GM Says It May Kill Off One of Its Brands

Uh oh. On the verge of junk bond status and now cutting a line... Not good.
LINK (http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/ns/news/story.jsp?id=2005032315440002961051&dt=20050323154400&w=RTR&coview=)
DETROIT (Reuters) - General Motors Corp., which issued a shock profit warning last week and has been losing market share, may phase out one of its weaker car brands if sales fail to meet projections, company Vice Chairman Bob Lutz said on Wednesday.

GM's Buick and Pontiac are both "damaged brands" due to lack of investment over the years, and GM is working to correct that with an array of new vehicles coming to market, Lutz told a Morgan Stanley automotive conference in New York.

But if some of its brands fail to meet sales projections, "then we would have to take a look at a phase-out. I hope we don't have to do that. What we've got to do is keep the brands we've got."

Financial analysts have said for years that the world's largest automaker has too many brands to support, even with the gradual phase-out of the Oldsmobile brand a few years ago, particularly with its weaker U.S. sales.

Sales for both Pontiac and Buick have lagged in recent years. But GM is in the midst of a $3 billion investment in new vehicles for Buick, and Pontiac showrooms and they will have four new vehicles this year, including the Solstice roadster, Torrent SUV and the G6 mid-size coupe.

GM, which last week cut its earnings outlook for 2005 by as much as 80 percent, posted a 6 percent drop in U.S. sales for the first two months of the year. GM's U.S. market share fell to about 25 percent, far below its share of 27.5 percent for all of 2004.

Analysts said last week that GM's March sales could fall as much as 10 percent in March, while foreign automakers such as Toyota Motor Corp., Hyundai Motor Co. Ltd. and Nissan Motor Co. Ltd. would continue to gain U.S. market share.

Lutz said GM will post relatively flat U.S. sales for March, however, performing much better than expected.

"I think we're going to be just about even, our best guess at this point. Either a percent over or a percent under," he said. "It is a substantially better month than January or February, and it looks like the whole industry is up."

<snip>

How about the design teams? =/

You can see that coming a mile away.

RIP Olds and Plymouth

Doug D

This really isn't a shocker. There is so much redundancy in GM's lineup that it amazes me they have made it this far with only cutting one line.

This really isn't a shocker. There is so much redundancy in GM's lineup that it amazes me they have made it this far with only cutting one line.
I always wondered about that... :think: Same car, same look, different name, different price... Why? :confused:

Yukon and Suburban....Wow. Why pay 10,000 extra for the GMC version when it adds absolutely nothing?

Lutz=failure

Pontiac sales lagging? theres only a billion grand ams on the road :rolleyes: Come on.

This really isn't a shocker. There is so much redundancy in GM's lineup that it amazes me they have made it this far with only cutting one line.
Exactly, like the XLR, what idiot would pay that? They did much better when each division was unique with its own engines and body panels.

I'm sad to say this but with a couple exceptions, the current line of GM cars just scream "rental" and "bland". There just isn't much to be excited about in general.

Blasphemy, I know.

:(

Like a couple people, this isn't a shock to me. Once they did it to Olds I knew they'd probably do it to Buick soon. I can understand them doing it though. As much as I hate to see brands fade away sometimes it just has to happen.

BTW, I like Pontiac but honestly their cars all look very simiar. It was cool back in the late 90's but now I want something new.

Never been a big fan of Pontiac, GTP and GTO do not make up for everything else over the years (besides firebird)

Pontiac sales lagging? theres only a billion grand ams on the road :rolleyes: Come on.

Seriously! that and the Grand Prix, I cant count how many I see in a day! :rolleyes:

I like Pontiacs.

:cool:

I'm sad to say this but with a couple exceptions, the current line of GM cars just scream "rental" and "bland". There just isn't much to be excited about in general.

Blasphemy, I know.

:(

While you may be correct, I don't see the problem. Toyota is smoking everyone and all of their cars are generic as can be. They don't even have anything remotely special in their lineup.

Dope

Lutz=failure
:rolleyes: Lutz should be considered a god if he can correct all the crap the previous organization left him with. Seriously, not many people could have stepped in the way Lutz did to try and save GM, and he's doing a great job with what he was given.

Pontiac sales lagging? theres only a billion grand ams on the road :rolleyes: Come on.

Brand spankin new G6 is selling less than the dated Grand Am. That's a problem.

Exactly, like the XLR, what idiot would pay that? They did much better when each division was unique with its own engines and body panels.
I totally agree. whats the point of having multiple devisions if they cars within them arent unique to that devision? Standardized engines and chasis may be cheaper, but its also a great way to spell out boring. The only thing standardization helps is ease of modability, and thats not even a good excuse, just look at the 60s and 70s when everything had 5 different engine options.

Lutz=failure

Unfair nonsense.

Lutz was put at the helm of the Titanic when it was full steam ahead about 5 minutes before it hit the iceberg.

Check out the nonsense GM has to put up with in its union contracts. It gets stuck keeping open outdated plants, making outdated models, and paying laborers while factories are shut down due to excess inventory.

Further, Lutz had nothing to do with the pension fund crisis which is the most threatening to GM at this point.

They should cut chevy too. All the cars suck except the corvette. Even the late model camaros were ugly. The only thing they had going for them was cheap power.

I agree unfortunately, chevy has lost its touch minus the corvette. Only good GM brand right now is Cadillac.

Brand spankin new G6 is selling less than the dated Grand Am. That's a problem.

Indeed, but I blame the sales of the G6 on lack of good advertising. Also....the damn thing looks like everything else pontiac has in their lineup. No offense, to GTO owners, but even that looks like everything else pontiac has on the road. Honestly, the 4th gen T/A was the most "unique" car in their lineup.

I agree, the late model T/A's were awesome looking. Now they have nothing... Everything blends in together.. :cry:


Rob

Indeed, but I blame the sales of the G6 on lack of good advertising. Also....the damn thing looks like everything else pontiac has in their lineup. No offense, to GTO owners, but even that looks like everything else pontiac has on the road. Honestly, the 4th gen T/A was the most "unique" car in their lineup.

Agreed! BUT.....

The GTO may look genaric, but drive it, and GM needs to work that in, I drove one last week and I'm sold, I've never driven a new muscle car that felt quite like the new GTO!
Too bad that it's high price/ and low inventory/ little marketing :( It truely is an awesome car!

I agree! I've driven in one. The GTO is a great car, please don't get my wrong. But to the general public, their brand all looks the same...including the mighty GTO. I really wish they really made that car stick out. The inside is great, but it could have looked quite a bit more mean on the outside. That really would have made it different.

Design, Design, Design!!!!!!!
GM had some of the best looking cars in the 70's, 80's, 90's then crap crap crap. I loved the C4, Fiero, 2nd 3rd 4th F-cars, even the last iteration of the lowly Beretta looked cool. They just went to hell in a handbasket. Just look at the new Muatang, that car is gorgeous. The new Lexus GS, ya baby!! Drove a 05' Toyota 4Runner Sport last week and cried when the wifey couldnt get comfortable in the seats cause the alternative that she liked was the GMC Envoy SLT 4x4. About the same price, but the 4Runner was beautiful. Even the new Chryslers look good, love the Hemi's, Cherokee's, and dont even ask me about the viper :bow:

And I read in some speed rag last month where it was quoted that a senior GM marketing official stated that " the new 05 Cobalt SS is there to fill in the void of the F car and compete with the new Mustang, we have that niche covered" WTF! :confused: :rolleyes:

It's Saab.

It's Saab.
I hope...its the only one I wouldn't remotely miss.

i wouldn't cry if they ****caned the buick line, i suppose they do sell fairly well with the older people though.

I hope...its the only one I wouldn't remotely miss.
GM execs have been saying for months that Saab is no longer even close to profitable and they see no reason to keep it around. Saabs sell pretty well around here (except for the 92-X), but elsewhere they aren't doin too hot.

Yea most of the GM cars now look the same. I laugh because I see Mazda 6's driving around and they look similar to the new GTO. I'm like..."ahh nice *gets closer* aww...its a freakin' import!" Don't get me wrong...I love the GTO and think the interior is awesome and the ride is unbelievable. :bow:

I like Pontiacs.

:cool:



:lol:

While you may be correct, I don't see the problem. Toyota is smoking everyone and all of their cars are generic as can be. They don't even have anything remotely special in their lineup.



The biggest thing about imports are the low price and high gas milage. With gas prices the way they are, alot of people don't care about styling (Not that GM offers much of that anymore) or power, they want milage and reliability. Toyota and Honda are well-known for both.

While you may be correct, I don't see the problem. Toyota is smoking everyone and all of their cars are generic as can be. They don't even have anything remotely special in their lineup.
The problem is that GM builds cars that fall apart after a few years, cost more than the competition, and look like rental cars to top it off.

Take a "bland" POS GM vehicle that is accepted on this board, or take a Toyota, which will make you evil on this board, and is considered boring looking on this board, yet will be reliable and give you your moneys worth.

That's the problem. If you're going to make "boring cars" like Toyota and charge more for them, make sure the damn things aren't going to fall apart on the people that buy them. Or you'll ensure that they buy Toyota in the future.

:lol: I think GM has given Toyota more sales than Toyota's advertising could hope to get them.

The problem is that GM builds cars that fall apart after a few years, cost more than the competition, and look like rental cars to top it off.

Take a "bland" POS GM vehicle that is accepted on this board, or take a Toyota, which will make you evil on this board, and is considered boring looking on this board, yet will be reliable and give you your moneys worth.

That's the problem. If you're going to make "boring cars" like Toyota and charge more for them, make sure the damn things aren't going to fall apart on the people that buy them. Or you'll ensure that they buy Toyota in the future.

:lol: I think GM has given Toyota more sales than Toyota's advertising could hope to get them.


I know it's just a handful of cars, but I've had the following GM cars that have not "fallen apart after a few years":

2004 GTO
2002 Monte Carlo SS
1999 Camaro Z28
1997 S-10 ZR2
1995 Corvette
1990 Beretta (beater car with 160,000+ miles on a 4-banger)
1989 Camaro RS
1978 Grand Prix


The GTO and Monte Carlo have/had never seen the dealership except the day I bought them. The Z28 had a power window motor fail, but that was all. The ZR2 had a bad firewall weld from the factory.... annoying, but that was the only problem, and it was fixed. The Corvette had no problems. The Beretta, surprisingly enough, had no problems, and I owned it from 145k to 160+k miles. The Camaro RS lasted me 5 years, and had some annoyances (rattling dash board, etc) but no major repairs over that time... and the Grand Prix was my first car.... I got it for $1200 back in 1988.

Add to that my wife's 2004 Grand Prix GTP, and 2001 Monte Carlo SS that have been trouble free (though I am on record as not being a fan of the Grand Prix's interior) and a 2001 Blazer LT that have all not "fallen apart", and, at least from personal experience.... I think your statement is just plain ignorant and false.

I just can't stand these generic, sweeping statements. I rarely see any GM car broken down or "falling apart" on the highway.... at least anything under 10-12 years old.

I CERTAINLY see many, many more OLD, beat up GM cars on the road than I do old Japanese cars.... they may not look so pretty anymore, but they are still running after years and years of use and abuse.... Can't say that I see a ton of 80's Japanese cars on the roads today.... :think:

I certainly think GM has some issues. Their product lineup has some GLARING holes in it. They are behind the mark, IMO, in interior MATERIAL quality..... They are slow to get new product out, and some of their styling has been uninspired as of late.... but saying that their vehicles "fall apart after a few years" is ignorant and false.

I know it's just a handful of cars, but I've had the following GM cars that have not "fallen apart after a few years":

2004 GTO
2002 Monte Carlo SS
1999 Camaro Z28
1997 S-10 ZR2
1995 Corvette
1990 Beretta (beater car with 160,000+ miles on a 4-banger)
1989 Camaro RS
1978 Grand Prix


The GTO and Monte Carlo have/had never seen the dealership except the day I bought them. The Z28 had a power window motor fail, but that was all. The ZR2 had a bad firewall weld from the factory.... annoying, but that was the only problem, and it was fixed. The Corvette had no problems. The Beretta, surprisingly enough, had no problems, and I owned it from 145k to 160+k miles. The Camaro RS lasted me 5 years, and had some annoyances (rattling dash board, etc) but no major repairs over that time... and the Grand Prix was my first car.... I got it for $1200 back in 1988.

Add to that my wife's 2004 Grand Prix GTP, and 2001 Monte Carlo SS that have been trouble free (though I am on record as not being a fan of the Grand Prix's interior) and a 2001 Blazer LT that have all not "fallen apart", and, at least from personal experience.... I think your statement is just plain ignorant and false.

I just can't stand these generic, sweeping statements. I rarely see any GM car broken down or "falling apart" on the highway.... at least anything under 10-12 years old.

I CERTAINLY see many, many more OLD, beat up GM cars on the road than I do old Japanese cars.... they may not look so pretty anymore, but they are still running after years and years of use and abuse.... Can't say that I see a ton of 80's Japanese cars on the roads today.... :think:

I certainly think GM has some issues. Their product lineup has some GLARING holes in it. They are behind the mark, IMO, in interior MATERIAL quality..... They are slow to get new product out, and some of their styling has been uninspired as of late.... but saying that their vehicles "fall apart after a few years" is ignorant and false.

That's a very good point, but also a good counter point. I thinks it's a strong perception that GM cars last very long, probably longer than alot of competitor's cars. However, on average the number of poeple keeping their cars that long is, I'm guessing, very small. It's my perception that the majority of people get rid of their (primary) car after 70-80K miles.

What I think has really hurt GM is that their cars don't feel as good as a Honda or Toyota when new(er). Laugh it you will, as an example my experience as an Industrial Designer is when you shop two newer or new cars, the way the the switch gears moves and feels, interior material quality (either real or percieved), the way the doors sound when shut, the way the engine idles or runs, and alot of little details can sway the opinion of the majority of the buying public who are NOT as enthusiastic as we are. GM hasn't sweat the details for a VERY long time.

A specific example is my '94 GP. While handsom enough, there are 3 really annoying problems (IMO); 1.) the HVAC controls shouldn't be a reach to turn. While I respect the aesthetics the dash has by curving back in that area, the ergonomics are bad. 2.) the glove compartment and glovebox are atrotious designs. The overlaping of parts to hide part lines (and poor, inconsistant build quality) is pretty Sh*tty. 3.) The turn signal stalk (like most GM products until recently) and it's 'breaking chicken bones' fell when using just screams cheap. Comparable Imports from the same years are much better executed.

Again, if you're not an enthusiast for the brand, the initial perception of the product makes a big impact.

It's only recently GM has addressed these issues (to varying success) and it will take some time to convince alot of folks to change their opinion after 15-20 years.

That's a very good point, but also a good counter point. I thinks it's a strong perception that GM cars last very long, probably longer than alot of competitor's cars. However, on average the number of poeple keeping their cars that long is, I'm guessing, very small. It's my perception that the majority of people get rid of their (primary) car after 70-80K miles.

What I think has really hurt GM is that their cars don't feel as good as a Honda or Toyota when new(er). Laugh it you will, as an example my experience as an Industrial Designer is when you shop two newer or new cars, the way the the switch gears moves and feels, interior material quality (either real or percieved), the way the doors sound when shut, the way the engine idles or runs, and alot of little details can sway the opinion of the majority of the buying public who are NOT as enthusiastic as we are. GM hasn't sweat the details for a VERY long time.

A specific example is my '94 GP. While handsom enough, there are 3 really annoying problems (IMO); 1.) the HVAC controls shouldn't be a reach to turn. While I respect the aesthetics the dash has by curving back in that area, the ergonomics are bad. 2.) the glove compartment and glovebox are atrotious designs. The overlaping of parts to hide part lines (and poor, inconsistant build quality) is pretty Sh*tty. 3.) The turn signal stalk (like most GM products until recently) and it's 'breaking chicken bones' fell when using just screams cheap. Comparable Imports from the same years are much better executed.

Again, if you're not an enthusiast for the brand, the initial perception of the product makes a big impact.

It's only recently GM has addressed these issues (to varying success) and it will take some time to convince alot of folks to change their opinion after 15-20 years.


I absoluetly agree with you. :thumb:

Interior quality is one of my biggest beefs with GM recently. I think GTO shows that a branch of GM can do the interior materials right (it's not perfect, but it's by far the best GM interior I've been in)... and it looks like Cobalt, of all things, is showing that GMNA *CAN* do a nice interior as far as touch and feel goes.

I hope they are turning the corner on interiors, because I think you are spot-on. EVERYONE sits INSIDE their car EVERYDAY when they drive... and if it is not pleasing to be in, you aren't going to want to drive it.

Interiors have come a long way over the last few years, industry-wide, so GM does need to step up to the plate.

That being said, as much as I dislike a cheap, hollow feeling hard plastic dash piece, it certainly won't make the car fall apart in a few years....

I absoluetly agree with you. :thumb:

Interior quality is one of my biggest beefs with GM recently. I think GTO shows that a branch of GM can do the interior materials right (it's not perfect, but it's by far the best GM interior I've been in)... and it looks like Cobalt, of all things, is showing that GMNA *CAN* do a nice interior as far as touch and feel goes.

I hope they are turning the corner on interiors, because I think you are spot-on. EVERYONE sits INSIDE their car EVERYDAY when they drive... and if it is not pleasing to be in, you aren't going to want to drive it.

Interiors have come a long way over the last few years, industry-wide, so GM does need to step up to the plate.

That being said, as much as I dislike a cheap, hollow feeling hard plastic dash piece, it certainly won't make the car fall apart in a few years....

To add to your list...

Mailbu
G6
Equinox (although not as good as I expected)
new GP

All are executed miles ahead of their predesessors. Of course as a designer there are a few things I'd do different... :p

Now people just need to consider and compare!

The problem is that GM builds cars that fall apart after a few years, cost more than the competition, and look like rental cars to top it off.

Take a "bland" POS GM vehicle that is accepted on this board, or take a Toyota, which will make you evil on this board, and is considered boring looking on this board, yet will be reliable and give you your moneys worth.

That's the problem. If you're going to make "boring cars" like Toyota and charge more for them, make sure the damn things aren't going to fall apart on the people that buy them. Or you'll ensure that they buy Toyota in the future.

:lol: I think GM has given Toyota more sales than Toyota's advertising could hope to get them.


fall apart? Really. How many 15 to 20 year old Hondas, Toyota, Nissans, Datsun to to see on the road? How many? Tell how many? I see more mid 80 GM cars on the road than I do mid 80 imports. Who's kidding who here?

Errr, there are plenty of late 80s and early 90s imports on the road here. You have to realize the Camry was RWD until 1983. Camry didn't offer a V6 until the late 80s and that's when it began to really sell, think it reached 5th on the top 10 most popular vehicle list in 1989.

The Accord didn't hit best selling car status until 1990...

-B

Errr, there are plenty of late 80s and early 90s imports on the road here. You have to realize the Camry was RWD until 1983. Camry didn't offer a V6 until the late 80s and that's when it began to really sell, think it reached 5th on the top 10 most popular vehicle list in 1989.

-B

Camry is but one Japanese car.

And, FWIW, I see a good amount of old Monte Carlos, Cutlass Supremes, Delta 88's, etc that are all RWD too... not to mention old trucks that seem to never die.

Then you have the plethora of Ford Tempos, old Cavailers, Celebrities, Sunbirds, and other cheap American econoboxes that are still running everyday with well over 100k on them.

I wonder if there is a way to see how many cars of a particular make and model were sold, and how many are still registered... :think:

I wonder if there is a way to see how many cars of a particular make and model were sold, and how many are still registered... :think:

I'm sure there are industry records lying around some where, an I would think various states' DMVs would have the registration records.

I'm sure there are industry records lying around some where, an I would think various states' DMVs would have the registration records.


Ya, I've been looking around on DMV sites and such for a bit now, but can't find anything so far. :(

Gm has to many of its own companies competing with each other. ankd even then the cars are bland or are rebadged daewoos. they need to bring some exciting cars out for the main brands like Chevrolet and pontiac, boot saturn, sure the sky is nice but not worth it at the price of making chevy look bad , the only thing chevy has going for them is the new cobalt which really i only like the SS and the vette, dont mind the impala espesially with the SS but that and the monte are being turned into the ugliest cars on the market.

come on Gm follow the design cues of Chrysler. we need a 300c not a waste of money like a malibu maxx SS, they think slapping an SS on everything will boost sales, these are what the cars should be in the first place

Exactly, like the XLR, what idiot would pay that? They did much better when each division was unique with its own engines and body panels.

The same idiot that would buy the Mercedes or Lexus hard top verts.


GM doesn't need SAAB in the USA.

Saturn should be GMs Scion, not GMs second Pontiac.

Lutz cars just start coming out this year, hopfully they can turn things around.

I can see SAAB and Pontiac going, but not Buick ...

Saturn seems to be poised to cover SAAB and Pontiac "excitement." Chevy can cover Pontiac "excitement" as well, especially with the liberal use of "SS" (for better or worse). The GTO and Vibe would fit well into Chevy's line-up.

I really think Saturn can pull it off, given the generally positive dealership experiences. My in-laws no longer own Saturns, but that's because they have outgrown the products in terms of content and size. They still talk positively about the old Saturns they used to have, and there were several.

Personally, I think the SAAB's are some of the better looking, cleaner designs, although I would have a hard time justifying the SAAB premium.

With some Opel and SAAB like designs covering the Pontiac price ranges, I think Saturn could do well. However, Saturn should not abandon the entry level segment ... that's where they started and should remain, just maybe bring more interesting designs to bear, like OPEL, Scion, or Nissan. I think Saturn would have a difficult time obtaining premium prices in the short term.

Buick serves the middle class baby boomers approaching retirement age that would never lay out the $$ for a Cadillac. Affordable, dependable luxury with American heritage.

Lutz cars just start coming out this year, hopfully they can turn things around.

Exactly, but I don't think well see a significant change in trends for 4-5 years. 1-2 years of better sales doesn't nessesarily mean the ship has changed course, and I honesty feel (unfortunately) it might take a year or two for the mainstream buyers to recognize GM again.

GM doesn't need SAAB in the USA.

Saturn should be GMs Scion, not GMs second Pontiac.
Yes.

Or they could just kill Pontiac, and tell the second largest dealer network they are SOL.

Fall apart my ass :mad: What a load of crap. My buddy drives a wrecker for a living and he tells me, he gets more calls for broken down bmw's and chrysler products than anything else. Usually its something electrical. Oh and FWIW he is not a GM guy. He's a ford truck fan. Boy Nader really did a number on you ppl. GM Has the best product. Has someone changed this site to I HATE GM .COM or what? :rolleyes: I guess I must have mist that bulletin, while I was eatin' hamburgers and watchin smokey and the bandit... Woo Hoo! I guess I should get myself some copies of C&D or R&T so I too can be schooled on how American product sucks! NOT! :rolleyes: Oh BTW my GM stuff doesn't fall apart either :) . Hey if anyone at GM is reading this start spending some advertising $, cuz this crap is really getting old. You can have a great product but if no one knows it, what the hell is the point? :confused:

GM: No plans to phase out any brands

By Jason Stein
Automotive News / March 24, 2005

DETROIT -- General Motors reasserted on Thursday it has no intention of eliminating any of its brands in the future.

Mark LaNeve, vice president of sales and marketing for GM, told Automotive News the automaker is investing heavily in all eight brands. Phasing out a particular division is not under consideration.

"We have no plans, or even discussions, of killing any brands," LaNeve said, "We're investing more heavily than ever in product and marketing programs."

On Wednesday, GM Vice Chairman Robert Lutz told a Morgan Stanley Automotive conference in New York if one of GM's "troubled brands" fails to turn around, "then we'd have to take a look at a phase-out," Lutz said.

Published reports linked Pontiac and Buick to Lutz's comments.

LaNeve reemphasized in a message to dealers Thursday that both brands are safe.

LaNeve also said GM is managing Buick, Pontiac and GMC as one channel and providing those divisions with a product portfolio "to service that channel and to focus " the lineup.

That represents a key difference from Oldsmobile, which GM killed last year, he said.

"These portfolios we're going to deliver we don't have to deliver an A to Z portfolio for those three brands," he said. "We can tighten and focus them. I'd rather have four or five great Pontiacs or Buicks than eight undistinguishable products. That business model makes a lot of sense."

I want GM to grow, not downsize, so no its not good! :(

GM execs have been saying for months that Saab is no longer even close to profitable and they see no reason to keep it around. Saabs sell pretty well around here (except for the 92-X), but elsewhere they aren't doin too hot.

Saab should be eliminated, it is a waste of resources. Saab USA is selling only a few thousand cars more yearly than Chevy sells in Corvette's alone. :eek:

I dont buy this notion about Pontiac being cancelled. They sell a large number of cars. Grand Prix is a very good seller and the G6 doesnt have a coupe clone over at Chevy. Furthermore, Pontiac is a cornerstone in GM's channel strategy of putting Pontiac-Buick-GMC brands together in the same location. A buick-gmc only strategy wouldnt cut it. If any of the larger brands go it would be Buick.