Mustang facelift for 2008 model year?

That's what MT is claiming. They said the mustang will recieve a minor facelift around the 2008 model year, and that is around the time the Bullitt version will debut. Anyone have the scoop on this rumored facelift? It would make sense assuming they (Ford) are expecting an all-new 5th gen to debut around that time and they'll probably wanna keep things fresh with the mustang.

Btw: Anyone see the Bullitt vs Charger rematch in the new MT? Ford repainted the car highland green and removed the wing for the test. Gotta say, highland green looks amazing on the GT's. I also loved the no-wing look. They should make this paint optional throughout the lineup.

i hope they change to center console as well.

Spoiler delete is a factory option on the GTs.

Spoiler delete is a factory option on the GTs.

I meant the Highland green paint.

There is a mild refreshening due around '08, but it shouldn't surprise anyone.

Ford has a track record of steady styling updates on Mustang. Even the long running Fox Mustangs had 4 front end revisions over 13 years, plus about half of that time also carrying unique front ends for GTs, Cobras, & SVOs.

The previous Mustang was the 2nd longest running Mustang without a refreshening at 6 years ('99-'04) next to the final Fox at 7 ('87-'93).

It's not going to be a major redesign, so I'm thinking it's just going to be front end clip & tail lights.

The Mustang is too big. See it next to other cars and it looks HUGE. Its profile is too high, the back end is too long etc.

I'm not buying. Even with a facelift.

'09 is the refresh. New facias and updated interior. Powertrain changes as well.

2007 will be a decent powertrain change as well. Body stays the same though...

Ford did the same thing in 1967 just in time for the Camaro to arrive on the scene.

They should put that 5.0L SOHC engine it too. A BOSS 302 edition would be pretty cool

The Mustang is too big. See it next to other cars and it looks HUGE. Its profile is too high, the back end is too long etc.

I'm not buying. Even with a facelift.

Agree 100%!

I hope Chevy takes note.

'09 is the refresh. New facias and updated interior. Powertrain changes as well.

2007 will be a decent powertrain change as well. Body stays the same though...

What about the suspension upgrade that Martens mentioned earlier this year?

The Mustang is too big. See it next to other cars and it looks HUGE. Its profile is too high, the back end is too long etc.
Yes, which is why sales are so poor, and why all the magazines hate it.

GM, take note.

Agree 100%!

I hope Chevy takes note.


Seems some in GM feel Mustang is just the right size.....

I think I have to agree it is...except it may be a little heavy. I think the blunt nosed generally unaerodynamic styling makes it appear bigger than it really is. Packaging was an issue on the last F-car that I know GM is commited to fixing in the new Camaro. I do not see them doing that in a car much smaller than the new Mustang. You said the Cobalt was big....well they make it much smaller and both the Camaro and Cobalt will be near the same size. I really don't think that's an idea situation.

Seems some in GM feel Mustang is just the right size.....

Oh, for sure! Some of them would be happy to just slap a bowtie emblem on it and call it a day.

I think I have to agree it is...except it may be a little heavy. I think the blunt nosed generally unaerodynamic styling makes it appear bigger than it really is. Packaging was an issue on the last F-car that I know GM is commited to fixing in the new Camaro. I do not see them doing that in a car much smaller than the new Mustang. You said the Cobalt was big....well they make it much smaller and both the Camaro and Cobalt will be near the same size. I really don't think that's an idea situation.

Don't get me wrong, there are lots of things I like about the new Mustang. I just think it occupies too many cubic feet of space. It looks so massive and bulky when parked next to other cars.....it's almost surprising...and it kind of turns me off. The Cobalt - although about 8" shorter - created a similar phenomenon.

Anyhoo, I had this conversation recently. Look at an '03/'04 Mustang Cobra and look at an '05 Mustang GT. Which looks sportier? Park them next to each other and the '05 looks like the box the '03/'04 came out of.

I guess the mustang does look a little bulky when you compare it to its competition...

the chevy cobalt :blah:


New stang looks good, not saying its the best look ever but looks really good.

Anyhoo, I had this conversation recently. Look at an '03/'04 Mustang Cobra and look at an '05 Mustang GT. Which looks sportier? Park them next to each other and the '05 looks like the box the '03/'04 came out of.

How different are they in terms of physical dimesions? I think the old Mustang looks smaller because of it's slick styling....the 05 Mustang looks like a forward leaning brick.

I just hope they don't do another Bullitt version and even if they want to, Warner Brothers wants too much in licensing for Ford to do it anyway. I rather like having a car that was only made one year. Besides, rehashing the Bullitt would make both the new and old 2001 cars less valuable.

Plenty of other special editions they could do.

Boss
Mach1
California / HCS
A Spring Special
An "Elenor"
Other Shelbys
"7-UP" Cars
McClarens
Or hey, maybe something new for a change

Anyhoo, I had this conversation recently. Look at an '03/'04 Mustang Cobra and look at an '05 Mustang GT. Which looks sportier? Park them next to each other and the '05 looks like the box the '03/'04 came out of.

Funny you should say that. The Ford dealer in Seaside here has a black 05 GT & black 04 Mach 1 side by side. in the front. The 05 looks lower & wider, and the hood looks massive by comparison (having the bulge of the Mach 1 hood with the engine sticking up through the middle on the '04 probally doesn't help).

On the '04's side, it simply looks weird next to the '05. The '05 looks sporty (with the grill lights), familiar, and almost old european in looks. The '04 looks like it was creased with an iron.

Both look great, but in very different ways. Outside the pony emblem, they look like entirely different cars.

Yes, which is why sales are so poor, and why all the magazines hate it.

GM, take note.

Sales should be pretty good until the new Camaro comes out Bob. With a smaller more practical design, coupled with GM's superior engine lineup the Camaro should cut Mustang sales in half.

BTW, regarding size...

I think the 94-04 Mustangs were about perfect size wize. They could have used better packaging to get more interior room in the same sized body, but in general the size is right to me. The new ones are much bigger, but aren't any roomier in the back, that's for sure. 2" more leg room and 2" less head room.

I like the new Mustangs, but the size/weight keeps me from going crazy for them.

Sales should be pretty good until the new Camaro comes out Bob. With a smaller more practical design, coupled with GM's superior engine lineup the Camaro should cut Mustang sales in half.
Yes, history shows us that Camaro sales have a big impact on Mustang sales. Just ask anybody - they'll tell ya.

You seem to know the dimensions of the new Camaro - please tell us about it - there's a lot folks that would like to have the information you obviously posses.

Sales should be pretty good until the new Camaro comes out Bob. With a smaller more practical design, coupled with GM's superior engine lineup the Camaro should cut Mustang sales in half.

Doubtful.

Mustang sales saw no spike when the F-body was discontinued. I was expecting one big time, but it simply didn't happen.

4th gen Camaros had superior engines (measured by horsepower & fuel economy in a small lightweight package), yet Mustang essentially walked all over Camaro, especially the routing Camaro experienced after 1997.

Finally, until we see it, we really don't know how it's size measures up. However, we can almost guaranty that relying on engine and "revolutionary styling" alone is probally enough to kill Camaro again.... this time, forever. :death:

Doubtful.
4th gen Camaros had superior engines (measured by horsepower & fuel economy in a small lightweight package...


The 4th gen was anything but a "small and lightweight package". When it was introduced in 1993 (classed as a subcompact) it was 9" longer then the family hauling taurus. When it was discontinued in 2002, it had the longest doors of any car sold in the US.

I think the reason the 05 Mustang look sso big is because it was styled to look like a car that originally was smaller.

In other words, I don't think the car is dimensionally "too big", but it IS too big for the styling theme used....

And... I don't get the "Cobalt" looks big thing... it doesn't look big to me at all. :confused:

I think the reason the 05 Mustang look sso big is because it was styled to look like a car that originally was smaller.

In other words, I don't think the car is dimensionally "too big", but it IS too big for the styling theme used....

And... I don't get the "Cobalt" looks big thing... it doesn't look big to me at all. :confused:
The Cobalt SS's look HUGE when you're sitting next to them in a 3rd gen, and even when you just stand next to them. The regular Cobalt coupes and sedans seem of a fine proportion.

The Cobalt SS's look HUGE when you're sitting next to them in a 3rd gen, and even when you just stand next to them. The regular Cobalt coupes and sedans seem of a fine proportion.


I don't get it... what is it? The wing or something that makes it feel this way?

FWIW, I stoof next to a few Cobalt SS's at a dealership.... and... didn't notice a difference. :confused:

Sales should be pretty good until the new Camaro comes out Bob. With a smaller more practical design, coupled with GM's superior engine lineup the Camaro should cut Mustang sales in half.

no it wont, you guys are dreaming if you think there are 90,000 some chevy fans there and I'm not saying that the new camaro would be a flop, I saying alot of those mustang sales built right in.

BTW, regarding size...

I think the 94-04 Mustangs were about perfect size wize. They could have used better packaging to get more interior room in the same sized body, but in general the size is right to me. The new ones are much bigger, but aren't any roomier in the back, that's for sure. 2" more leg room and 2" less head room.

I like the new Mustangs, but the size/weight keeps me from going crazy for them.

Pretty much sums up my feelings perfectly.

The only reason why cars look bigger is because they have bigger mag wheels. Its true! Large wheels just make any car look bigger.

i guess you haven't parked next to a GT. Admittedly our cars were made with a low roof, but the GTs have considerably more girth than Fbodys.

Anyhoo, I had this conversation recently. Look at an '03/'04 Mustang Cobra and look at an '05 Mustang GT. Which looks sportier? Park them next to each other and the '05 looks like the box the '03/'04 came out of.

I agree, the '99-'04 Mustangs were/are far more appealing cars to me. They look so much better, the new Mustang is so retro that it's just plain stupid, the thing looks like a damn brick. I don't understand why people are so excited about, it's like borderline ugly, and yes when I got near one and road in one, the thing just appears huge, (not from inside). Overall, I don't like the new styling on the exterior or the interior for that matter. I thought the dash on the '96-'04's was ugly, boy was I wrong. Besides the leather on the seats, wheel and shifter the whole interior is crappy, hard, ugly plastic. It's completely repulsive looking with some stupid piece of plastic that runs on top of the dash, almost as if it were tacked on as an afterthought. I know I'm getting off topic with this, but when you sat in it, it gave you the impression that you were in family sedan, and the super squishy suspension, (it was a 'vert), didn't help that feeling. I came away from the car thinking how much nicer my '97 Z/28 was and wondering why the hell everyone is so excited about these cars. If the new Camaro is remotely like them, I will not be buying one. It's too bad that so many people love the Mustang, I've never been much impressed by them, (at least from the factory), and this new one sets that bar at an all time low as far as I'm concerned. To me it's just another poor excuse for a Camaro/Firebird :D

I think the reason the 05 Mustang look sso big is because it was styled to look like a car that originally was smaller.

In other words, I don't think the car is dimensionally "too big", but it IS too big for the styling theme used....


I think that has a hell of a lot to do with it. When I was really into that car I wnt to a couple mustang shows and saw some of the great early years it takes from like 69' and 64'. They look worlds better, and they are tiny. I don't think the look translates to well, although it has its angles...

But I remember the episode of Overhaulin where they built a scale model of the Deora, the hot wheels car, and they mentioned several times how you can't simply scale something up and expect it to look good.

I don't get it... what is it? The wing or something that makes it feel this way?

FWIW, I stoof next to a few Cobalt SS's at a dealership.... and... didn't notice a difference. :confused:
Darth, I think the wheels make it sit slightly higher (being 18s and all) and the ground effects make it seem bigger as well. It just seemed to dwarf my 3rd gen in comparison. The spoiler might be part of it too, like you said.

The reason the Mustang and most newer cars look bigger is the higher roof and waist line. Cars have gotten taller in recent years, a look I really don't care for. Low and wide is how I like my cars.

The reason the Mustang and most newer cars look bigger is the higher roof and waist line. Cars have gotten taller in recent years, a look I really don't care for. Low and wide is how I like my cars.
I agree.

The car is not too big at all. If anything the last M*stangs could've used to be the size of that new thing. I do agree that it's too high though. I don't find high cars sporty.

I'm just waiting for the next complete ground-up makeover and hoping they go back to a modern look. I can't stand this retro crap look they have now... especially in the interior.

The only thing that kept me from buying a 2005 Mustang instead of the 2004 Cobra I currently own was HP. Had their been an 05 Cobra with the new chassis and a 2004-like engine, I'd of been all over it. I love the new style. I certainly don't like the extra weight, but everything else is appeals to me.

I don't get it... what is it? The wing or something that makes it feel this way?

FWIW, I stoof next to a few Cobalt SS's at a dealership.... and... didn't notice a difference. :confused:

Problem is, the Cobalt SS is simply a big car. Not really big but it is based on the Saturn which is a mid-size by today's standards. I looked at the car and it really is large. Domestic automakers seem to be having a hard time getting away from size.

BTW, the latest rumor I have heard is that the new Camaro will be based on the Solstice platform. BOMBSHELL: [i]and possibly so will the next FIREBIRD.

GM, it is rumored is not happy with the way the Solstice and the GTO have been received in the market. They're going to be killed.

Just rumors mind you folks. Just rumors. :D

The only thing that kept me from buying a 2005 Mustang instead of the 2004 Cobra I currently own was HP. Had their been an 05 Cobra with the new chassis and a 2004-like engine, I'd of been all over it. I love the new style. I certainly don't like the extra weight, but everything else is appeals to me.

Of course the thing that appeals to you most is that it's a Ford, of which you are a die-hard groupie. But on a more sober level, I like the styling of the Mustang. I dislike the chinsey interior. With the 5.4 next year it should be a very, very appealing car.

But it's big. Really big. About four inches higher than the F-body. That's too high for a sporty car in this day and age. And it's damn heavy. And that fat ass, gawd that has to go. I mean, I know they didn't want anymore of the exploding rear ends like the '04 had, but that's just crazy to have three feet sticking out the back. Makes it look downright ugly sometimes. :eek:

Of course the thing that appeals to you most is that it's a Ford, of which you are a die-hard groupie.


hmmm...thats the pot calling the kettle black

on another note, IIRC bigger and taller was the direction automakers were going because people were getting taller on average. At 6'3" and being dwarfed by several people(still a minority) I can agree. As for the weight, packing the steel on does two things increases rigidity and crash worthiness. The latter a BIG selling point with the fraidy cats. Hell if Ford wanted to triple mustang sells all they would have to do is pronounce they car absolutely the safest vehicle in north america.

and with that

As we have seen (AMG anybody) big and heavy can perform and be considered sporty.

BTW, the latest rumor I have heard is that the new Camaro will be based on the Solstice platform. BOMBSHELL: and possibly so will the next FIREBIRD.

GM, it is rumored is not happy with the way the Solstice and the GTO have been received in the market. They're going to be killed.

Just rumors mind you folks. Just rumors. :D


I think those are real reaches...

GTO, I suppose I can undertsand if they are thrilled so far, though the 05 is going to sell out and reach it's max build... it still gets beat on by some who think it needs to look exactly liek a 1966 GTO to be a "real" GTO. :blah:

The Solstice, though, has been wildly popular, and it hasn't even come out yet... they has THOUSANDS of pre-orders!!

FIREBIRD.--->insert machine gun emoticon here<--- don't waste the development money on two cars. Camaros will be be much better if they dont have to share the funds.

I like Firebirds, I really do (well Formula birds atleast), but they need to stay dead and buried instead of leeching off of the Camaro.

FIREBIRD.--->insert machine gun emoticon here<--- don't waste the development money on two cars. Camaros will be be much better if they dont have to share the funds.

I like Firebirds, I really do (well Formula birds atleast), but they need to stay dead and buried instead of leeching off of the Camaro.
Well, if they sold enough to begin with, we wouldn't have to worry about cutting costs on them. Plus the fact that Pontiac is now only going with 4 cars or whatever instead of producing that ugly minivan.

I dont see it as a cost cutting, I see it more like scrapping the last little bit of jelly out of the jar and trying to spread it over an entire loaf of bread. Or put another way, you can make one really good camaro or one half-assed camaro and one half-assed firebird.

FIREBIRD.--->insert machine gun emoticon here<--- don't waste the development money on two cars. Camaros will be be much better if they dont have to share the funds.

I like Firebirds, I really do (well Formula birds atleast), but they need to stay dead and buried instead of leeching off of the Camaro.

The problem is then Pontiac which is GM's second biggest selling brand and its street performance division would likely end up being phased out. Pontiac has been so badly managed by GM in the last few years that it's in steep decline. One screw-up was getting rid of the Firebird.

And if the Camaro is based on Pontiac's Solstice platform, then I'd say Chev is leeching off Pontiac. Just like it did with the 1st gen Camaro, which was built on the 1966 Pontiac Tempest platform.

I like Firebird's, obviously because I own two of them. I like Camaros too. But next to a Firebird, a Camaro looks bland.

And if the Camaro is based on Pontiac's Solstice platform, then I'd say Chev is leeching off Pontiac. Just like it did with the 1st gen Camaro, which was built on the 1966 Pontiac Tempest platform.



You really don't know what you are talking about. The Camaro was based off the "new" Chevy II/Nova, not a pontiac. The Firebird was a late "gift" to pontiac after GM killed DeLorean's Banshee, which was basically a Corvette clone.

And if the Camaro is based on Pontiac's Solstice platform, then I'd say Chev is leeching off Pontiac. Just like it did with the 1st gen Camaro, which was built on the 1966 Pontiac Tempest platform.



ummmmmmmmmmmwhaaaat?????????

The reason the Mustang and most newer cars look bigger is the higher roof and waist line. Cars have gotten taller in recent years, a look I really don't care for. Low and wide is how I like my cars.

Agreed X1,000,000...The new Mustang absolutely does not feel sporty. The wierd thing is that even though you sit up so high, the waistline on the car is so high that you can't really put your arm on the window sill w/o it being at eye level, (I'm about 6 ft. tall). It just feels really weird :confused:

And if the Camaro is based on Pontiac's Solstice platform, then I'd say Chev is leeching off Pontiac. Just like it did with the 1st gen Camaro, which was built on the 1966 Pontiac Tempest platform.


:eek: :confused: :cry:

my head hurts now

For those of you that don't know Dwarf Killer, he posts as Black R/A on LS1.com - primarily in the "Fords and Foreign" Forum. LS1.com has been down for a few days, which is likely why you're seeing him here a little extra. He posts solely to get a rise out of folks (and some are dumb enough to fall for it). Judging by some of the stuff he posted above (Firebird, groupie, etc), he's trying to do the same thing in this Forum.

You're wasting your time replying to him/her/it. I wasted a total of about 5 minutes replying to three of his posts already...but I'm used to it...err...him.

For those of you that don't know Dwarf Killer, he posts as Black R/A on LS1.com - primarily in the "Fords and Foreign" Forum. LS1.com has been down for a few days, which is likely why you're seeing him here a little extra. He posts solely to get a rise out of folks (and some are dumb enough to fall for it). Judging by some of the stuff he posted above (Firebird, groupie, etc), he's trying to do the same thing in this Forum.

You're wasting your time replying to him/her/it. I wasted a total of about 5 minutes replying to three of his posts already...but I'm used to it...err...him.

That's a flame Bob. You're just mad because I made fun of your favorite car. And there is no LS1.com anymore. They lost the whole database.

You'll have to excuse Bob. He really hates the way I rubbed his nose in it for so long. I made a fool out of him so many times, he feels compelled to follow me around trying to discredit me. Typical Ford guy. Always pretending he didn't lose. ;)

What about the suspension upgrade that Martens mentioned earlier this year?
;)

Wait, can I be in the winkie club???

I'm just waiting for the next complete ground-up makeover and hoping they go back to a modern look. I can't stand this retro crap look they have now... especially in the interior.


Hell...if the Fox Body Mustang is any indicator...the current one will be around another 25 years. By the time they do redesign it, they will be able make a retro version of the Fox Chassis. :D

With what GM has in the pipline though...I really can't make jokes about Retro :think:

The 4th gen was anything but a "small and lightweight package". When it was introduced in 1993 (classed as a subcompact) it was 9" longer then the family hauling taurus. When it was discontinued in 2002, it had the longest doors of any car sold in the US.

I was refering to the external dimensions of the engine, not the size of the car itself.

That's what I get for typing faster than I think......My bad.

;)

Wait, can I be in the winkie club???

You are in, my man. Your decoder ring is enroute. ;)

You are in, my man. Your decoder ring is enroute. ;)

Yippee! :D

Where is Bob so I can torment him. :p

Could I get a clarification, please? Was that "winkie club" or "twinkie club"?

:D