have to say in regard to this is that everything said in a blog is off-the-record. Lutz can say what he wants, and it obviously will have bearing in the company, but being OTF he's open to say... what he wants.

I for one would like an affordable (<40k) LS7 in my Camaro, but chances are I'll be grabbing the LS2 option. :(

What V6 will it get? The 3.9?

What V6 will it get? The 3.9?

that inline 6 might be a nice sight to see... 291 hp :)

fat bastard.

I have absolutely no doubt it will be a fat bastard. The Challenger concept's supposed weight of 4100lbs is already way too much. I just don't think the sting of the LS7 added to the Camaro's bite could hurt the 5th gen at all.

that inline 6 might be a nice sight to see... 291 hp :)

What vehicle does GM use the inline6 in that makes 291hp? A truck? I am unsure.

I would love to see a 291hp inline6 in a base Camaro. That would make the base car sporty as hell, and rip the doors off the base Mustang v6 (not to mention give the Mustang GT a scary run for it's money.)

What vehicle does GM use the inline6 in that makes 291hp? A truck? I am unsure.

I would love to see a 291hp inline6 in a base Camaro. That would make the base car sporty as hell, and rip the doors off the base Mustang v6 (not to mention give the Mustang GT a scary run for it's money.)

the trailblazer's base motor... its a 4.2 i think inline 6...

that inline 6 might be a nice sight to see... 291 hp :)
To tall and not ever designed, that we know of, to work on a slant. FYI Holden is using the 3.6 HF V6 in their GMT355. Camaro MAY get a HF V6 as a base motor.