GM To Ax 25K Jobs By '08?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/07/AR2005060700478_pf.html

Apparently Wagoner plans to cut costs by downsizing approximately 25,000 jobs :( in an attempt to save about $2.5B annually. Also of interest his emphasis on the high health care cost of its union employees. GM's NA unit must be worse off long term than I thought. Do any of you feel that this move is a harbinger of worse things to come or rather a good strategic move to shore up a sagging business unit? IOW's, are these cuts enought to right the ship and stop the bleeding or is something more drastic in order?

I would think that that many jobs with a 3 year heads-up, a lot of those cuts could come through attrition (Not replacing people who retire/quit).

I think GM leadership is on the right track. Seeing GM stock up 2% today makes me think I'm not the only one ...though the announcement probably didn't surprise too many shareholders.

Also, all those jobs might not be lost. The positions may be eliminaed but workers moved to diffrent positions. Either that or they are going to move even more production offshore. That would suck. I agree with the health costs, something has to be done to bring them into alignment with the rest of the world.

What they are saying today is that many will be offered early retirement. Apparently there are more than 25,000 at G.M. near retirement age right now.

If they do start axing people, they need to start at the top.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/06/07/news/fortune500/gm_closings/index.htm?cnn=yes

Note the quick pole and the results at the bottom. :D

Randy

GM needs shrink as a company. They need to eleminate their overcapacity. That saddly includes laying people off.

HAHA. Thats one way for GM to cut health insurance.

Sometime the UAW will learn in a hurry. They are not competing for jobs just here in america. They are competing for Jobs across the world. Everyone in IT knows what this is like. As a resault we dont nearly make as much money was we did in the mid 90s. If the UAW cares about its members it will adjust its demands accordenly. But they dont, and they wont. 10 years from now all american cars will be made in Korea.

Keep buying the Hyundais, the Kias, the Toyotas....it is reaaaally helping our nation's economy!!!

GM is doing their cuts over a pretty long period of time. Compare that with Daimler's slaghter of Chrysler's workforce a few years ago, almost all concentrated within 2 years. :eek:

Don't cry for the workers. They get extremely good packages, and alot of benefits base on how long they were with the company, so they are hardly going to end up on the streets.

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

Either that, or they have so much overlap and "legacy positions" from when their market share was 30%+ or more that they are just trimming down to more realistic levels.

I guess it all depends on if they have enough to do the work now...... or waaaaaaaay to many hands in the pot (which, at least from a decision makers standpoint, it seems like there is ALWAYS too many hands in the pot...)

GM is doing their cuts over a pretty long period of time. Compare that with Daimler's slaghter of Chrysler's workforce a few years ago, almost all concentrated within 2 years. :eek:

Don't cry for the workers. They get extremely good packages, and alot of benefits base on how long they were with the company, so they are hardly going to end up on the streets.

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

You have to be able to walk before you can get in front of the world and run circles around the competition. I think this is a good move. Hopefully the UAW will only make the prerequisite squawks about it, and not actually put up a fight.

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

I remember reading an article in BusinessWeek that dealt w/GM's troubles and it quoted an analyst who said that GM would be much more profitable if it's market share were closer to 20% (vs. the current 24%). Here it is:

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:tINSoV2V0XYJ:www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_19/b3932001_mz001.htm+business+week+and+GM+and+market +share&hl=en&start=1

I'll bet that they planning for this eventual outcome with this recent announcement.

GM is doing their cuts over a pretty long period of time. Compare that with Daimler's slaghter of Chrysler's workforce a few years ago, almost all concentrated within 2 years. :eek:

Don't cry for the workers. They get extremely good packages, and alot of benefits base on how long they were with the company, so they are hardly going to end up on the streets.

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

Very bad. That means they are just giving up the market share to Toyota. Nothing makes me sadder then a company that does not make 1 vehicle I would buy being number one in the US.

One thing that does intrest me in all this. If GM is cutting about 20% of it's North American workforce, that means that GM is adjusting for a smaller permanent market share, not a growth. In other words, they are setting up to be profitable selling at the current level or less as they are now. :think:

I'd be willing to bet that they'd be able to put out the same or more product with 80-85% of their current employees and a little over time. OT is time and a half, but you're still only paying benefits on 4 people for every 5 you used to, which seems to be the big issue here.

I'd look for GM to use this to their advantage in contract negocations by telling the UAW they'll be able to hire more employees if they can cut benefits a little.

Keep buying the Hyundais, the Kias, the Toyotas....it is reaaaally helping our nation's economy!!!

What a load of bull. You are right, though, buying those cars does not help our economy as much as buying american cars. But do you propose paying more out of your own pocket just to support the economy? Not only will you fail in the long run, because you will not convince the majority of population to do it, you will hurt the economy of your household.

What a load of bull. You are right, though, buying those cars does not help our economy as much as buying american cars. But do you propose paying more out of your own pocket just to support the economy? Not only will you fail in the long run, because you will not convince the majority of population to do it, you will hurt the economy of your household.

You will also take food from the mouth of the Americans that work at the plants here.

Very bad. That means they are just giving up the market share to Toyota. Nothing makes me sadder then a company that does not make 1 vehicle I would buy being number one in the US.But, does it really?

I don't think it says that. Think about other recent announcements of refocusing Pontiac/Buick/GMC into niche brands with Chevrolet and Cadillac being their bookends in the economy and luxury ends of the spectrum. All it could mean is trimming the fat and focusing on what is selling well, and what they can continue to sell well in a more streamlined GM.

Its not entirely unlike what happend to Chrysler, except that they needed the US government to bail them out. GM isn't there yet, and it appears today's announcements may not require such drastic measures.

Keep buying the Hyundais, the Kias, the Toyotas....it is reaaaally helping our nation's economy!!!

Actually, buying Toyotas and Hyundais DO help our economy...... as long as you're buying the ones that are made here. ;)

You will also take food from the mouth of the Americans that work at the plants here.

:rolleyes:

Do you write speeches for G.W.?

As bad as the job cuts are, I'm more worried about GM's announced intentions to source more components from overseas. The job losses from that could go way beyond the 25K lost jobs at GM.

How long until people stop perceiving GM as an "American" company? A few more auto-supplier plant closings here in the Midwest and I can see a consumer rebellion against those automakers who take their business overseas. I hope the slim savings they get from their Chinese parts is enough to offset the lost sales from everyone who gets kicked to the curb, but I betcha that won't be the case.

As bad as the job cuts are, I'm more worried about GM's announced intentions to source more components from overseas. The job losses from that could go way beyond the 25K lost jobs at GM.

How long until people stop perceiving GM as an "American" company? A few more auto-supplier plant closings here in the Midwest and I can see a consumer rebellion against those automakers who take their business overseas. I hope the slim savings they get from their Chinese parts is enough to offset the lost sales from everyone who gets kicked to the curb, but I betcha that won't be the case.


This worries me much more than anything else. Especially considering China's economic stability. My friend Spencer was in China for approximately 4 months, and saw probably 80 percent of the country. From what he said, and from what I know, I cannot see their economy surviving for another 10 years at the pace it is moving or anywhere near it.

When poeple outsource all this crap to China and then the baht(spelling?) collapses, where will GM be.

:rolleyes:

Do you write speeches for G.W.?

Nope, but I do actively worry about the working class in America. US manufacturing workers are a dying breed.

This has been a topic I used to be strongly in favor of the US Manufacturing Jobs; but in the last 6 months to a year I've had even more chances to travel to different manufacturing facilities with my job and let me tell you we have done it to ourselves. Unions or not; the American workforce is LAZY.

I think GM is shaving these 25k jobs with some outsourcing to Korea, etc... This is not really a bad thing. It will definitely help GM be more competitive. We need to focus on a "Global Economy" (Wow; that's completely oposite from my views 6 months ago, lol). If we try to think there is no way anybody else in the world can be as good as the US; we will lose out and fast. A move to a "Global Economy" will be good for everybody and I think GM is moving towards that.

I would expect GM to improve in South America, Asian, European countries. If they can steal market share over there, that would be great for GM. Start thinking "GLOBAL MARKET SHARE" not /just/ the USA.

This has been a topic I used to be strongly in favor of the US Manufacturing Jobs; but in the last 6 months to a year I've had even more chances to travel to different manufacturing facilities with my job and let me tell you we have done it to ourselves. Unions or not; the American workforce is LAZY.

I think GM is shaving these 25k jobs with some outsourcing to Korea, etc... This is not really a bad thing. It will definitely help GM be more competitive. We need to focus on a "Global Economy" (Wow; that's completely oposite from my views 6 months ago, lol). If we try to think there is no way anybody else in the world can be as good as the US; we will lose out and fast. A move to a "Global Economy" will be good for everybody and I think GM is moving towards that.

I would expect GM to improve in South America, Asian, European countries. If they can steal market share over there, that would be great for GM. Start thinking "GLOBAL MARKET SHARE" not /just/ the USA.

For being lazy, we work the most hours of any idustrialized nation and have the highest production.

I saw figures of 1/3 GM's overall sales come from someone associated with the company.. So if GM starts laying off mass workers, putting related manufacturing jobs overseas, this might hurt GM in sales numbers just for the fact 1/3 of GM's customers also have an interest in th ecompany directly.

Correct me if I am wrong ont he 1/3 thing.. I read it somewhere but do not now for sure if it is bunk.

On that note GM needs to layoff a bunch of workers, their market share dictates this.. Sucks all around.

For being lazy, we work the most hours of any idustrialized nation and have the highest production.

And with that being said at a Quality loss. There has been studies decreasing number of hours worked has a direct impact on product quality. A flaw in American Manufacturing.

There are good facilities here in the US of coarse. But there are just as many bad facilities. Typically I have found that the smaller companies with a smaller workforce tend to have better all round employees, but also have more direct management over their heads. The larger companies is where I have found more of the "lazy" worker.

Example of Lazy American Factory Worker:

1) Gets his cup of coffee in the morning (make it 3).
2) Starts his daily jobs off working at a Snails pace.
3) Cigarette Break
4) Machine breaks down; the guy in control of this machine could use some help, but It's not my job so I won't help.
5) Cigarette Break
6) Toilet Break
7) Lunch
8) My machine breaks down, damn... Could somebody help me??? :eek:
9) Bitches because he has to work
10) Cigarette Break
11) Line shuts down due to machine not fixed yet
12) Goes home. Bitching and smoking a Cigarette.

heh

As bad as the job cuts are, I'm more worried about GM's announced intentions to source more components from overseas. The job losses from that could go way beyond the 25K lost jobs at GM...

That's the BIG part!

People on the assembly line are making money no matter if they are assembling cars here for GM, Ford, or Hyundai. UAW members layed off get pretty handsome packages, probally the best of any industry. So the idea of work moving overseas by buying foreign brands doesn't hold water as long as they make their brands here.

The real problem is foreign sourced parts. Many of these foreign makers import parts from their country, and now our own makers are doing this as well, and will even moreso in the future.

You will also take food from the mouth of the Americans that work at the plants here.

:bow:

And that, my friends, is the state of the U.S. today. We don't care where our products come from...all that we care about is whether we save a couple bucks by buying a product made overseas versus here. And people wonder why the economy is in the toilet, and that the only way people seem to make any real $$ right now is not in the stock market, but through real estate investment.

Wait until that bubble blows up :rolleyes:

Mr. Hargrove said he's also worried about Oshawa car plant No. 2, which has no mandate for a replacement vehicle in 2008. About 3,000 CAW members work there.

What's in Oshawa #2 now?

:bow:

And that, my friends, is the state of the U.S. today. We don't care where our products come from...all that we care about is whether we save a couple bucks by buying a product made overseas versus here. And people wonder why the economy is in the toilet, and that the only way people seem to make any real $$ right now is not in the stock market, but through real estate investment.

Wait until that bubble blows up :rolleyes:

The economy is heading the way it does regardless whether you choose to buy domestic or import products. The US cannot compete globally due to its high cost of labour. It is moving more toward a service economy than manufacturing economy, and this transition will wreak havoc. My point was that it hardly makes sense to pay the higher price for a similar product, or a product of lesser quality. The financial impact is much greater on you, the buyer, than the UAW worker who may not even see a whole penny as a result of your purchase. But why stop there? Automobile manufacturing is only a part of the US economy. What about clothing, appliances, electronics, office supplies, toothbrushes?

At the end, we buy vehicles of certain kind for various reasons, be it performance, looks, value, or the fact that it was made in the US of A. I have no problems with people's decisions, but keep it without the nationalistic and propagandistic tones.

The real problem is foreign sourced parts. Many of these foreign makers import parts from their country, and now our own makers are doing this as well, and will even moreso in the future.

Keep in mind the industry trends. The "transplants" continue to increase their sourcing of parts from the US, where the "domestics" continue to move more work overseas. Go ask a supplier which customers bring in more money and provide more security for their workforce.

I can't wait until someone in Detroit figures out that they shrink their market every time they force a supplier to close down a plant and move production overseas, since some dude making $0.50/hour in China probably isn't going to run out and buy a new Buick or Cadillac. But, hey, if Detroit wants to dig their own grave, so be it.