'91 Mustang 5.0 vrs '94 Z28

Stang has the following: 150k STRONG motor for its age, Shorty headers of some sort, Aftermarket CAI, 5 speed, SFC's, UCA's, Pullies, 16" tire option, and a V-Force exhaust (dynomax).

I have what's in my sig, and it's up to date. Alright, I know that this year of stang was rated at 225 HP, so with the pullies + CAI + Headers He is looking at around 250-260? His car also weighs 2800 Ibs and is about 3020 with him in it... Mine weighs 3550 with me in the car.

So, who's going to win? I can't help but feel like I have the advantage of horsepower, but with his suspension work and light weight, and it being a 5 speed, I am a little worried. Should I be? He's a decent driver, and I'm in an auto so I'm just going to mash it and hold on. He's the kind of person that believes that Jesus himself came down and Hand built every single mustang. He really thinks they are unbeatable by any Camaro. I'd love nothing more than to completely annihilate him like 3 or 4 times in a row.

I'm giving him time to re-learn how to drive a manual, since he hasn't in a long time. I just want there to be NO excuses at all when who ever wins. He told me my car was crap, I told him it would woop the sh!t outa his car anyday. So the challenge is there. Probably be a week or so before we race.

So, in all honesty, who do you think will win?

Hard to say, he seems pretty damn light. I say it comes down to who hooks better, some 5.0's are a total joke, some have been well maintained and run well, it iss hard to say.

No, you'll win. You start at 275 horses. He doesn't.

The main things I am worried about are his weight advantage, suspension, and the fact that its a manual. I know I have him beat in the power department, I just hope the other things don't allow him to catch up.

No, you'll win. You start at 275 horses. He doesn't.No, an auto LT1 starts at about 245-250 to the wheels, the Mustang is probrally at 200-210 to the wheels stock, the Mustang has the advantage of the 5-speed, and weights about 500 pounds less than the LT1 maybe even more, I am not saying the LT1 is gonna lose, and if I had to bet I would go with the LT1, but it is not gonna be a blow out by any means. Sometimes guys fail to factor in weight, taking out 100 pounds from a car is like adding 10HP, give or take.

Where do you get 210 to the wheels from? They are rated at 225 at the fly wheel, that means about 191 at the wheels with a 15% power loss, which is about right considering their stock ET's are around 15 seconds.

No, an auto LT1 starts at about 245-250 to the wheels, the Mustang is probrally at 200-210 to the wheels stock, the Mustang has the advantage of the 5-speed, and weights about 500 pounds less than the LT1 maybe even more, I am not saying the LT1 is gonna lose, and if I had to bet I would go with the LT1, but it is not gonna be a blow out by any means. Sometimes guys fail to factor in weight, taking out 100 pounds from a car is like adding 10HP, give or take.

Obviously, I meant at the crank. The 5-speed advantage is diminshed when the auto has a higher gearing and such. Of course, if he had a higher stall then I doubt there would be a "manual advantage" at all.

The 5.0's put down over 200 at the wheels, not much over but they did, and as some of you guys may know, many of them ran 13's from the factory back in the early 90's, so all this 15 second BS is way off base, yes, there are ALOT of run down 5.0 cars out there that turn HORRIBLE times, don't get me wrong. But I am going off what you said, that that is that this guys motor runs strong. If that is true, with his mods, he would lay down between 220-230rwhp. With your mods I would guess you are between 255-265, but with that MASSIVE weight advantage he has on you, that power is not as big as a factor. I say it comes down to if he can drive or not, but I think your car will pull on him in the higher speeds reguardless, when weight is not such a factor, good luck, let us know the results.

Someone who has a 5.0 on this board just had a competition, to "guess" his ET after he did a few mods to it, I can't remember who but it was an AOD 5.0 and he got a 15.013 or something. Another one on this board with a relatively strong 5.0 did something like 14.8 with mods. I can't remember their names, I suck with names, but I've never heard of a stock 5.0 running anywhere near the 13's. The lowest I've seen them run (stock) is somewhere around 14.5.

Also, I think you might be a little low on the estimate of my RWHP, if I'm at 245-250 stock like you said, well, MadZ28 garantee's 13 RWHP alone on a stock motor, and i got tuned for gears and headers. That alone puts me at 258-263. Then Add headers, Gears, CAI, Exhaust... Those will all add probably around atleast 5-10 each, and I'm lowballing it.

I still think I have a pretty massive HP advantage.

Someone who has a 5.0 on this board just had a competition, to "guess" his ET after he did a few mods to it, I can't remember who but it was an AOD 5.0 and he got a 15.013 or something. Another one on this board with a relatively strong 5.0 did something like 14.8 with mods. I can't remember their names, I suck with names, but I've never heard of a stock 5.0 running anywhere near the 13's. The lowest I've seen them run (stock) is somewhere around 14.5.

Also, I think you might be a little low on the estimate of my RWHP, if I'm at 245-250 stock like you said, well, MadZ28 garantee's 13 RWHP alone on a stock motor, and i got tuned for gears and headers. That alone puts me at 258-263. Then Add headers, Gears, CAI, Exhaust... Those will all add probably around atleast 5-10 each, and I'm lowballing it.

I still think I have a pretty massive HP advantage.

And there is another one here that ran 14.2 at 98 bone dead stock (blackhatch) and another (millhouse) running mid 13's at 101 with very little done.

Saying that, the 5.0's mods have him at 200 rwhp at the most. Most 5spd 87-93 5.0's were at the 190 rhwp mark in stock form. The LT-1 will win by a nice margin.

The 5.0's put down over 200 at the wheels, not much over but they did, and as some of you guys may know, many of them ran 13's from the factory back in the early 90's, so all this 15 second BS is way off base, yes, there are ALOT of run down 5.0 cars out there that turn HORRIBLE times, don't get me wrong. But I am going off what you said, that that is that this guys motor runs strong. If that is true, with his mods, he would lay down between 220-230rwhp. With your mods I would guess you are between 255-265, but with that MASSIVE weight advantage he has on you, that power is not as big as a factor. I say it comes down to if he can drive or not, but I think your car will pull on him in the higher speeds reguardless, when weight is not such a factor, good luck, let us know the results.

Your breath stinks. You're talking ****. No FACTORY 5.0s ran 13s. Idiot. 15 second car is EXACTLY right.

Woah Woah Woah... I don't want to start a pissing contest here. I knew there were some quick 5.0's here, but my assumptions with the 190RWHP were correct, thats all I wanted to get by. 14.2 dead stock is pretty damn good for a 5.0, he must be an excellent driver. Same for the one with mid 13's with little done to it. I can assure you that my friend's driving abilitly isn't near that good.

I feel a little better though knowing that someone with a 5.0 told me I was going to win by a nice margin. Makes me feel more confident :D

Woah Woah Woah... I don't want to start a pissing contest here. I knew there were some quick 5.0's here, but my assumptions with the 190RWHP were correct, thats all I wanted to get by. 14.2 dead stock is pretty damn good for a 5.0, he must be an excellent driver. Same for the one with mid 13's with little done to it. I can assure you that my friend's driving abilitly isn't near that good.

I feel a little better though knowing that someone with a 5.0 told me I was going to win by a nice margin. Makes me feel more confident :D

Well, this jackass isn't spewing bull****. MANY 13 second STOCK 5.0s? :rolleyes:

Will somebody with a clue please tell this moron that back in the day stock 5.0 coupe 5-speeds ran 13.9 on more than one occasion, I could pull up many articles but I am to lazy to argue with somebody dumb enough to think stock 5.0's run 15's. Am I saying this was the norm, not at all, but it has been done many times over the years. And I see you live in Pearland as well. What are your mods? I have a near stock 4.6 if you wanna run em?

Will somebody with a clue please tell this moron that back in the day stock 5.0 coupe 5-speeds ran 13.9 on more than one occasion, I could pull up many articles but I am to lazy to argue with somebody dumb enough to think stock 5.0's run 15's. Am I saying this was the norm, not at all, but it has been done many times over the years. And I see you live in Pearland as well. What are your mods? I have a near stock 4.6 if you wanna run em?

Then how come I know a few people with stock 5.0s that were in the 15s? Why don't you pull the articles for me? It's just extremely difficult for me to believe, that's all.

Where's Steve Y when ya need him? :lol:

Yes I have personaly witnessed a 1990 mustang gt rip off a 13.9 that was bone stock to my knowledge but then agan i have also witnessed a tpi firebird run in the 13s with very litte work also.

quote me on staing the facts that a stock 5.0 stang is a low 15 second car stock,and is not much of a match for an lt1.as far as 5.0s being completely stock and running 13s,its never happened.a low 14 second 5.0 is considered godly.actually the lt1 camaro was considered state of the art for running high 13s in the 1/4 mile and was something that was never done by a 3rd gen or early 4th gen stang with the 15 second 5.0.

quote me on staing the facts that a stock 5.0 stang is a low 15 second car stock,and is not much of a match for an lt1.as far as 5.0s being completely stock and running 13s,its never happened.a low 14 second 5.0 is considered godly.actually the lt1 camaro was considered state of the art for running high 13s in the 1/4 mile and was something that was never done by a 3rd gen or early 4th gen stang with the 15 second 5.0.

Bravo. People lie. "Oh, my 5.0 is "stock".

Woah Woah Woah... I don't want to start a pissing contest here. I knew there were some quick 5.0's here, but my assumptions with the 190RWHP were correct, thats all I wanted to get by. 14.2 dead stock is pretty damn good for a 5.0, he must be an excellent driver. Same for the one with mid 13's with little done to it. I can assure you that my friend's driving abilitly isn't near that good.

I feel a little better though knowing that someone with a 5.0 told me I was going to win by a nice margin. Makes me feel more confident :D

It's just the truth. I've seen similar cars with your mods trapping in the 107 range.

Then how come I know a few people with stock 5.0s that were in the 15s? Why don't you pull the articles for me? It's just extremely difficult for me to believe, that's all.

I'll give an example, though it will be slightly off stock as to what can happen with neglect. I had a friend with an 89 notch AOD, 130,000 miles, slipping AOD and it smoked. It was clearly abused and he was losing to another friends 3.8 5spd firebird. I looked at it and found the original 1989 dated plug wires!!! It had never been tuned in it's harsh life. I changed the plugs and wires, cap, rotor and fuel filter. I then bumped the timing to 14 degrees BTDC, descreened the MAF, removed the air silencer and put the TPS to .98 volt. With this and showing him how to do the 1-3-1 shuffle for the AOD (so it does not short shift or skip over 2nd gear) it improved from a 16.1 at 88 to 14.59 at 95 in 90 degree heat with above mentioned slipping tranny and crapped out engine. There are a lot of cars these days that time has ravaged, and a lot of tools who have bought them who have no clue as to what a spark plug is. You also live in Texas, hardly the place where the best 1/4 mile times are run. East coast tracks are where some of the fastest stock 5.0 times were run. I would love to have some sea level air to run in, my times came with a 2200 ft. density altitude.

I agree with scott, I think it's entirely possibly for them to run low 14's stock, though I have never seen them in the high 13's or even heard of it, until now. The more I think about it, the more and more I feel that my friend's 5.0 won't really be a problem. I can't wait to see his face when I show him whats up.

A direct quote from him last night:
"I want to be the CHP officer that drives the pursuit mustang."
"Haha... not in california. You'll only get to drive LS1 Z28's."
"They don't sell Camaro's anymore, they finally pulled that piece of crap off the market."
"Dude, they're coming back in '07... they only canned them so that the GTO would have no inner competition..."
"Yeah, and its taking them 3 years just to make them decent."
"My CRAP car will woop the **** out of your piece of **** 5.SLOW. Call my car crap, I'm calling you out, whenever you're ready, ass."

As you can see, I count the days until I make him say "My worthless Mustang is an Inferior vehicle compared to your incredibly awesome Chevrolet Camaro. I was wrong, and I am ignorant to the obvious facts."

Well Maybe I won't make him say that, but everyday for like a month I'm going to give him **** for losing.

I agree with scott, I think it's entirely possibly for them to run low 14's stock, though I have never seen them in the high 13's or even heard of it, until now. The more I think about it, the more and more I feel that my friend's 5.0 won't really be a problem. I can't wait to see his face when I show him whats up.

A direct quote from him last night:
"I want to be the CHP officer that drives the pursuit mustang."
"Haha... not in california. You'll only get to drive LS1 Z28's."
"They don't sell Camaro's anymore, they finally pulled that piece of crap off the market."
"Dude, they're coming back in '07... they only canned them so that the GTO would have no inner competition..."
"Yeah, and its taking them 3 years just to make them decent."
"My CRAP car will woop the **** out of your piece of **** 5.SLOW. Call my car crap, I'm calling you out, whenever you're ready, ass."

As you can see, I count the days until I make him say "My worthless Mustang is an Inferior vehicle compared to your incredibly awesome Chevrolet Camaro. I was wrong, and I am ignorant to the obvious facts."

Well Maybe I won't make him say that, but everyday for like a month I'm going to give him **** for losing.

I'll puy it this way, if you race to 100 from a dead stop and don't spin you should win by at least 10 cars. You should be trapping about 10 mph faster than him.

Awesome.

You will win easily. I raced a 91 5.0 in my 97 z28(Convertible) He had a flowmaster exhaust,New tires and a 5 speed and was a good driver ,I had a bone stock z28 (at that time)Which is a auto and a convertible.I raced him to 70 from a stop with me spinning alot and I had him by 2 cars.

Well, unless he's done some serious weight reduction mods, 2800lbs is way to light for a 91 notch, let alone anything else. You shouldnt have a problem winning if you can trap 100+....but if you dont get traction and he does, it's going to be close up to around 100mph or so. If you were to go from let's say a 60mph roll, you shouldnt have any diffaculties.

On the topic of stock 87-93 5.0's running 13's, mine was damn close to being one of them. When I finally broke the barrier, I had an o/r h-pip (necissary due to age) being my only true mod. There was over 160k on the ticker too, so I'd have to believe if I had bought this puppy new, I would have been able to fare just as well without any mods.

Several magazines have put stock notchs in the deep 14's...while very few have them documented in the high 13's. Now in this day and age, several have seen better days, while several more have just downright been to hell and back. Dont mistake a poorly maintained, untuned 5.0 for a well running one though...just because everyone thinks they are slow.

I went 97.5mph in my 5.0, which is a GT (140k), and I don't have pullies or headers. I ran 1.5mph faster on an 1/8th mile only run so my car probably has more in it, I only made 1 1/4 mile run. If he's as light as he says he is, he might beat you.

enough of who will win!!! tell him you want to race today and go do it!! three are always arguments of who would win with this and this...... go race and let us know how you do. my friend who owns a 99 ls1 said he would kick my stangs ass with the mods i have (w/o nitrous). i ended up beating him pretty good. when i kicked the nitrous on, i killed him. you never know until you race. he could even miss a gear and you will kick his ass. my brother runs 13.8's with gears and exhaust in his 89 stang lx. FYI GO RACE AND TELL US HOW IT WENT!!!! GOOD LUCK! :p

You will win. Just go race and find out.

I've never heard of a bone stock 13 second 5.0. I have heard of free mod 13 second 5.0s, though. You will kill his dumb a**. Race him soon and report back to us!

I went 97.5mph in my 5.0, which is a GT (140k), and I don't have pullies or headers. I ran 1.5mph faster on an 1/8th mile only run so my car probably has more in it, I only made 1 1/4 mile run. If he's as light as he says he is, he might beat you.

The Z-28 has headers and gears though, those 2 things are going to make this a blowout.

I've never heard of a bone stock 13 second 5.0. I have heard of free mod 13 second 5.0s, though. You will kill his dumb a**. Race him soon and report back to us!

Pretty much the truth. You are usually hearing of great air in the mix as well. Notice when MM&FF gets their best times it's cold as hell.

Steve Y: Yes sir. :D

The curb weight of a '91 LX 5.0 is 2824 Pounds.
http://www.intellichoice.com/reports/vehicleReport.cfm/vehicle_nmb/100008410/section/specs
That is where I got my info on the car, I don't know how accurate that is, but thats what I based my assumptions on. I stirred the pot a little last night, I saw him hanging out and I walked over to him with a few of my other friends (one of them being another die-hard Ford guy, but smart, and respectful so we get along real good) and he told him this: "Pat, I love your car and all, but you're going to get smoked. Real Bad." Pat just shook his had and chuckled to himself, so I knew I could piss him off by saying things like 5 slow this and 5 slow that, most of them being untrue, and I knew that.

He still hasn't given me any time or anything, I even told him last night, "I want to race you." and I got no responce.

It will happen though, and when it does, you can all rest assured that it will posted here in every detail.

It's a, "no duh", situation..lol

That Stang should weigh about 3050 lbs. w/o him in it. It should have about 25 more rwhp than stock, but the 150K miles should kill 10+ rwhp. So he should have about 205 rwhp and weigh about 3250 lbs. You should have about 285 rwhp and weigh about 3700 lbs. That puts you at a much better power to weight ratio. You should win easy!

i seriously doubt a well maintained engine with 150 k miles is going to lose 10 hp if tooken good care of.the actual weight of a lt1 camaro coupe is 3390.

My race weight is actually 3550, well, 3552 to be exact.

every time I read that, I laugh 'cause it's so catchy... "five point slow". "craparo", "slowmaro", not clever at ALL.

anyway, let us know when you get to run against him!

I had similar mods to u on my 97, use to race a 93 fox body w/ similar mods..id run him everytime