Which one would get your $22K?

For $22K you can buy a V6 Mustang Premium package with afew options, or a reg cab ZQ8 Colorado with 3.5L I5 with lots of options (and still not hit $22K!), or a Cobalt SS or two nicely equipped Aveos.

1Colorado
2cobalt ss

I wouldnt consider any of the others.

Quality wise, it seems hard to beat the Cobalt SS. I've only heard good reviews on the interior and the build quality on them. 200ish HP at the ground on dynos of the redlines, which I'm assuming will transfer over to the SS. Aftermarket is starting to come around on the 2.0L with cams and other goodies on the way according the cobaltss.net's boards. Fun little car, good quality gets my 22k.

A rear wingless Cobalt SS all the way . Mustang can have it size advantage , Colorado can have its usefulness and I dont do cars like Aveo's . I'd much rather get around in a blown 5 speed Cobalt :)

Cobalt SS hands down. if for no other reason that it should have an insane aftermarket. the V6 pony cars never got much attention from the tuners. i should know. I own one.

Easy question. The aveos! YESSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!

For 22k, all the others are way overpriced, so I picked the Mustang...but even thats high for a fully loaded Mustang. The msrp for a loaded v6 is 20k.

The others from your list scream 'cheap' and thats not a problem...unless you wind up paying too much for it. I have a 2003 Ranger that I bought new for $10,000 out the door. Its cheap, but I bought it cheap so I'm fine with it. I couldn't imagine spending 22K on any of those fugly cars when I'd rather spend a little too much on a V6 Mustang for that much.

Give me the Cobalt. If I had the extra cash it would be my daily driver right now.

I voted Colorado but only because I really like it's aggressiveness. I feel that the sedan Cobalt looks better than the coupe. But it is really a close call. BTW I am also considering a HHR for my next vehicle for the wife, if that shows you my taste. :D

I voted Colorado because of it's usefulness.

I LOVE the Cobalt for what it is, but I just can't handle small cars (even though Colorado is a smaller truck).... obviously that rules out Aveo too.

Mustang would make me think for a bit, but if I was going to get a Mustang, it'd have to have a V8... plus I hate the hokey "M-U-S-T-A-N-G" sticker on the bottom of the V6 car. :blah:

Mustang would make me think for a bit, but if I was going to get a Mustang, it'd have to have a V8... plus I hate the hokey "M-U-S-T-A-N-G" sticker on the bottom of the V6 car. :blah:

That's a $295 option (includes rear spoiler).

For 22k, all the others are way overpriced, so I picked the Mustang...but even thats high for a fully loaded Mustang. The msrp for a loaded v6 is 20k.



Loaded for $20K? Where do you get that?

The MSRP for a base Mustang (no options), is $19,770.

That's a $295 option (includes rear spoiler).

That is good to know, though every V6 Mustang I have seen so far (all 3 of them) have had the sticker...

No biggy, even without it, I'd stick with the Colorado.... sounds liek more options can be had for the money, and the Mustang would need a V8 to draw my interest.

I went with the Cobalt because I"m not a truck fan and hate retro styling.

If I tied the two Aveo's together, is it possible to have as much power as the SS and more interior room? :p

22k is way too much for the Colorado. If it were a crew cab for 22k, I think that would be a good deal. Maybe pay 18K for the extra cab. 15K tops for a regular cab.

Just for comparison. My dad bought a brand new 2004 Tacoma regular cab for 12K about 8 months ago. Granted it had zero options(no CD player) except A/C and floor mats, but he's always driven stripper trucks(had an 88 Toyota reg cab, and an 85 extra cab with no p/s and rubber floors before that one), so he's spoiled rotten with a new truck.

None of those fill the bill for me at the moment. I'm not too interested in fumbling around trying to shoehorn a one year old into the backseat of a coupe... And well, the Aveo......

22k is way too much for the Colorado. If it were a crew cab for 22k, I think that would be a good deal. Maybe pay 18K for the extra cab. 15K tops for a regular cab.

Just for comparison. My dad bought a brand new 2004 Tacoma regular cab for 12K about 8 months ago. Granted it had zero options(no CD player) except A/C and floor mats, but he's always driven stripper trucks(had an 88 Toyota reg cab, and an 85 extra cab with no p/s and rubber floors before that one), so he's spoiled rotten with a new truck.

Read the options again it said a loaded ZQ8. The ZQ8 is the sport model with lowered suspension, 17" wheels, and will have most options on it.

Mustang is out on spec. If it's a pony car and it does not have a V8 in it...don't waste my time.
SS Cobalt is out because frankly if I had that kind of cash and was inclined to driving a riced out(or would that be corned out) economy car I'd go get an SRT-4 and you wouldn't catch me dead in one of those.
The two Aveos is interesting simply for the novelty of it but not a chance in hell I'd actually do it.

So that leaves the Colorado. Which fits me just fine because I like the Colorado's styling, I like trucks just in general,and it's more useful than the other vehicles. So Colorado for me definately.

Now...if they would just make me an SS Colorado starting under 26k with that LS2 and I'll be all over it.

I'd take the Cobalt. The truck is in a totally different segment, so if I'm into a sporty 4 seater I'd take the Cobalt SS.

I paid $23,600 for my '05 Colorado Z71 Crew cab. Edmunds says you can get a loaded $22,980 ZQ8 for $18,686

I bought my crew cab 4wd titan for 25k. I would not spend 22k on a tiny toy truck with not enough power, payload, towing capacity or room. I votedmustang, but really i would throw down the extra 3k for a GT rather then spend that much on the V6.

Sadly, I had to pick the Mustang, even though the Cobalt is likely much faster. Unfortunately it is also small.

Hmm... PERSONALLY... if the other three were the options and you swapped the two Aveos for two Cavaliers, I'd take the Cavaliers.

But, that wasn't an option, so I went with the Cobalt SS... wouldn't buy a truck OR a pony car without at least a V8, and uhm, wouldn't be caught dead in an Aveo.

How about we add get a 4 cyl ZQ8 Colorado and do an LS1 swap? :D

It'd be between the mustang v6 and Cobalt SS. The truck is cool, but i need something with a bit more performance. v6 mustang and Cobalt SS are both 14 second cars, with the SS being quicker and i'd assume it'd handle and brake better as well. I also like the interior of the SS better going off by pics, and so i'd go with that even though it's Fwd. I'd have to get a wing-delete or something though. That factory wing is a little too big for my taste, especially on a fwd car where it is non-functional. In the end, i never cared for lowered trucks outside of the high-performance ones like Lightning, and i never really cared for the v6 mustangs. It's always been v8 for me when it came to mustangs.

In real life though, I'd have taken an Acura RSX Type-S at 23k or pony'd up the cash and gone with a base GT at 25k. I normally don't do Fwd, but if i did, i'd go with the acura even though its performance falls short of the SS's or SRT-4s.

You missed "none of the above".

For 22K I'd add to the LS1 F-body collection. :D

How about a half used 04 GTO?
Or a sweet-a$$ Malibu Maxx LS? :)

I dont like Mustangs, so thats out. I would deffinatly take the Cobalt SS.

I'd definetly take a red hardtop Formula Firehawk for 22k over any of those selections.

I voted for the Cobalt SS but you should have also put the base v6 Charger in the poll too.

I voted for the Cobalt SS but you should have also put the base v6 Charger in the poll too.

SRT-4, RSX Type S, and a host of other cars in that price range as well.

But it seems like he wanted to keep the choices simple/limited.

On the one hand, the Mustang has the advantage of sporty ponycar sheetmetal and RWD. On the other hand the Cobalt SS is a blast to drive and has a higher quality interior.

Hmmmmmmmm.............................if....only.. ...someone.........could ...combine........

...........RWD, and a blast to drive....with sporty ponycar sheetmetal and higher quality...at that same price. :think:

Remember not long ago when people squealed like stuck pigs when a Chevrolet rep was quoted that the Cobalt and Monte Carlo effectively competes with the Mustang? Check the poll numbers.

A GM marketer simply looking at numbers (which is the language that actually gets things produced, by the way) reading this poll would conclude that RWD is irrelevent in a performance car, and that putting money to trucks instead of a pony car is the right move.

"Look, even a poll at a Camaro Z28 website shows that even hard core Camaro fans rather have a Cobalt than a Mustang-like vehicle! They even picked a sports truck over a Mustang. We can save alot of money by focusing on the Cobalt rather than a new Camaro. Afterall, look how badly the 4th gen did."

Once again, Camaro enthuiasts (as a group) doing what we seem to do best. Giving aid to those who would prefer not to bring Camaro back. :no:

Remember not long ago when people squealed like stuck pigs when a Chevrolet rep was quoted that the Cobalt and Monte Carlo effectively competes with the Mustang? Check the poll numbers.

A GM marketer simply looking at numbers (which is the language that actually gets things produced, by the way) reading this poll would conclude that RWD is irrelevent in a performance car, and that putting money to trucks instead of a pony car is the right move.

"Look, even a poll at a Camaro Z28 website shows that even hard core Camaro fans rather have a Cobalt than a Mustang-like vehicle! They even picked a sports truck over a Mustang. We can save alot of money by focusing on the Cobalt rather than a new Camaro. Afterall, look how badly the 4th gen did."

Once again, Camaro enthuiasts (as a group) doing what we seem to do best. Giving aid to those who would prefer not to bring Camaro back. :no:

Perhaps...but this is a choice of current offerings, not nessesarily a future model arguement.

Can anyone else guess the next poll will be " if you could have any of these four or the hypothetical new V6 Camaro styled the way you want it which would you choose for $22K?"

Now I definately choose new Camaro.

"Look, even a poll at a Camaro Z28 website shows that even hard core Camaro fans rather have a Cobalt than a Mustang-like vehicle! They even picked a sports truck over a Mustang. We can save alot of money by focusing on the Cobalt rather than a new Camaro. Afterall, look how badly the 4th gen did."



Yeah maybe. But some of those guys can use some pretty twisted logic to make their case.

Maybe the "take away" here is that most Camaro enthusiasts on this site do want the MY 20xx V6 Camaro to be something more than a 2005 V6 Mustang.

Maybe the "take away" here is that most Camaro enthusiasts on this site do want the MY 20xx V6 Camaro to be something more than a 2005 V6 Mustang.

That gives me the shivers for some reason..... :think:

Yeah maybe. But some of those guys can use some pretty twisted logic to make their case.

Maybe the "take away" here is that most Camaro enthusiasts on this site do want the MY 20xx V6 Camaro to be something more than a 2005 V6 Mustang.

That's the logic you or I would use. :lol:

But you probally know as well as I do, statistics and figures run GM.

Someone who's either neutral on Camaro but simply gathering numbers, or someone looking to save GM some bucks by looking at cars where they can combine markets, let alone those who simply don't want another F-body will look at those poll numbers and say: "See, we were right! Cobalt is a sufficient competitor to the Mustang. These figures came from a Camaro Z28 enthusiast website!"

I'm sure you also can imagine something like that playing out. Especially if Camaro is part of the Zeta program stoppage.

A GM marketer simply looking at numbers (which is the language that actually gets things produced, by the way) reading this poll would conclude that RWD is irrelevent in a performance car, and that putting money to trucks instead of a pony car is the right move.

Once again, Camaro enthuiasts (as a group) doing what we seem to do best. Giving aid to those who would prefer not to bring Camaro back. :no:

The logic is flawed. No one voting in this poll sees a V6 Mustang (or V6 Camaro for that matter) as a "performance" car. I see the base pony cars as "sporty" vehicles...same as I do with Cobalt SS. In that realm, at that price point, people here chose the Cobalt SS. And even then, let's remember that this is a GM site...I'm not overly surprised at the Chevy support. Post the exact same poll at the Corral and let's see the results.

And yes Charlie, I do expect the next V6 Camaro to be more than "here's the sporty sheet metal, hold the sporty driving experience."

And yes Charlie, I do expect the next V6 Camaro to be more than "here's the sporty sheet metal, hold the sporty driving experience."

Me and you, bud.

The logic is flawed. No one voting in this poll sees a V6 Mustang (or V6 Camaro for that matter) as a "performance" car. I see the base pony cars as "sporty" vehicles...same as I do with Cobalt SS. In that realm, at that price point, people here chose the Cobalt SS.

There's where the logic begins to bend.

My job is to find ways to save GM money, without passion or prejudice. I happen to come to this website. I already have a few other points, but there's been alot of rumbling from enthusiasts to bring Camaro back. I take a week or so in my off time to go over all the posts I can. I discover that there is no real consensus on what the next Camaro should be, outside of very quick in acceleration. I would assume that RWD is a requirement, and I would expect people falling over themselves asking whay we can't build a car like the Mustang.

But then I come to a poll that indicates FWD isn't as big of a deal breaker some of the guys proposing Camaro seem to indicate. Look at how much Cobalt rates over Camaro (I may or may not know the details of what the difference between the base Cobalt and the Cobalt SS is.... ditto Camaro & Z28).

I go back & here's what I'd present:

A. Doing a new F-body will cost 1 billion dollars (just throwing out a figure that's probally in the ballpark).

B. Any future Camaro is going to have to be able to sell most of it's volume as base models, just like Mustang or it won't make financial sense.

C. The coupe market is finite, it isn't growing. It also requires more frequent restyling to maintain sales.

D. We have a new Cobalt coupe that cost us a very minimal amount of money to produce that is already on the market, and an SS version that's already gathering buzz.

D. On one rabid Z28 enthuisiast website, a poll giving a choice between a RWD Mustang and a FWD Cobalt SS, the members chose a FWD SS by over 50%, with the remainder divided between the Mustang & Colorado. Even the Colorado beat out the Mustang in that poll.

Given this, it can be concluded:

1. The demand for RWD in a performance coupe disappears if price and performance levels are very favorable. As long as we can undercut the Mustang's price and have gobs of horsepower under the hood, and we can gain even hard core Camaro enthusiasts.

2. Because the Cobalt coupe is a derivative of the sedan and the whole line is already in the market & is currently selling at 200,000 per year plus, the only investment is in minimal cost production performance upgrades.

3. If we were to have the Cobalt SS perform at the level of the Mustang GT, and maybe save a larger RWD coupe for Pontiac and Buick, where the profit margin is higher and these cars can be derivatives of those brands respective RWD sedans, we would not only save a billion by not needing to create a smaller almost all new chassis, we would better use our resources where they would do the most good.

I feel the opposite, and I can make a convincing case against going ahead with a Camaro. Imagine what someone who actually believes this stuff can do. :eek:

Loaded for $20K? Where do you get that?

The MSRP for a base Mustang (no options), is $19,770.
I got it at Edmunds yesterday...its not like there's any significant difference between base and the top anyways...where I live, no one wants leather, its too hot, and everyone knows that all factory decks, no matter what they call it, is never 'premium'.

My point though was that all the others were pathetically not worth it for 22k.

There's where the logic begins to bend.



On the other hand, they might say.....

On a Chevy site, 80% chose Chevy's.

Lookie here...Cobalt SS got 50% of the votes. We sure went the extra mile on that car to get the interior, chassis and powertrain right. Car's not even out yet and word is getting around. Awesome...I'll have to bring that up at the next strategy meeting.

And look at Mustang. I guess an appliance in ponycar sheetmetal doesn't cut it with these guys anymore....we'll need to do better for Camaro.

Let me make an important note...worthy of it's own meeting even. Let's make sure the next base Camaro goes the extra mile...just like we did with Cobalt SS. It seems that people DO know the difference.

Toss "Mustang GT" into the poll and i'm sure the results would have been VERY different. Even if this is a chevy board....Most here will agree that Mustang GT > Cobalt SS or any other Fwd'er in that price range.

It's just that a lot of us just don't feel "passionate" about the base cars. I'd go as far as to say that we don't even care for it. Most here probably wouldn't even consider a base camaro/mustang anyways. It's v8 or nothing for most of us. Just the mentality most of us has.

BUT the general public thinks differently. They will buy v6 mustangs to the tune of 100,000+. Something that a Cobalt SS wouldn't even come close to matching regardless of how many of us picked the SS in this poll. GM can't ignore that figure or toss it out of the window just because some enthusiasts were made to choose between cars they normally wouldn't even consider and they picked the one car they might pick in a hypothetical situation. In reality, most of us will take a Mustang GT anyday of the week over a Cobalt SS. The same applies to camaro....z28/SS > Cobalt SS. Same applies to the base v6 camaro when you look at the public. GM will sell more base v6 camaro's than Cobalt SS's if they ever bring a good or even decent one to market.

GM will sell more base v6 camaro's than Cobalt SS's if they ever bring a good or even decent one to market.

EXACTLY!!!

Even your most staunch of beancounters like in Guy's scenario knows that the SS makes up a very, very slim slice of the entire Cobalt pie. So even if he/she wants to point to this poll, there's no way on earth Chevy could turn out 80,000-100,000 Cobalt SS's each year to satisfy the demand that would otherwise go for a base Camaro (or Mustang). This is an enthusiast based site, and regardless of anything else you want to point to the Cobalt SS is MUCH more an enthusiast's car than the base Mustang. It's blown, quicker, handles better, and arguably has a higher quality cabin. Cobalt SS makes sense over the BASE Mustang on an enthusiast site like this.

Maybe we need another poll, in case the dimwits really are looking at this. Me, I'm taking a Mustang GT any day and twice on Sunday when compared to any Cobalt you wanna throw at me...and honestly, I really do not care for the new Mustang, period.

Man, that's tough between the Colorado and the Cobalt SS. They both come to the table with their own advantages. They are too different though, and not really fair to compare.

If I needed a utility/work vehicle the Colorado would get my nod. I love the looks as well.

If I needed a daily driver that was popular with the young crowd and could reasonable hold 4 people, then the Cobalt would be my choice.

Dan

It's just that a lot of us just don't feel "passionate" about the base cars. I'd go as far as to say that we don't even care for it.

Don't you think that's a shame? Because I do.