i was thinking if i were to get a turbo system next year is there any cheaper tubing/headers all the accesories needed for the turbo system besides the head, than the one that people reccomend thats around $4.5k for just the tubing? is there any cheaper tubing than that for a 95 z?
thanks

p.s. i am not looking for kits like the sts, i want either only the tubing (and i buy the head seperately), or a good kit that can make 700-900rwhp along with 396, forged pistons and le3 heads/cam and supporting mods...

 

or how can you make the sts system go 12 psi like it says on their site and around how much would a sts kit with 12 psi and le3 heads/cam, 396 and forged pistons for forced induction, mac midlength headers, slp lm, 3500 stall, moser 12 bolt, monoblade, no cats, 1.6 or 1.7 rr (which would u recommend), comp r lifters, ngk tr55 spark plugs, aftermarket spark plug wires, tb bypass, and 3.73 gears make in rwhp around?
thanks

 

After building a drivetrain and motor with such potential I would highly suggest topping it off with a front mount turbo.

 

For a 396 you really shouldnt think about STS. You just have too many cubes. You'll change the pressure ratio on the exhaust and could easily blow something...

*ziiiiiiiip*

I'm guessing you want more power, and the STS is really ideal for a low/mid power bang for the buck street setup.

I'd say front mount as well, as it appears you've got a lot you're working with...

HOWEVER!

1) With boost, go smaller. Bore the cylinders as little as possible. Also I'd reccomend not going all out with the block. Boost puts more abuse. A 396 takes a lot of out...

2) 1.6rr is always reccomended UNLESS you get otherwise from your cam builder. Slapping 1.7 rockers on an lt1 drivetrain without a lot of care and precision is asking for possible problems. I think you know that, and the cam will determine it. No way to reccomend rockers without knowing the full details. As with plugs and wires.

3) You may not need the monoblade. It's a great unit, but for a 12psi motor you shouldnt really really need one. Could you use it? Sure. But it's an extra few hundred bucks. I got a 58mm BBK off ebay for $259 and then ported/polished it... To each his own though.

4) It worries me you list "aftermarket spark plug wires" and "tb bypass" and "no cats". On a high hp motor I think those are thoroughly obvious. What isnt obvious though is your choice of fuel system, intercooler, timing/ecu, ignition and the like.

5) You list "slp lm" that to me means the SLP loudmouth. That wont work with STS. Why is it listed?

On power there is no way to estimate something like that. It could be 600hp or 900hp. It depends on the build. A bunch of great parts slapped together is still just a bunch of great parts, and wont perform well. A bunch of average parts put together with great care and selection will make a great engine. I would discuss a lot of these fine details with your engine builder...

Thats what I did

 

what about 383 with forged pistons for forced induction? do you know of any great front mounted turbo or tubing for not that much?
thanks

 

It's really PTK or Phamspeed (which is looking to develop their lt1 kit). Stay away from logs whatever you do. The PTK hotparts have gotten more expensive in the 2nd gen, but they got better so no complaints there. I dont know how Phamspeed would do their hot parts, so thats a "who knows" sorta thing.

If you can weld decently. Shonefeld has a "misc bends" kit for like $79 in a good mild steel that has enough bends to build nearly two sets of turbo headers. I few members have done this with great results. If I was a better welder and had more time, I would have gone the same route myself. As I am not... I went with PTK.

 

Can you give me a link to all their sites?
thank you!

p.s. how hard is it to build your own turbo headers?

 

Stainless Works Bends Page

SPED Exhaust Bends Page

Burns Stainless (Everything from Aluminum, Stainless, to Inconel and X Pipes)

Schoenfeld Misc Bends (Price has gone up a little)

Schoenfeld's own website (Prices same as above)

Phamspeed (check for them more on LS1tech, their website doesnt have much yet)

Pro Turbo Kits

How hard is it to make headers? Several of the guys on here have done full setups from misc bend kits, some have used truck headers, some use the MAC headers and the like.

It can be done for cheap, but of course the results will reflect what your setup really is and how carefully you put it together. I prefer STS over log systems, thats how bad they are.

Ideally they should be equal length headers that merge right at the turbine housing inlet, but that is very hard to fit on our cars. The closer you get to that, the better (seperating the exhaust pulses avoids hot spots and the pulses help with spool). Avoid merging pipes at sharp angles and sudden tubing size changes. These will create horrid hotspots as well. Jordan Musser had thermal pics of his setup and that showed exactly what I'm talking about. He did a pretty decent job at building his kit, and the thermal pictures are worth the look over just to see how crazy this stuff gets.

Making turbo headers is (I'd say) probably twice as hard compared to making normal headers for our cars, if not worse then that. Fit is a pain, and expect to go back and forth from the vice/jig to the car a LOT! Also the other issue is either you build a brace for the turbo to attach to the engine or the headers have to be strong enough to hold it. And some of these turbos are quite big and heavy...

I figured for the $1300 for the hot parts from PTK, I could buy the parts for $300 (roughly, as it has flanges, a crossover, and the downpipe) if I went uber-cheap. Then $1000 for labor. A good professional welder will easily run $60/hr (or $100/hr) and knowing that he has to measure, cut, fit, trim, weld... all day long would easily take a pro 20 hours to do a good job. I figured it'd take me two or three weeks of working every night till I was exhausted after work to get them done (again, if I could weld that good). Then realize going out for parts, possibly messing up etc. Not worth it to me. I just bought them and used the precious time to do other things.

 

Not sure if that's a blanket statement or that you just don't like the TTI setup in particular, but there is nothing wrong with a good log manifold. A well designed log setup won't lose much peak power over a 4 into 1 header, and the turbo response will usually be *much* better with the log. Anyone who's ever shelled out $800+ on a set of equal length ATR headers for their TR will tell you that

 

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THOSE LINKS!!!!

 

http://forcedinductions.com/productsgarrett.htm
will the GT-42 74T turbo work on the lt1? if not then can you list any good hp makers that will?

 

"Nothing Wrong" is a relative statement, and I HATE the TTI log setup.

I remember the staggering results when I was working on 4g63's and the first tubular headers came out. Suddenly guys needing small amounts of nitrous to spool their gigantic drag turbos could almost get away without them, and guys on the street were dropping threshold RPM by several hundred even on stock turbos. The seperated exhaust pulses and more efficient flow pattern kept the EGT's down and dropped the pressure inside the manifold itself, which lowered the temperature of the exhaust valves and the head. Helped a LOT of things. Less heat was trapped in the manifold. Less energy lost to heat was more energy to spool the turbo. Energy lost is slower response. How in heavens name is a 4 to 1 inferior?

" *much* better " ?? Perhaps for ATR, As I have not used any of their products I cannot speak for their results. On one example of one car vs one header. But logs by nature are inferior compared to a 4 to 1 header. Read Maximum Boost and check out the thermal pics Jordan took at the same time (I'll try to find those) and the flaws are obvious. Every 90 degree bend the exhaust takes drops efficiency. Not only do logs have very sharp 90 degree bends, but going into a log manifold forces a change in direction AND pressure. Those are the two things you want to avoid at all costs to maintain velocity. Also logs cannot maintain even temperature and pressure at all the exhaust valves, creating an un-even situation when comparing cylinders. Hence why people use equal length headers, turbo or otherwise. They force different cylinders to be different, create hotspots in the log itself, drop the pressure, then try to increase it again at the turbine, and provide no way to maintain good flow in the path to the turbine wheel. Why are they good?

If logs were superior, people here would be using them. Pros would use them. Turbo mustang guys would use them. Logs are CHEAP to make. But not many are. There are good reasons they arent used. TTI was one example of a poorly designed system. But I have yet to see any sweeping results that say logs are superior in any way shape or form. Perhaps an ideal log VS a poor design header wouldnt loose much, or even have the log come out on top... but a decent header against the best log? The header will win.

 

Work? Sure it will "work". Will it be ideal ? Probably not. It depends on what your goals are. For example, the PT76GTS is a GREAT turbo that can easily support enough to nuke the t56 transmission and the rear, and the driveshaft.... Amazing unit. However expensive. The biggest downside to the GT Garrett is that they are huge. Placement is harder, and the bolt pattern they use isnt as easy to work with. A standard T4 flange makes life a LOT easier. I myself am using a Master Power GT45 which is $200 cheaper then even the Garrett GT42 and some are using the Master Power T-70 (Dont trust ebay for T-70 turbos, many arent what they claim to be!) on the mustang forums.

I would call Jose from Forced Inductions about what you're looking for power wise. I narrowed my choices to the PT76GTS and the MPGT45. I chose the GT45 cause it was silly cheap and I didnt need as much potential. How much power will it make? Dont know. But I'll be telling everyone in a couple weeks when I post the details (and costs) of my setup and the results it had.

The third choice I had was the T-88. But there are guys on here running T-70's without a hassle. It depends on how much power you want, but there are a lot of options. Jose can help you with that as he has the huge catalogs infront of him, and I dont even have my compressor maps infront of me.

 

If i got the tube kit from ptk would it be worth an extra $1,000 to get the intercooled one or no? is there any nice kit like that all assembled w/o the turbo just for the lt1 for a little cheaper? what about what turbo head would fit good and would help me reach the 700-1,000hp mark with le3 heads/ turbo cam and 383 with forced induction pistons? and what kind of price would it cost?
thanks man

 

If you're not in a hurry to get a turbo kit, Phamspeed should have a single turbo kit for an LT1 before too long. It should be VERY competitive in pricing.

Mike