Why GM's new trucks MUST be a HIT!!! (and not just simply "good" or "competitive")

In about a year, we should have a good idea if GM is at the verge of new greatness, or about to go over the edge into the abyss.

Why? That's when GM's new line of full size trucks should be in showrooms.

Their upcoming new full sized trucks have more focus from almost every area of GM than anything that's rolled out the factory since they bet the farm on downsized big cars in the 1970s. Make no mistake about it, a alien spaceship suddenly hovering over the Capitol couldn't possibly be a bigger deal.



General Motors has pulled alot of it's resources, both cash and personel, from other projects, pushing many other car based projects back 1 or 2 years, or even more. GM was only about a year and a half away from production of their 1st "Zeta" based RWD car. That's roughly the time needed to give final approval and get things in motion, like ordering stamping machinary and coordinating factory changeover. In short, GM was probally on final approval. Instead, those plans were shelved in favor of new trucks & SUVs.

This raises expectations on how good these new trucks will be.



Unlike the Solstice, the new truck line has had a faily long digestation period. Word is that these trucks were well underway when product chief Bob Lutz arrived at GM almost 3 years ago. Since then, the standards for GM's interiors have gone up, and the styling department has been unshackled from interference from surveys and focus group input that traditionally have weakened designs that made production in the past.

This is not to say that Bob Lutz's fingerprints aren't all over this. The new truck line will say definatively whether Mr Lutz is worth his salt outside of nice interiors and modest volume vehicles.



Also, since GM is putting so much into these trucks, it's going to be viewed as "The Best GM can Do". They'll be no excuses, and no 2nd chances here.

Ford's F series was done under the "Old" Ford management. Despite this, it set new levels of refinement. Styling that was conservative but sharp, and an interior that looked like it came from a concept version of a luxury car. The "New" Ford guys simply had to sweat the assembly right, and ensure there were no recalls.

The stakes are much higher with GM.

If these new trucks come out to a lukewarm response, it's going to bode badly for General Motors. A major recall could be disasterous. Unless these trucks blow people away, the view is going to be "they delayed car lines, and put all their resources in this project...for this[i]??"



Fate isn't helping GM.

Their financial earthquake happened [i]after decisions were made to reallocate resources to these upcoming trucks. The massive losses now expected this year simply up the pressure. Also, through bad timing or horrible luck, GM just so happens to be putting all their resources in new full sized trucks & SUVs at a time when gasoline prices are in a long term, steep increase with no end in sight. This is already having a chilling effect on large SUV sales. Ironically, a line of crossovers were part of GM's delayed projects, yet crossover vehicle sales are increasing.



GM's new trucks and SUVs could very well be show stopping attrractive, inside & out. They could have the best quality of anything with 4 wheels and 5 digit pricetag. They may even come out just when gas drops below $1.50 a gallon again. But needless to say, history isn't on their side.

GM's truckline MUST be a hit. After all the effort going into it, anything less could be devestating.

I'll most likely buy one. A base model; if the prices are low enough, as a second vehicle.

I think the following is necessary:
-Best in class interior. Period. GM using playschool dashes made of hollow painted PVC plastics with paint that rubbed off by simple repetetive hand movements was NOT acceptable in the Silverado and certainly wasn't acceptable in their more expensive SUVs which they continued all the way up to the Escalade!
-5-speed auto. Something stronger than the 4L60E standards, as well. Maybe something like a 5L80E or something along those lines and make it standard across the board for the half ton trucks
-Fully hydroformed frame with best in class frame rigidity as well as suspension dynamics to beat the F150 in terms of ride quality and chassis strength
-Honestly I say forget extended cabs. Those are old news IMO. 2-door or 4-door, that's it
-Standard composite high-strength bed material that makes having a bedliner of any sort almost pointless
-Defect-free... that includes piston slap, DRLs that burn out twice a year, and other things that they tried to pretend WEREN'T defects last time around. Stop making the public your guinee pigs for what's going to go wrong. This causes GM to lose customers for life... even though some idiots probably think these people are just going to trade their POS in and buy a 'corrected' version later on. It's no different than Microsoft selling people a beta of Windows Longhorn full of bugs, and then instead of releasing fixes via windows update and service packs, they come out with "Longhorn 2: this one works this time, we 'promise'" and expecting customers to buy the refined and corrected version.
-And a hybrid version that doesn't drive like a failed experiment would be cool, too.:p

I'll most likely buy one. A base model; if the prices are low enough, as a second vehicle.

I think the following is necessary:
-Best in class interior. Period. GM using playschool dashes made of hollow painted PVC plastics with paint that rubbed off by simple repetetive hand movements was NOT acceptable in the Silverado and certainly wasn't acceptable in their more expensive SUVs which they continued all the way up to the Escalade!
-5-speed auto. Something stronger than the 4L60E standards, as well. Maybe something like a 5L80E or something along those lines and make it standard across the board for the half ton trucks
-Fully hydroformed frame with best in class frame rigidity as well as suspension dynamics to beat the F150 in terms of ride quality and chassis strength
-Honestly I say forget extended cabs. Those are old news IMO. 2-door or 4-door, that's it
-Standard composite high-strength bed material that makes having a bedliner of any sort almost pointless
-Defect-free... that includes piston slap, DRLs that burn out twice a year, and other things that they tried to pretend WEREN'T defects last time around. Stop making the public your guinee pigs for what's going to go wrong. This causes GM to lose customers for life... even though some idiots probably think these people are just going to trade their POS in and buy a 'corrected' version later on. It's no different than Microsoft selling people a beta of Windows Longhorn full of bugs, and then instead of releasing fixes via windows update and service packs, they come out with "Longhorn 2: this one works this time, we 'promise'" and expecting customers to buy the refined and corrected version.
-And a hybrid version that doesn't drive like a failed experiment would be cool, too.:p


Threxx I couldn't agree with you more. I would like to point out that ALL GMT900 vehicles should have the 6 speed autos from word GO. Also The hybrid 5.3 SHOULD be available from the start also since the power train (minus the Transmission) is in the GMT800s now. IF GMT makes the Hybrids available widely it could have a MUCH greater impact than any previous hybrid yet. It would definately give GM a leg to stand on in the truck category, DOD and Hyrbid on almost every vehicle. Also the Atlas 6 should be the standard engine.

Oh, a lot is riding on this truck. This truck will probably make or break GM depending on how it is recieved.

But i still can't help but be somewhat pissed that whole car lines and projects were delayed over this truck.

You cannot mention the truck issue and not say "Toyota."

I wish I could tell you about the 900s but I can't. I would loose my job! We can build them in Janesville! And have made some tests. That's all I can tell you. I will say that Threxx's list has been topped already. :D

Roger

The new full size trucks will be the best product that GM engineering, manufacturing and the UAW can produce...while being shackled by the current management structure. It is much too late to greatly influence the vehicles at this point, even if the brass did get product religion post-FIAT. Those designs had long, long, been set in stone when the GM CEO decided to take personal control of North American operations. The positive effects of which are clearly debatable.
In spite of these encumberances, all the scuttlebutt seems to indicate that these trucks will be much more than customers are expecting. A testament to the talent of the staffs that worked near-miracles with slashed budgets. Of course the basic emotional response to the styling could make or break their sales success and quite possibly, GM as a whole. However, as an overall package with the new powertrains, interiors, ride tuning and options, they should be a clear sales success. Folks who have experienced them are pretty darned impressed. Which should make people wonder what could have been if only the right car-savvy management had been running the show when the designs were being conceived. Maybe next design cycle?
Let's all hope the stars are positively aligned when the new SUV's hit the showrooms in early '06. If they are, the revenues will breathe new life into an old fighter. One that is definitely battered and bruised...but determined to make a late round knockout on the road to a comeback.
And that comeback will provide budget for many new programs. Including a certain affordable rear drive coupe that so many folks around here are interested in. So... save your pennies and buy a new GMT900 SUV or pickup. And encourage family, friends and neighbors to do the same.

Oh, one last 'crazy' request... leather that is actually even remotely decent.

I swear, I have come in contact with so many 50k mile and above GMT800 trucks with leather and EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM looks like crap including even the GMC Yukon Denali. The leather is stretched, deformed, uneven, wrinkled, cracked, and stained. (I can't recall seeing a high milage Escalade, though, so I can't comment on those if the leather is all that much better)

This isn't just the way truck owners treat their leather or anything... I know people who were not hard on it at all and conditioned it regularly and it still looked like a 300,000 mile car by the time it was even out of the warranty period!

It's to the point that I wouldn't take leather even if it were free. I'd much rather have cloth in a GT800 truck.

I don't know. I know this sounds bad coming from a fan, but I really am not expecting anything special from these trucks. I hope I'm absolutely wrong, and I still beleive GM could surprise me. However, everything I've seen from GM lately makes me wonder if these are going to be finishing second in comparisons right out of the box.
Fate isn't helping GM.

Their financial earthquake happened after decisions were made to reallocate resources to these upcoming trucks. The massive losses now expected this year simply up the pressure. Also, through bad timing or horrible luck, GM just so happens to be putting all their resources in new full sized trucks & SUVs at a time when gasoline prices are in a long term, steep increase with no end in sight. This is already having a chilling effect on large SUV sales. Ironically, a line of crossovers were part of GM's delayed projects, yet crossover vehicle sales are increasing.



GM's new trucks and SUVs could very well be show stopping attrractive, inside & out. They could have the best quality of anything with 4 wheels and 5 digit pricetag. They may even come out just when gas drops below $1.50 a gallon again. But needless to say, history isn't on their side.

GM's truckline MUST be a hit. After all the effort going into it, anything less could be devestating.
It's not just fate and irony, it's bad decision making. Don't get me wrong, GM needed to get these trucks out this year no matter what the cost. However, what have they been doing for the last 7 years that they are now in this situation where they must push everything out of the way in order to scramble these trucks to the market. Did GM think they wouldn't need the new trucks so soon? How come Ford had no problem releasing their trucks along with performance cars like the Mustang? Just horrible planning.

Oh, one last 'crazy' request... leather that is actually even remotely decent.

I swear, I have come in contact with so many 50k mile and above GMT800 trucks with leather and EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM looks like crap including even the GMC Yukon Denali. The leather is stretched, deformed, uneven, wrinkled, cracked, and stained. (I can't recall seeing a high milage Escalade, though, so I can't comment on those if the leather is all that much better)

This isn't just the way truck owners treat their leather or anything... I know people who were not hard on it at all and conditioned it regularly and it still looked like a 300,000 mile car by the time it was even out of the warranty period!

It's to the point that I wouldn't take leather even if it were free. I'd much rather have cloth in a GT800 truck.Maybe they should use Buick's Leather, I've got 119K on my wife's Park now and virtually NO conditioning except she uses Armorall every so often, and it still looks really good. Only recently this winter has it even shown any sign of stretching, but still looks good. BTW, she has burgandy-pillow-top seats, but the plastic dash did crack at both speaker grills tho. :(

Leather in a regular cab would be nice too.

Guion, I thought releasing a lot more crossovers faster was part of GM's new plan. I know I remember Ah-ha at C&G saying a barrage of crossovers were going to be coming out, and I took that as meaning they were pushing those ahead as well. Could be he was referring to a different size of crossover? I don't know, but I really want the Buick Centieme to come out along with the GMC Graphyte, which I'm pretty sure are both good indications of the real versions to come out.

GM problems are much deeper then most people realize and its doubtful that even the new trucks and SUVs will come remotely close to solving the problem.

Why GM's Plan Won't Work ...and the ugly road ahead @ http://businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_19/b3932001_mz001.htm

Wow, ironic. I'm not by any stretch a truck fan, but here I am holding my breath on these models because I sense they are too closely related to another model close to my heart.

I'm honestly on edge here as a lifetime (and sometimes wavering) GM fan.

Maybe they should use Buick's Leather, I've got 119K on my wife's Park now and virtually NO conditioning except she uses Armorall every so often, and it still looks really good. Only recently this winter has it even shown any sign of stretching, but still looks good. BTW, she has burgandy-pillow-top seats, but the plastic dash did crack at both speaker grills tho. :(

I'm a big Armorall fan, but I'd never consider using on any interior surface in any car. You might like to make things slippery and shiny, but it really isn't a good idea from an aesthetic or practical point of view. Of course, if you're going for a "Tiajuana taxi" look, go ahead.

Just keep in mind:

Armorall is great stuff for tires.:)

I'm not very optimistic about these trucks being able to save the day. Even if they exceed expectations, I don't know if there are enough buyers for large SUVs with gas prices on the incline.

It's a shame it's come to this, but I don't see GM going by the wayside if they aren't a massive hit. As others have said, they have a whole host of problems that need addressing if they are to regain prominence.

I wish I could tell you about the 900s but I can't. I would loose my job! We can build them in Janesville! And have made some tests. That's all I can tell you. I will say that Threxx's list has been topped already. :D

Roger

Well, I'll believe it when I see it.

On the basis of current information, I can't feel very optimistic about the GMT-900. Unless GM had done a world class job of keeping an entirely new product completely under wraps, I'm afraid that GMT-900 is going to be a surprisingly modest remake of the very tired and old GMT-800.

There are a few things that I feel are an absolute must for these cars:
Hybrid - no ifs ands or buts. People like feeling green these days and that would help get them into an SUV. Also with raising gas prices it only makes sense.
DOD - GM: Time to implement it in damn near every V8. Another thing to help save gas.
if not DOD then - a totally different approach: to settings one for economy, the other performance. the economy setting well have the engine run lean (like maybe only use 50% of gas that would normally be sprayed in) and then obviously the performance one would have a good mixture.
And probably the most important one is: Good designed interiors that are well built. Ford's trucks' interiors are amazingly well styled. Nothing you would expect from a pickup. Also dont use the normal black plastic. make it look aluminum or something (even if it is plastic) or put a thin layer of aluminum over it or something. Use quality plastics and make sure the fit is right.

if not DOD then - a totally different approach: to settings one for economy, the other performance. the economy setting well have the engine run lean (like maybe only use 50% of gas that would normally be sprayed in) and then obviously the performance one would have a good mixture.

Every LSx built already does that, you just don't get a switch. The PCM does it passively and leans out the charge as much as is safe while also fiddling around with spark timing constantly.

Every LSx built already does that, you just don't get a switch. The PCM does it passively and leans out the charge as much as is safe while also fiddling around with spark timing constantly.

Oh, well then. Thats good. :)

My 5 year old 6 speed C5 got 32+ mpg coming home from Salt Lake City...not too bad for a sports car. ;)

From the limited pics on Cheers and Gears, the 900 outline looks failry close to the current version. Of course we cannot tell for sure , and I sure hope they focus on the exterior styling as much as they are claiming on their interior. If GM cannot shed it's current design, everyone will just think of it as a recondition current vehicle, even if it has a ton of new stuff. The 900 series need to not only be better quality wise, it has to somehow seperate itself styling wise from the current trucks.

Every LSx built already does that, you just don't get a switch. The PCM does it passively and leans out the charge as much as is safe while also fiddling around with spark timing constantly.

GM needs to do a better job of letting the customer know that they have these kind of technologies in their cars, if some of us gear heads dont know about it then most consumers wont. Its good business lets every one know that GM is cutting edge, and not just with the vette. It would help change their image, but this is only my opinion.