PCM4less -vs- Madwolf tuning

I've heard great things about both. Which do you prefer?

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

madwolf is the man...he did my tune and i am very happy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

he gave me 111% of his attention when i had ?'s

PCMForLess has my business, and does outstanding work on my 93's. No complaints here, nothing but good work and a ton of attention and help when needed. Alvin's the man.

I have asked Madwolf some questions also, and he's extremely helpful too. Had both of my cars not already had the PCMForLess tuning I would have probably given him a shot just to compare.

I am 100% happy with my tune from Ion.

Originally posted by Fastbird93
PCMForLess has my business, and does outstanding work on my 93's. No complaints here, nothing but good work and a ton of attention and help when needed. Alvin's the man.



Alvin??? Did Bryan Herter change his name?? LOL!!!

Nope. Alvin is the tuner for the 93 Eprom cars, the ones with the chips.

Yea the $130 seems like a fair price for a pre-programmed PCM for an OBD1, plus a $65 refund for sending yours back in. The $80 over the $99 PCMforless is also pretty nice...I think I'll be going with Ion after the cam install in a few months...

:thumb:

PCM for less has my business,my 94 Z-28 runs like it should!>Jake:>

PCM for less has my business,my 94 Z-28 runs like it should!>Jake:>

I've had both. The PCMFORLESS tuning was good, but had too much timing and was dangerously lean. I'm currently running the Madwolf tune.

so far my PCMforless experience is not so good.

first they send me an A4 ecm instead of an M6........and once they sent me the right ecm, it runs bad, and im 90% sure its in the tune because its been this way since the new computer.

Originally posted by fireman
I've had both. The PCMFORLESS tuning was good, but had too much timing and was dangerously lean. I'm currently running the Madwolf tune.

The last 2 cars I had on the dyno were the exact same way, and they were both pcmforless base tunes that the owners had purchased and had me "correct" on the dyno. Both a/f ratios were right around 15:1 and had 4-6* too much timing.

Ion does my car, Very happy with his tune, He'll be doing my cam tune in a few months as well.....

What does the tune consist of?

PCMForless had my buisness due to word of mouth. Alvin was great responding to emails and even took the time to try and nail down my tune. Suddenly he got mad at me once I changed my exhaust and never was the same. Was very cold and basically said I was on my own. Not long after I scored a deal on a blower and the weekend before I put it on I emailed Alvin asking about his tune with my blower. I sent over 25 emails and never got a response to one. I kept asking him would his tune be okay with the blower? The worst part was I did searches on boards he goes to and he was responding just fine there so I know he was around. I didn't figure it could hurt too bad but I wanted to be safe so I kept race gas in the car while running. Car ran real strong until I filled up with pump gas one day by accident and took the car to work. Needless to say I ended up stranded at lunch because I had smoke pouring from the hood. I thought I had popped a piston but once I tore the motor down I found I had just blown a headgasket. After some research I found that Alvin's tunes are known for having way too much timing. Shame on me...but you live and you learn...

Whoa,

your responce was far from accurate.

I never got anything like 25 emails from you. And I responded promptly to everything you sent to me.

You need to check the address your sending them too.

If you disagree prove it.. Cause i think your being misleading... and I don't apprecate it.

Crap, that statement is just obsurd.. I never ever ignore any emails. I go out of town alot usually once ever two weeks but nothing goes unanswered. If you had a problem contacting me with email you should have used the phone.

I can't remeber what the issue was with your car, but i'm sure i gave you a option to fix what was wrong on your end or at least diagnose it.

AND i said I didn't want to just send you a chip over the internet for a blower tune.. That I would set it up safer if you sent it back. Thats pretty damn responsible on my part wouldn't you think?

How could it be my fault that a chip I set up for a Hotcammed NA car with stock injectors blew up a supercharged car. A tune with a fairly good amount of timing because of the nature of the cam. Shouldn't you have gotten the chip straight before putting the car under boost?

Remeber me saying if you wanted to get the chip burning and datalogging equipement so that i could tune it safely. Thats what I recommend for every single person who ask me about a supercharged tune. 3 things and you have a perfect car.. datalogs, on site chip burner, and a visit to confirm afr at the dyno.

The way I remeber it You where impressed with the tuning i did for you, so much so that when you got the blower OR the 4 valve heads you asked to fly me on site to tune it, I refused because i'm too busy to fly across country for one tune.

Where are you seeing that i'm notorious about having too much timing in my tune? I haven't had one report of anyone blowing up anything or spark knocking for that matter.

Settle down tiger...as far as I'm concerned you had the opportunity to speak up a long time ago when I was sending you emails. Alvin, you never once responded to a single email I sent you after you got pissed. Check the boards...I've been around a long time and have no reason to lie and I'm not a halfwit who didn't know the deal about tuning. I went to you because you came recommended and I really don't enjoy the facets of tuning like others so I thought I could put things in your hands.

I was very much impressed with your tune over Ed Wrights until I put the blower on the car. I didn't know what kind of timing tables you had setup which is why I continued to email you asking. My time was approaching and I still hadn't heard from you. I gave you the benefit of the doubt mostly because I know people don't stay at home and are regularly out but because I saw you posting on other sites (including this one, I did multiple searches on your name) I figured at that point you were just ignoring me cause you got pissed when I put the mufflex on the car after you had gotten my tune pretty close.

At this point its a mute point. Car is getting ready for the 32v motor and you will never have to worry about my tuning duties again. I just hadn't had the opportunity to share my experience since I don't just go out and intentionally bad mouth people. If that was the case there would be a couple other shops included in this. Good luck to ya...

I'm still not understanding why I never got any phone calls or anything if you had a hard time getting a hold of me VIA email.

With all the spam blockers and other internet problems isn't reasonable to think i didn't get anything from you especially when i was so dilligent about answering emails in the past? Honestly, isn't a bit irrational not to give me a call? I do have voice mail.. between the two contact methods you would have gotten a hold of me.

OH, and i swear to the all mighty that I never got pissed when tuning your car. Prehaps you took a email the wrong way. What was the real issue? I can't remeber now but i know it was something that i couldn't resolve or it was a problem on your end.. Instead of taking it that way you took it like i wasn't going to help anymore.

You can't say that I didn't help you after the mufflex install because at the time i was doing unlimited 6 months of free changes AND you where sending me datalogs.

I never tell anyone that its not my problem. Hell i've been helping one guy with a surge problem for freaking months now and its pretty obvious its non-tuning related.

FYI, my and i'm sure Ion's and Bryan's hotcam tunes are for what... hotcams not blowers. They all have way too much timing to be safe for a forced induction car.


What I think happend is a blower kit fell in your hands in over a weeekend you had it on and running. Before you knew it was safe you where putting the car under boost and you ruinied your stock motor. AND by the way, you knew i told you that i wasn't confortable doing speed density supercharged tunes over the mail, that a on site chip burner and datalogger was needed for me to tune over the net, same thing i said when you where talking to me about the 32 valve heads

You should have had the chip changed OR used the stock chip OR get a hold of me bottom line and you would have still had your motor. your right, this is a mute point because i sat down and disscussed options with you over the 32 valve heads and i told you what was needed with the blower, after reading your responce i feel betrayed and i don't think i'll be interesteed in dealing with this car again.

PS..

where did you get your sources for your research that led you to believe that Alvin puts too much timing in his cars?

I did a search and netted 0 results

Originally posted by ROOSTER93V8
Hell i've been helping one guy with a surge problem for freaking months now and its pretty obvious its non-tuning related.

Why is it obvious? I've seen some datalogs that I wasn't too impressed with...

Originally posted by Dan K
Why is it obvious? I've seen some datalogs that I wasn't too impressed with...

well because his car ran good until they tore down the front of the motor... then on top of that they reported some bogus AFR charts sampled behind the catalitic convertor.

OK, want proof? I ran VEmaster on the last datalog he sent me. I don't use VE master nor do i reccomend it.. it makes too generalized of corrections. i'm just using it here to show you the correction coeffiecents

Turns out my software doesn't work half bad now does it.

VE cell [650-750][92.5-97.5] : 74.2188 * 1 = 74.2188
VE cell [650-750][97.5-104] : 76.1719 * 1 = 76.1719
VE cell [750-850][0-22.5] : 37.1094 * 1 = 37.1094
VE cell [750-850][22.5-27.5] : 42.1875 * 1 = 42.1875
VE cell [750-850][27.5-32.5] : 41.0156 * 1 = 41.0156
VE cell [750-850][32.5-37.5] : 42.1875 * 1 = 42.1875
VE cell [750-850][37.5-42.5] : 40.2344 * 1 = 40.2344
VE cell [750-850][42.5-47.5] : 44.5313 * 1 = 44.5313
VE cell [750-850][47.5-52.5] : 48.0469 * 1 = 48.0469
VE cell [750-850][52.5-57.5] : 51.1719 * 1 = 51.1719
VE cell [750-850][57.5-62.5] : 50.7813 * 1 = 50.7813
VE cell [750-850][62.5-67.5] : 53.125 * 1 = 53.125
VE cell [750-850][67.5-72.5] : 56.6406 * 1 = 56.6406
VE cell [750-850][72.5-77.5] : 58.9844 * 1 = 58.9844
VE cell [750-850][77.5-82.5] : 59.7656 * 1 = 59.7656
VE cell [750-850][82.5-87.5] : 62.8906 * 1 = 62.8906
VE cell [750-850][87.5-92.5] : 71.875 * 1 = 71.875
VE cell [750-850][92.5-97.5] : 75.7813 * 1 = 75.7813
VE cell [750-850][97.5-104] : 77.7344 * 1 = 77.7344
VE cell [850-950][0-22.5] : 38.2813 * 1 = 38.2813
VE cell [850-950][22.5-27.5] : 41.0156 * 1 = 41.0156
VE cell [850-950][27.5-32.5] : 43.3594 * 1 = 43.3594
VE cell [850-950][32.5-37.5] : 41.7969 * 1 = 41.7969
VE cell [850-950][37.5-42.5] : 36.3281 * 1 = 36.3281
VE cell [850-950][42.5-47.5] : 45.7031 * 1 = 45.7031
VE cell [850-950][47.5-52.5] : 47.6563 * 0.996528 = 47.6563
VE cell [850-950][52.5-57.5] : 51.5625 * 0.993056 = 51.1719
VE cell [850-950][57.5-62.5] : 51.5625 * 0.993056 = 51.1719
VE cell [850-950][62.5-67.5] : 59.7656 * 0.993056 = 59.375
VE cell [850-950][67.5-72.5] : 65.625 * 0.993056 = 65.2344
VE cell [850-950][72.5-77.5] : 60.5469 * 0.993679 = 60.1563
VE cell [850-950][77.5-82.5] : 62.1094 * 0.99929 = 62.1094
VE cell [850-950][82.5-87.5] : 67.1875 * 0.99929 = 67.1875
VE cell [850-950][87.5-92.5] : 73.0469 * 0.99929 = 73.0469
VE cell [850-950][92.5-97.5] : 76.9531 * 0.99929 = 76.9531
VE cell [850-950][97.5-104] : 78.125 * 0.99929 = 78.125
VE cell [950-1050][0-22.5] : 38.6719 * 1 = 38.6719
VE cell [950-1050][22.5-27.5] : 40.2344 * 1 = 40.2344
VE cell [950-1050][27.5-32.5] : 44.1406 * 1 = 44.1406
VE cell [950-1050][32.5-37.5] : 44.1406 * 1 = 44.1406
VE cell [950-1050][37.5-42.5] : 39.8438 * 1 = 39.8438
VE cell [950-1050][42.5-47.5] : 48.4375 * 1 = 48.4375
VE cell [950-1050][47.5-52.5] : 49.2188 * 0.996528 = 49.2188
VE cell [950-1050][52.5-57.5] : 54.2969 * 0.993056 = 53.9063
VE cell [950-1050][57.5-62.5] : 55.0781 * 0.993056 = 54.6875
VE cell [950-1050][62.5-67.5] : 63.2813 * 0.993056 = 62.8906
VE cell [950-1050][67.5-72.5] : 64.8438 * 0.993056 = 64.4531
VE cell [950-1050][72.5-77.5] : 69.9219 * 0.993679 = 69.5313
VE cell [950-1050][77.5-82.5] : 71.875 * 0.99929 = 71.875
VE cell [950-1050][82.5-87.5] : 71.0938 * 0.99929 = 71.0938
VE cell [950-1050][87.5-92.5] : 73.8281 * 0.99929 = 73.8281
VE cell [950-1050][92.5-97.5] : 77.3438 * 0.99929 = 77.3438
VE cell [950-1050][97.5-104] : 78.5156 * 0.99929 = 78.5156
VE cell [1050-1150][0-22.5] : 39.4531 * 1 = 39.4531
VE cell [1050-1150][22.5-27.5] : 41.7969 * 1 = 41.7969
VE cell [1050-1150][27.5-32.5] : 47.2656 * 1 = 47.2656
VE cell [1050-1150][32.5-37.5] : 42.5781 * 1 = 42.5781
VE cell [1050-1150][37.5-42.5] : 47.2656 * 1 = 47.2656
VE cell [1050-1150][42.5-47.5] : 51.1719 * 1 = 51.1719
VE cell [1050-1150][47.5-52.5] : 55.8594 * 0.996528 = 55.8594
VE cell [1050-1150][52.5-57.5] : 52.7344 * 0.993056 = 52.3438
VE cell [1050-1150][57.5-62.5] : 55.8594 * 0.993056 = 55.4688
VE cell [1050-1150][62.5-67.5] : 61.7188 * 0.993056 = 61.3281
VE cell [1050-1150][67.5-72.5] : 66.7969 * 0.993056 = 66.4063
VE cell [1050-1150][72.5-77.5] : 67.9688 * 0.993679 = 67.5781
VE cell [1050-1150][77.5-82.5] : 71.4844 * 0.99929 = 71.4844
VE cell [1050-1150][82.5-87.5] : 74.6094 * 0.99929 = 74.6094
VE cell [1050-1150][87.5-92.5] : 79.2969 * 0.99929 = 79.2969
VE cell [1050-1150][92.5-97.5] : 78.9063 * 0.99929 = 78.9063
VE cell [1050-1150][97.5-104] : 79.6875 * 0.99929 = 79.6875
VE cell [1150-1250][0-22.5] : 40.2344 * 1 = 40.2344
VE cell [1150-1250][22.5-27.5] : 40.2344 * 1 = 40.2344
VE cell [1150-1250][27.5-32.5] : 43.75 * 1 = 43.75
VE cell [1150-1250][32.5-37.5] : 42.5781 * 1 = 42.5781
VE cell [1150-1250][37.5-42.5] : 45.3125 * 1 = 45.3125
VE cell [1150-1250][42.5-47.5] : 53.5156 * 1 = 53.5156
VE cell [1150-1250][47.5-52.5] : 55.8594 * 0.996528 = 55.8594
VE cell [1150-1250][52.5-57.5] : 60.5469 * 0.993056 = 60.1563
VE cell [1150-1250][57.5-62.5] : 58.5938 * 0.993056 = 58.2031
VE cell [1150-1250][62.5-67.5] : 64.4531 * 0.993056 = 64.0625
VE cell [1150-1250][67.5-72.5] : 68.75 * 0.993056 = 68.3594
VE cell [1150-1250][72.5-77.5] : 67.9688 * 0.993679 = 67.5781
VE cell [1150-1250][77.5-82.5] : 71.875 * 0.99929 = 71.875
VE cell [1150-1250][82.5-87.5] : 75 * 0.99929 = 75
VE cell [1150-1250][87.5-92.5] : 76.1719 * 0.99929 = 76.1719
VE cell [1150-1250][92.5-97.5] : 82.0313 * 0.99929 = 82.0313
VE cell [1150-1250][97.5-104] : 81.6406 * 0.99929 = 81.6406
VE cell [1250-1350][0-22.5] : 39.8438 * 1 = 39.8438
VE cell [1250-1350][22.5-27.5] : 41.0156 * 1 = 41.0156
VE cell [1250-1350][27.5-32.5] : 43.3594 * 0.988278 = 42.9688
VE cell [1250-1350][32.5-37.5] : 48.4375 * 0.976556 = 47.2656
VE cell [1250-1350][37.5-42.5] : 47.2656 * 0.976556 = 46.0938
VE cell [1250-1350][42.5-47.5] : 53.125 * 0.976556 = 51.9531
VE cell [1250-1350][47.5-52.5] : 51.9531 * 0.982314 = 51.1719
VE cell [1250-1350][52.5-57.5] : 60.9375 * 0.988071 = 60.1563
VE cell [1250-1350][57.5-62.5] : 64.4531 * 0.988071 = 63.6719
VE cell [1250-1350][62.5-67.5] : 62.8906 * 0.988071 = 62.1094
VE cell [1250-1350][67.5-72.5] : 61.7188 * 0.988071 = 60.9375
VE cell [1250-1350][72.5-77.5] : 72.2656 * 0.995227 = 71.875
VE cell [1250-1350][77.5-82.5] : 75.7813 * 0.99482 = 75.3906
VE cell [1250-1350][82.5-87.5] : 75 * 0.99482 = 74.6094
VE cell [1250-1350][87.5-92.5] : 82.4219 * 0.99482 = 82.0313
VE cell [1250-1350][92.5-97.5] : 81.25 * 0.99482 = 80.8594
VE cell [1250-1350][97.5-104] : 82.8125 * 0.99482 = 82.4219
VE cell [1350-1450][0-22.5] : 39.8438 * 1 = 39.8438
VE cell [1350-1450][22.5-27.5] : 40.2344 * 1 = 40.2344
VE cell [1350-1450][27.5-32.5] : 39.0625 * 0.976556 = 38.2813
VE cell [1350-1450][32.5-37.5] : 41.0156 * 0.953112 = 39.0625
VE cell [1350-1450][37.5-42.5] : 42.9688 * 0.953112 = 41.0156
VE cell [1350-1450][42.5-47.5] : 49.2188 * 0.953112 = 46.875
VE cell [1350-1450][47.5-52.5] : 52.3438 * 0.9681 = 50.7813
VE cell [1350-1450][52.5-57.5] : 60.9375 * 0.983087 = 59.7656
VE cell [1350-1450][57.5-62.5] : 56.25 * 0.983087 = 55.4688
VE cell [1350-1450][62.5-67.5] : 65.625 * 0.983087 = 64.4531
VE cell [1350-1450][67.5-72.5] : 63.6719 * 0.983087 = 62.5
VE cell [1350-1450][72.5-77.5] : 71.0938 * 0.983813 = 69.9219
VE cell [1350-1450][77.5-82.5] : 80.4688 * 0.990349 = 79.6875
VE cell [1350-1450][82.5-87.5] : 82.4219 * 0.990349 = 81.6406
VE cell [1350-1450][87.5-92.5] : 85.5469 * 0.990349 = 84.7656
VE cell [1350-1450][92.5-97.5] : 81.6406 * 0.990349 = 80.8594
VE cell [1350-1450][97.5-104] : 83.9844 * 0.990349 = 83.2031
VE cell [1450-1550][0-22.5] : 40.625 * 1 = 40.625
VE cell [1450-1550][22.5-27.5] : 42.9688 * 1 = 42.9688
VE cell [1450-1550][27.5-32.5] : 42.5781 * 0.976556 = 41.4063
VE cell [

Wouldn't let me post whole thing, email me at Rooster433@aol.com for the complete log

I'm just going to back up Rooster here in saying that he is probably the most promt person I've ever dealt with in getting back to someone. I've NEVER had an issue in trying to get ahold of him, and I mean never. I completely trust in what he does with his tunes.

I don't know I had REALLY good service from Alvin at PCM for less, we talked on the phone he helped me burn my own chips. I swapped out my ed wright tune for his and driveablity was a 100% better. So I have only positive things to say about my experences with him and probably had at least 4 chips from him if I remember right......

Thanks guys,

I won't get into whose better or worse at tuning. But i really felt betrayed.. I spend alot of time every day answering emails and on the phone and then when i hear that I got pissed or i started ignoring people is just ...wow you know?

I feel like this is a situation where someone comes up to you and says I knocked on your front door all day... and you think, why didn't you hit the door bell.

I apprecate the support, and BTW.. i'm still serously waiting for these reports that I put too much timing in my cars.. wheres it at? not trying to be a a$$ or nothing but if thiers people out there spark knocking and they haven't told me about it they need to have it fixed ASAP

Haven't delt with PCMforless, but Ion (Madwolf) got mine perfect on his first try. Of course mine was pretty easy since it's a known setup and I already had a before dyno with A/F info for him to reference. Still he was very quick to respond to any questions and got the new ECM to me quick (did an OBDI conversion). His price was lower and I was very happy gaining 22RWHP over stock.:bow:

I have PCMforless programming and am very happy with it. Bryan was great. When I changed cam and gears, he sent me a new program within 2 days, and i even called him on the phone one night, and he was more than happy to answer a few questions I had. No complaints here :D

I had PCMforless tuning in my old 93 T/A. I had alot of mods to it and Alvin worked with me very well on it. the car ran outstanding with only one change. (and it was all only described over E-mail)
Bryan did the tune on my 97 and it runs very well now that I took care of the cars issues, wasnt the tunes issues but the cars. Runs really good now.
I have had nothing but great service and freindly additude meet me there.

My old POS superchips programmer died on me in the middle of programming. I sent an SOS to PCMFORLESS Wednesday night and got a PCM on my doorstep by Friday afternoon!

My car's not outrageously modded, but the new programming sure did the trick and really woke it up!

They were "Johnny on the spot" when I needed it! :cool:

hey guys,

Just wanted to let you know that me and bryan apprecate the support. I really got upset when I heard what "The big show" said especially after I spend so much time on emails, phone calls, and diagnostics. We truely try to offer the best support and best product and price it for those on a ...forless budget.

Thanks,
Alvin

Guys, we really do appreciate your support. The PCM tuning is a tough biz. A lot of times problems we see on cars range from bad O2 sensors to timing chains a tooth off to ported MAF sensors and they all present problems that make it seem like it is the programming when it turns out to be mechanical. We do everything we can to help troubleshoot these problems with everyone as they can be tough to find sometimes. This is why though Alvin and I use tried and true programs when we mail order chips and PCM's so we know that what we are sending out should work properly. Mistakes rarely happen, but do now and then and we also do what it takes to make the programs right on.

BTW Joe K. Your core PCM is toast :( I even tried my GM SPS reprogramming tool on it and cannot get it to talk again. I can send it out for repair, or send it back, or just use it for the case, drop me a line or I will give you a call and we can chat about it. Looks like the superchips dump killed the memory chips in it :( Bummer, but it happens...

The one car Dan K was talking about was mine. On the dyno, the AF was dangerously lean, and as he said was totally off. I guess you get what you pay for in a mail order tune :rolleyes: I am just glad that I had someone local (Dan K) who knew what he was doing and corrected the problem. Hell he even tuned my new Joe Overton cam which makes the GM 847 and CC306 cams look like baby cams ;) Never again will I pay for a mail order tune, I will just pay Dan K to take of any tuning issues that may arise :D

I had PCMforless tune in my '97 and the car also went dangerously lean on the dyno (14:1+). However, the timing was ok. I richened the tune up and kept the PCMforless timing tables in the car and it ran well. :)

I'm very happy with my Madwolf tune.
Just put in my 9 psi pulley and everything seems great even without the water injection hooked up.
Both tuners are great guys.
Ion charges less.
I think he has less overhead being younger and newer.
Bryan is older and probably has a building to pay for.
Just my guess...

The pricing is very close to the same especially when you consider we don't charge for shipping for all camaroz28.com members and chips are 15% off

I cant complain with either one. Bryan helped me out with my first stock tune and I even talked to him on the phone while I was flashing the PCM b/c it was giving me strange error codes so he definitely has outstanding support.

Then the day came where I totalled out my PCM but Bryan had no spares at the time or something of that nature so I went to Ion. He sent me out a new one the next day! Then I fried that one and bought a socketed PCM.. he has always been fast to get to my emails and I talked to him on the phone a time or 2.

Both are equally good IMO. People who get upset over a surging car or incorrect AFR on teh dyno obviously dont understand what its like to tune a car thru EMAIL!... I would never even try as there are so many variables like Bryan listed that a guy could attempt in correcting for months with no positive results.

And then there is Alvin... well I cant say much about him since Im not into chips but he sounds like a good guy. :)

People who get upset over a surging car or incorrect AFR on teh dyno obviously dont understand what its like to tune a car thru EMAIL!... I would never even try as there are so many variables like Bryan listed that a guy could attempt in correcting for months with no positive results.

Then don't try! :)
If someone is selling a service the last thing you should expect is an inferior product, or better yet a service that could potentially cost you money if done incorrectly.
You're almost getting into whether or not someone is competent enough to provide a service such as this.
And that's where guys like Bryan, Alvin, and Ion are sticking there necks out for some of you guys and just hoping that they don't have any major problems.

Then don't try! :)
If someone is selling a service the last thing you should expect is an inferior product, or better yet a service that could potentially cost you money if done incorrectly.
You're almost getting into whether or not someone is competent enough to provide a service such as this.
And that's where guys like Bryan, Alvin, and Ion are sticking there necks out for some of you guys and just hoping that they don't have any major problems.

Well, the truth is a lot of cars would run just fine w/o any tuning.. hotcam people. And no its not really about being competent at all. I just believe aside from changing injector size, rev/speed limiter, gearing and minor timing adjustments... theres not a whole lot a guy can do thru the mail w/o some data logging but if you are data logging then chances are you probably do a lot of your own tuning anyway. People expect their cars to run absolutely flawless with these tunes so it takes a certain breed with a decent amount of patience to deal with the people who come back for adjustments based on their personal observations... I couldnt do it.

Thats sorta a half statement. They will run, they will also wash out the cylindar walls.

The hotcam guys can pickup anywhere from 25-35rwhp from a tune.. Sometimes more than that.

The mail orderstuff we do usually gets people dead on the money as far as AFR etc.. When the AFR fails short of what we want or theres some other problem with it we go over it. FREE of charge of course. But like I said MOST of the time its extremely close (down to within 5rwhp) and this has been proven at our dyno days.

Now, the problem lies with people who don't give feedback on how the tune is doing. If you get a tune from us and you don't mention that the AFR is off, or the car is surging, or that your at extreme altitudes and somethings not right with it than we can fix it. Its as simple as that.

Tell us about the problem and we will fix it.

Anthor thing is don't trust email to work everytime. If you don't hear back from us than let us know by phone.

Then don't try! :)
If someone is selling a service the last thing you should expect is an inferior product, or better yet a service that could potentially cost you money if done incorrectly.
You're almost getting into whether or not someone is competent enough to provide a service such as this.
And that's where guys like Bryan, Alvin, and Ion are sticking there necks out for some of you guys and just hoping that they don't have any major problems.
I've never been accredited to killing a motor and on every setup I do that looks extreme to me I warn the guy we need feedback to make sure its correct.

Also, we dont' turn away from people with our tunes. If a problem should exsist and we know about it we fix it. As simple as that.

I'm sure Ion has the same policys

Thats sorta a half statement. They will run, they will also wash out the cylindar walls.

The hotcam guys can pickup anywhere from 25-35rwhp from a tune.. Sometimes more than that.

The mail orderstuff we do usually gets people dead on the money as far as AFR etc.. When the AFR fails short of what we want or theres some other problem with it we go over it. FREE of charge of course. But like I said MOST of the time its extremely close (down to within 5rwhp) and this has been proven at our dyno days.



I dont know how you guys do it anymore but 2 years ago I could quickly determine if a file was from PCMforless because the timing tables looked almost identical no matter what combo you had... +/-2 degree changes in the WOT ranges but the rest of the table looked the same. Also the PE tables and VE tables varied little if at all.

saw this thread, so i'll dig it back up, and input my experience as well...

Ion was very helpful when i was getting my car tuned, and he answered some questions that I had... but my AFR was low/mid 10s all the time (actually i dont think it was tune related, not sure wth was going on) then I asked if he can send me a stock tune for my car, and he never replied...

then pcmforless... I asked them if they could make my tune stock, and would pay if i needed to... bryan was to ask i heard, and he told me to email him, and i did, but i got nothing back...

best way is to do it yourself and not rely on others i guess...

I have had my tune for a week now and I am completely happy with it. Ion is great to deal with. The thing I like most on what was changed is the shift firmness! and being able to know how fast I'm going (4.10 gears)

I'm very happy with my MadZ tune..
First thing I noticed was the big difference with firm shifts. I'm probably exaggerated but almost feels like a mild valvebody shift kit is in it, yes it feels that good. I noticed there's no bogging down and when I let off off the pedal it maintains it's cruise. What I love the most is no dead spots! Very excellent throttle response and the this is the best thing I've ever done to this car. I've had my tune for aabout a year now.

I have a madz28 tune as well. Tune was killer. Driveability is what amazed me the most. WOT tuning is relatively easy, but for driving, especially with a decent sized cam, it runs awesome. No problem cruising in 6th at 1600 rpms. I was getting 5* of retard throughout the dyno run, I zeroed it out and made about 5 hp more, otherwise its dead on. Now I need to get it updated for the 30lb injectors - its running WAY to rich now, even with the constant changed.