Muncie M21, M22, or Super T10 for my 69 Camaro

I just got my project 69 camaro, and will be going through the motor soon. I got a moderetly modified 69 302 crate motor, and was wondering what the trans should be. The rear end is a 12 bolt 3.55 posi. A muncie 21 was stock for a 302, but would a M22 rockcrusher be much better. The price is a bit steeper on those. Or should i go with the later Super T10? I am not realy sure which one will be the best. I can get any of the 3, but which one will really be the best for my money. This thing is being built as an occasional race car, so which one will stand up to the abuse. I definitly want a 4 speed ,and I have narrowed it down to these 3. Someone please help me out.
~~Thx~!~
FIEF!

If you plan on beating on it, go with the Super T10, or a Tremec trans. The input shaft on the Muncies are smaller, and parts and gear ratios for the T10 are much easier to find.

I have a 69 as well and put the M-21 in it, with 22 gears. You may want to keep you car as original as possible. That is kind of how I was thinking.

If it helps, I have had no problems with the tranny and and have about 500 HP going through it. I like the M-22. Some people don't but why change the car from original. If you are going to change it from original there are better options. Also there is a guy in Chicago who rebuilds the M-22's. There is also another guy I think in Rockford.

good luck on your choice

Kissel

How big a cam are you using? If you are going to run a big cam in your 302, then a Super T-10 with 2.64 or 2.88 first gear would be easier to get going than a 21/22 with a 2.2 first gear. But at the disadvantage of greater rpm drop between gears due to the wider ratio spread.

thanks for replying. We are planning on running a moderate cam. The motor is already outrageous and we don't want to push it on a somewhat street car. I want to keep the trans within the time period, but because its not a real Z-28 im not really stuck with a m21. So if you guys can keep contributing your opinions it would be helpful.
thx
!@$FIEF!@

I have a 1969 that has a Super T10 in it and aside from that annoying leaking rear seal (the one that I just replaced) I'm pretty happy with it. I eventually plan to get a T-5 or similar (like to highway drive and would like OD) but for now the ST-10 handles the beating I occaisionally give it from stop-light to stop-light or at the local strip.

BTW...anyone know what's up with the leaking rear seal? Coudl the yolk be worn? Or is this normal? Could it be the wrong fluid? What fluid should I be using?

Keep in mind the noise of the M22 if it is going to see a lot of street use.
Why not a T56? :)

I'd put a t-56 out of an lt1 car in it, they are pretty strong plus they still have two extra gears to catch so you can run a steep rear end gears. That's what the plans for mine are, you have to cut the trans tunnel about four inches and get a different crossmember but there is a guy on this forum who has custom crossmember already made and can make you one too, if interested look up screen name kobuzz. The guy is bad ass. just my $.02

I love my T-10. I bought it brand new so it shifts really smooth and has had no problems. It's pretty damn loud though. Really, really loud. And it's light because of the aluminum case.

Also it's fun to tell people you have a nascar transmission :)

Originally posted by Davidhm

BTW...anyone know what's up with the leaking rear seal? Coudl the yolk be worn? Or is this normal? Could it be the wrong fluid? What fluid should I be using?

Your yoke could have a groove worn on it, but there is another possibility. Yokes have a plug that sits in the middle of the "U" portion. Sometimes they get loose and leak. So yoke stays wet even after you replace seal, cause gear lube slings all over.

If it is seal, you can usually see lube ooze around perimeter of seal.

Stangitr = How much hp does your motor make? I looked into T-10s, they seem SO WEAK!!!!!!! Their heaviest duty one seems to only handle 375 TQ MAX! Is this true? How you can you use that tranny and not have it blow up? Can you beef them up? Ones I have seen in the catalogs are weak as hell, even the "Super" T-10s. Please englighten me! :) I wish I had a 4 spd in my car, converting it must be a bitch........


Edit = You estimate 370hp/400TQ.......Damn, how does it the trans hold lol! Maybe I was reading it wrong, but I went to richmond's website, and I still can't udnerstand it.....

Since you already have 3.55 gears, I would recommend a T-10 (or Super T-10) with a 2.88 First gear. That will give you a 10.2 overall First gear to get you get off the line nicely. Yes, the rpm drop between gears will be more, but hopefully it won't be a problem. (A 2.20 First gear Muncie and a 3.55 would result in a miserable 7.8 overall First gear, and you'd never hook!)
302s aren't really torque monsters, so any of the four speeds you are considering ought to hold up. :)
Richmond's T-10s are really made for oval track racing, and they have aluminum cases. About the strongest regular synchromesh trans would be either an M22 (especially with a SuperCase) or a nodular iron case Super T-10. And swapping isn't really as hard as one might think. You'd just have to find a donor car and you'd be all set.

The T56 is the way to go. Kobuzz acually used my T56 crossmember in his LS1 motivated camaro. I have a complete install kit for these transmissions, and you don't need to cut the tunnel at all, save for the hole for the shifter. Take a look:
http://www.pro-touring.com/t56/index.htm
Tyler

Dude, stay strong! Be hardcore and stick with a four speed :metal:

thx for all the replies, i have finnaly made my decision. I will go with a Muncie M21, or M22 whichever one is avalible first. I was seriously thinking about a 6 speed, but I want to stay original with the 4 speed, thx for all your opinions. :)

http://camarox.cz28.com/camaro%20007%20%28Small%29.jpg

Really? Not even a T-10? :confused: If you're determined to have a Muncie, think about getting a wide ratio. 302s are pretty low on torque, so that 3.55 rear will need a deeper First gear than 2.20 :alert: