What's the point??

With your F-body I mean.

I bought my '96 Z28 in 2000. I was always under the impression that If I had a low 13 second car, I'd be happy. My best run years ago was 13.67. Not exactly low, but I felt like I was faster than 80-90% of the cars on the road, and I was satisfied. My car is completely stock, minus the free mods, so I know there is room for improvement.

A buddy from work just bought an '05 GTO. 400hp................all of a sudden, I'm a little fish. I want to mod my car, but do I need 400hp?? A 12s car needs a roll cage at the track right??, I don't want to go that far.

But no matter what I do, it'll always be possible that someone else will get a faster car. So, my goal can't be to have the fastest.

I'm hoping after this new GTO has been around for a while, I'll go back to being satisfied with a car that's faster than most.

With your F-body I mean.

I bought my '96 Z28 in 2000. I was always under the impression that If I had a low 13 second car, I'd be happy. My best run years ago was 13.67. Not exactly low, but I felt like I was faster than 80-90% of the cars on the road, and I was satisfied. My car is completely stock, minus the free mods, so I know there is room for improvement.

A buddy from work just bought an '05 GTO. 400hp................all of a sudden, I'm a little fish. I want to mod my car, but do I need 400hp?? A 12s car needs a roll cage at the track right??, I don't want to go that far.

But no matter what I do, it'll always be possible that someone else will get a faster car. So, my goal can't be to have the fastest.

I'm hoping after this new GTO has been around for a while, I'll go back to being satisfied with a car that's faster than most.

Well, face it, there will always be someone who is faster, and has a bigger wallet. If you're happy with your car, they who cares. If you start to feel the speed bug bite, the LT1 is a great motor to start with.

Thats what my dad always said when I was younger. You will never win the money game, some one will always have a faster car.

The question is what's your goal??

The question is what's your goal??

For right now, its to have some moderately quick cars that I can drive, and that don't spend more time on jack stands waiting for parts than on the road.

Plus I learnt very well when selling my old 93 Z28 that the money I spent modding a car doesn't mean jack when it comes to resale value, so modding isn't something I plan to do to the Z28 past what I have, Waiting for GM to announce a 5th gen Camaro so I can trade it in on that :), and the GTO is the wifes' so that will remain stock.

A 12s car needs a roll cage at the track right??,
A "cage" is not required until you run 9.99 or quicker. You probably meant "roll bar"..... still not a problem.

This year NHRA has revised their rules so that a 5-point roll bar (not a cage) is required for convertibles running quicker than 13.5 and coupes (incl T-tops) running quicker than 11.5-seconds. If you are running 12's in a coupe, you do not need a roll bar.

A "cage" is not required until you run 9.99 or quicker. You probably meant "roll bar"..... still not a problem.

This year NHRA has revised their rules so that a 5-point roll bar (not a cage) is required for convertibles running quicker than 13.5 and coupes (incl T-tops) running quicker than 11.5-seconds. If you are running 12's in a coupe, you do not need a roll bar.
Depends on your track, too. My friends convertible runs 12.9 and they don't give him any crap.

You can make your LT1 faster than that GTO if you want....

MODDing is an addiction! Once you have a little then you keep wanting more, and more. I have burned about $3500 in the past 8 months in mods. It took me a week and a half to install them all by my self. (one part at a time)..... I am now looking at more. It's like, "I wonder what'll happen if I do THIS?"

Get used to it. And there will allways be someone who is faster....

There's nothing wrong with having a reliable, fun to drive, "stock" car too. Mine is pretty much stock (!CAGS, TB Bypass, short stick, cut-out) and will stay that way for the rest of this summer and possibly next too. I know it's not the fastest thing on the road but it's not the slowest either!

coupes (incl T-tops) running quicker than 11.5-seconds. If you are running 12's in a coupe, you do not need a roll bar.


Very good news. 12 seconds it is. But I'm getting way ahead of myself. I need another car if I'm going to start modding this one. You know a back-up.


So, anyone want to answer why they do it?? Why do you modify your car. To have the fastest?? The fastest on your block?? are you looking for your cars maximum potential??

So, anyone want to answer why they do it?? Why do you modify your car. To have the fastest?? The fastest on your block?? are you looking for your cars maximum potential??



I want my summer car for those nice sunny days to drive out in teh boonies and whip around turns and if i get the urge to pass, i want to be able to. I dont need the fastest as long as it looks clean and feels fast!

I just have an unresistable urge to collect a 9.999-second time slip - then retire and park my car in the driveway at the old age home. :D

I don't think its wise to want to be "the fastest".... only one person can claim that title, and it costs a huge amount of $$$$$. I just get personal satisfaction from doing the work and seeing the results.... only person I compete with is myself. Get off more on the technical side than making 1/4-mile passes.

You need to know how far to take it.... and when to stop. I think I went too far. In NJ, emissions are such a hassle that I no longer drive my car on the street, because although it will pass dyno emissions with cats in place, they have mobile inspections that they set up on the side of the highway, and pull over cars for FULL visual and rolling emissions. No way I can pass "visual". :(

You sound like a perfect canidate for a new Chevrolet Corvette Z06. I one swell foop you will be instantly faster then 99% of the cars on the road, including the GTO. You can drive it for nearly 100,000m without touching it and be really cool looking at the same time!

Thanks guys, but I already said I know that wanting to be the fastest is unreasonable, and not a worthy goal. I don't want to be the fastest, or work in that direction, because it will be a never ending story, and quite frankly, I can't afford it.
Instead, I think I will work on making my car a 12 second daily driver. I'm sure I'll be happy with that.
Now, I'm asking why do you do what you do?

For those that answered, thanks.......

If you're close to stock and run 13.67..you've got a good headstart. I was thinking something similar..if you look at the car ads nowadays...I think high 200s to 300hp is common even in non-sporty sedans. Makes our 285hp with the 96Z28 seem low nowadays. 400hp seems to be the magic number for new "sports" cars.

But don't get tied up in just the horsepower number...there's lots of non-power things that go into making your car fast...gearing, suspension, traction, weight.

As for the F-bodies, 12s are within your reach. I remember seeing madwolf (Ion) do a nice write-up for what it takes to make a 12s F-body. It ain't cheap, but it was mostly bolt-on and some tuning. He didn't even mention superchargers, turbos, or NOS. Get wild like that and don't worry about street competitors.

Wanna be the fastest on the road...there's always someone faster...but you wanna be fast, you got the right car to start with. Also, the aftermarket business supporting F-bodies is very strong...though leaning more towards LS1 from what I see :irk:

As for the GTO (here comes the GTO fan's flaming PMs), I don't like the look. Now look at the F-bodies...that's just down right sexy. So, get your mods going and you'll be like most of us...love to drive our Camaros day in and day out.

I don't care if my car is slower then others out there. It is still fun to drive and has plenty of balls.

" MODDing is an addiction! Once you have a little then you keep wanting more, and more. I have burned about $3500 in the past 8 months in mods. It took me a week and a half to install them all by my self. (one part at a time)..... I am now looking at more. It's like, "I wonder what'll happen if I do THIS?"

Get used to it. And there will allways be someone who is faster...."


He is exactly right. not only is it an addiction, but it hits you slow. every other paycheck, youll add the little stuff, untill one day you realize, that your car is running low 11's. its EASY to spend 2 grand in parts, along an entire summer. but.. heres the deal, you say you want to be one of the fastest on the road? man, thats not hard. among the typical cars you encounter each day on the standard everyday american roads, if you get your car down to the low 12's, high 11's, you WILL be faster than 98% of the cars you come up against to and from work trust me. i live and race in the motor city, and i beat MOST people i come up against. you dont need to go lower than low 12's to beat most of your competition. the way you guys are talkin, you must live 45 feet from indianapolis, and constantly come up against INDY 500 racers that got lost and drove off the track. MOST "semi" performance cars REALISTICLY run high 14's all day long, in the summer heat, after cruising for 2 hours, with a full tank of 92 octane and street tires.. trust me, you can get your newer F body down to low 12's in NO time. im really confident in that. and still retain decent gas mileage, and no roll bars/cages. most cars out there do NOT run 12's. period. its not hard to get your f body down to low 12's man. ya just gotta know the right combonation thats all. but overall, there WILL always be someone just a slight bit faster ;) for all intents and purposes though, you could be one of the fastest cars in your city, with relative ease.

I just HATE when some asshat old man in his M3/M5/vette/sl55 AMG can walk away from me. I want to be able to walk any stock production vehicle on the highway. That is my goal. With cars liek the SL55 AMG its kinda fun to try and get to taht level and be daily drivable and nat asp still.

I know about the addiction thing. In the early 90's, I was driving a '78 camaro w/ a small blook 400. It was a 13 second car too, but wasn't something you'd want to be seen in. I had less cash then than I do now, and spent everything I had on moto, which easily out-valued the car.

I've also been looking here, and I see 12's aint that hard or 'spensive, so there's my goal. 12s..

ooooh dearmicar is a 1998 opel corsa 1.4 4 cilinder eccotec motor
i go slooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwww ^-^
i live in days of iroc-z and trans am gta :D

be nice if you go faster with comupter smal chips
ive heard really wanna go faster need new motor

My 86 IROC LG4 probably is a 15 - 16 sec car, but I don't care. I have it as a summer fun car because I like it. I like the third gen looks. I like driving with the t-tops off in the summer and being able to drive it in the winter if it's dry.

It's a just a fun car -- right now most new V6 cars could beat me but I don't have anything to prove by racing.

Just enjoy it and don't think about what the guy next to you has.

to Oddbal

thats a great post

importend is to enjoy the ride
if you wanna go faster anser is race track in a dragster
or race car
on the raod is also enjoy your pride
you do not want to end up in a wheel chair

never seen one of the new gto's break 12's at my track.most of them only run mid 14's here.

i got some satisfaction with my stock Z28 yesterday, i walked an 04-05ish BMW Z4 from a redlight to 90. I had him by about 2-3 car lengths. It's very nice knowing I just whooped a $40,000-$55,000 car with a $2,200 first car! :eek:

edit: and the guy gave me a thumbs up at the next light, i did the same. i had to turn right though, it was fun.

Order a nitrous oxide system. 150 wet shot. Nobody will expect it and you'll beat almost anything from the factory.

I just have an unresistable urge to collect a 9.999-second time slip - then retire and park my car in the driveway at the old age home. :D

I don't think its wise to want to be "the fastest".... only one person can claim that title, and it costs a huge amount of $$$$$. I just get personal satisfaction from doing the work and seeing the results.... only person I compete with is myself. Get off more on the technical side than making 1/4-mile passes.

You need to know how far to take it.... and when to stop. I think I went too far. In NJ, emissions are such a hassle that I no longer drive my car on the street, because although it will pass dyno emissions with cats in place, they have mobile inspections that they set up on the side of the highway, and pull over cars for FULL visual and rolling emissions. No way I can pass "visual". :(

Thats why i do it. Modding the car myself is just as much fun as driveing it. :D .

wow im about to put some long tubes on my car. I have never seen these mobile inspections stations ( in north NJ ) what kind of ticket will i get with LTs and cars???

If you have a healthy LT1 and want to bring it into the new 400hp world do what I did. I put a Vortech V2 SQ street legal kit on my car. All I can say is Holy Crap. It provides a big increase for the money and you don't have to mod your motor if you install and run the kit as designed.
I get no detonation and unlike nitrous, its there all the time.

Also, remember the new 400hp cars are being measured at the flywheel, not the rear wheels. If your looking for a streetable well designed setup that will put you in the league of the new 400hp cars I think you will like the Vortech. I needed the CARB E.O. number to get through DEQ in Portland and that was one reason I went with Vortech. I'm glad I did. I have to say I'm impressed with Vortech's kit. I haven't been to the track or Dyno but my 0-60 times are now in the 4's for what it's worth. That power increase comes with no
rough idle and maintains stock driveability around town. It's very quiet as well.
I spent about a week, four to six hours a day, putting it in very carefully.

So thats what I did to get back into the league of current sports cars.
I gave my friend a ride the other day and he hasn't stopped smiling since!

97 WS6 T/A V2 SQ

It's very nice knowing I just whooped a $40,000-$55,000 car with a $2,200 first car! :eek:

That's one of the best things about an F-body. Blue book value that would make you gag with nausea but it'll spank ingorant morons in 3-pieces and their $40-70k status symbols all day long.

Oh, the other thing I like is they're just damn cool cars. :cool:

4 point roll cage is required for 11.99 and under, 10 point cage is required 9.99 and under, and i have had no problem beating my old man in his gto, and yes there will always be something better than yours, i myself can choose from three cars to go cruise in , a 97z28, 04 gto, and a 99 corvette....the vette is the sweet ride women love the car