COMP XE hydraulic rollers vs. Crane Powermax Hydraulic Rollers????

I'm trying to decide on a cam and need some enlightenment about cams.

My sig lists most of the details on what I'm working with, but here is the rest of the info:
I'll be running an x-pipe with 3" duals/dumps. EFI Controls will be FAST wideband, Holley w/wideband, or DFI gen 7.

Also, here's the specs on my heads:
------ I --- E
.050- 30 --- 23
.100- 63 --- 50
.200- 123 -- 102
.300- 177 -- 138
.400- 220 -- 171
.500- 252 -- 188
.600- 257 -- 197
E/I -------- 78%

As you can see in my sig, I've used quality parts throughout the valvetrain and my springs can easily handle any of those cams.
I don't have them yet, but I'm getting some 875-16 Comp R" series magnum lifters.
I don't plan on using a rev kit, but if the need arrives I'll add one later.


The car is built soley for STREET RACING. Only once in a blue moon I may go to the 1/8 mile track and if so I'll run drag radials at best. I'm gonna be using N2O but only as insurance. Even though it's not a daily driver, I'll be cruising around from time to time so I do need to retain some degree of driveability. I don't mind making some sacrifices. I don't have AC or smog anymore, and I'll add a vacuum can or pump for the power brakes if needed. Plus being having a manual tranny and using some type of dfi system should make it more tolerant....correct me if I'm wrong.

COMP recommends their XE 282HR custom ground on a 112:
230/236 282/288 .517/.527 w/1.52's or .544/.555 w/1.6's 112*
But I've also had my eye on this one:
236/242 288/294 .527/.547 w/1,52's or .555/.576 w/1.6's 112*

OR
Crane makes a couple from their powermax series that's also sold under the GM Performance Parts Name.
Crane 109831 / GM 12370846
222/230 284/292 .516/.535 w/1.52's or .543/.563 w/1.6's 112*
Crane 109841 / GM 12370847
234/242 296/304 .546/.565 w/1.52's or .575/.601 w/1.6's 112*

It's my understanding that the 112 broadens things out a bit and will complement nitrous. I should still have a pretty good sound from the 112 while being a little easer to tune the efi.

Would it be better to switch from 1.6's to 1.52's?
My heads have guideplates, so I'm thinking about switching to the traditional style instead of the self-aligning anyways.

How do these cams compare in relards to my application?
Please, be as technical as you like. I'm trying to learn from this instead of asking someone to pick me a cam.

Any alternative or custom recommendations?

Need some more info.

Cubes
RPM range
Tranny
Gear
Weight of your Ride
What did the heads start out as? How many cc's are the now?
Intake Manifold?
LT1?

BTW to me it's easier to get a street race with a sleeper sounding cam vs a lopey idle cam.

Bret

99 Vortec 350 shortblock which has 9:1 with stock dish pistons and 64cc vortec heads and .038 gashets, BUT I'm using .028 headgaskets and my heats are 62cc chambers, so I should have somewhere around 9.8:1 compression.

The heads are edelbrock E-Tec 200's which are supposedly a little better than fastburns.

As for RPM: whatever you think the stock shortblock will handle. It's a 99 model block so it has the nodular cast iron crank and powdered melal rods and 9:1 cast dished pistons. It's 2 bolt main but I've put in ARP main studs and I upgraded the oil pump to a melling 10552 (20% higher vol).
Eventually I'm gonna build an all forged 383 or 396, but for right now I'm stuck with it.

Tranny is a 97 model T56, gonna put a spec sage 3 in it when I put everything back together.

3.91 9 bolt rear, completely overhauled with solid pinion spacer, and ARP 190,000 psi cap screws.

Iduction is holley multi-port system w/1000 cfm 4 barrel tb and 30 lb injectors.
Controls will be some form of dfi, probably fast or holley with wideband.

I don't know about the weight. It's a t-top car but has the lex
an ones instead of glass. I removed the ac, back seat, all the smog junk, and when I get to suspension I'm gonna use lighter tubular parts. I have a modified rack and pinion from a 4th gen, so I'm gonna run a tubular crossmember and a-arms so that should shave a bit off. with my cage and sfc's tho that is gonna add some. I'm guessing the car should be 3300-3400 lbs at max.

I updated my sig, it should answer any other questions on what I'm using.

With those changes on that bottom end I get 9.5:1 since you need -11cc dish pistons to get 9.1:1 on a Vortec 350.

I would go to a .015 gasket, that gives you a .040 qunech area since the GM shortblocks are usually .025 in the hole. That will yield the 9.8:1.

RPM on that bottom end should be held to about 6500rpm. The GM Circle Track Race engines are limited to 5800rpm with this same bottom end, but that is for a full season of circle track racing which is VERY hard on the bottom end.

"Would it be better to switch from 1.6's to 1.52's?
My heads have guideplates, so I'm thinking about switching to the traditional style instead of the self-aligning anyways. "

If they have guideplates you have to switch to regular type rockers. The self aligning and the guide plates are fighting each other and that's not a good thing.

I would go with the 1.6's

Do you know the specs on the springs or the part numbers?

The cam with your setup and a 6200rpm shift point, means you need to increase the 4000-6500rpm range. Since you have HR lifters it's not going to like over 6000rpm much anyways, so you can focus on the RPM band below that. I've always found that Comp give you a tad higher cam than needed sometimes.

I like the 224/236 .560/.544 on a 112 for a sleeper cam setup with good midrange and will also work well with N2O. A small amount of advance on that cam, around 2 degs to make up for the cam twist should be very good. It will also have a very slight lope to the idle, and if you get it to idle around 900-1000 it will not be noticeable at all.

Without the N2O you are looking at maybe a low 12 sec car, and with a very quick car.

I'd paint the heads black and drop the old crate motor valve covers on it to make it look like the stock crate motor. Except this one will have 100+hp more.

Bret

I think DFI is a bit overkill on an NA application such as this one. I asked the question before and got the same responce.


On a side note, how do you like the spec stg III? is it the 6 puck design? How do you like it?

and isn't the 99 vortec the LS1 derived motor? So LS1 heads bolt up? I might be wrong about this.

Any particular .015 head gasket you recommend? Fel-Pro, Mr Gasket, Victor Reinz, ROL, GM?

Since I already have the 1.6 ratio self-aligning COMP Pro-Magnums, should I remove just remove the guide plates?

The valvesprings are 1.265"/.878" single springs with dampers made from Howards Cams/Competition Products. PN 98213 springs 97214 Titanium Retainers
Their specs are:
1.850 - 105#
1.800 - 120#
1.750 - 145#
1.500 - 250#
1.250 - 345#
1.125 - 440#
Coilbind @ 1.065

They're made with "super clean" hi-tensile pro-alloy (I'd say it's the same thing as the pacaloy comp and crane plug), heat set, shot peened.
I figure they're about tit for tat with comp 941's and probably made a little better. Plus they were only $150 plus shipping including the retainers and heat treated locks.

That cam has me thinking now.....

Trey...
The 99 models had the gen 1 and gen3 motors in them. Mine is a gen 1.
I don't have the clutch yet, I'm going to get it when the time finally comes to put the car back together. I haven't even touched the suspension or chassis so that's a bit down the road.

As for the DFI, I haven't decided anything definite yet...it's still in the planning stages. I'm gonna speak with an expert on the GM stuff first about programming. And then decide.

Those springs are nice from Howard's, one day I'm going to setup a dealership for thier products cause they have some nice parts, especially thier connecting rods.


The springs are about a 409 lbs/in Spring Rate, and you should install them around 1.775 to get you around 130 lbs on the seat.

As for the Rocker Arms, you usually just need to modifiy the guide plates because the rocker studs need to sit on them. Just make sure the guide plates don't rub the pushrods by making the slot bigger or just taking that area of the guide plates off.

As for the gaskets these Fel Pro ones should work
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=FPP%2D1094
or these
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2411&prmenbr=361

I'd go with the Fel Pros, another company called Cometic has some very nice gaskets for alot of motors.
http://www.cometic.com/Auto/Automotive.htm
But they don't have a gasket that thin.

I'd go with a Spec II for this setup, a III seems to be overkill for under 500hp, and 600hp with the N2O.

Yeah that cam make more mid range, keeps the RPM down and should still make some nice HP.

If you were going to turn that motor a few RPM higher, say to 6500 then I would get a AFR Hydra Rev kit too. With that cam it would be a killer setup.

Bret

Thanks for all the advice and info Bret, you've got mail.

Originally posted by draino
Trey...
The 99 models had the gen 1 and gen3 motors in them. Mine is a gen 1.
I don't have the clutch yet, I'm going to get it when the time finally comes to put the car back together. I haven't even touched the suspension or chassis so that's a bit down the road.

As for the DFI, I haven't decided anything definite yet...it's still in the planning stages. I'm gonna speak with an expert on the GM stuff first about programming. And then decide.


Well then, I'll let you know how I like it :D
Thanks for the info on the trucks.

Always good info here.

Thought I would add some from personal experiance.

Crane cams have softer ramps then the EX series. Springs,rockers and lifters seem to live longer with the softer crane ramps. The EX series gives up the goast at 6,200-6,400 on every cut I have seen so far. under that they make great power. Most shift before then but with the duration they are using more could be had at higher RPMs if they would hold it. I like things that last so I have change over to the Crane cuts for this and the satisfaction that they will not come apart like 3 cams we had last year from the other guys.

As far as Guide plates the best one I have found to use on a LT based motor are the Isky Adjustables. for some reason(Studs not in same place?) regular guide plates do not line up the rockers on the valves correctly. I tried many different kinds over the years and the Iskys give the most stable quiet valve train we have found so far. You are working with Vortec heads and I am not sure if they have the same issues but after this EVERY motor i do will get a set to give me peice of mind.

Stroker covered every thing well I just wanted to add some of the things I have found over the past few years on all the cars I work on. Never know it might help.

BTW....Get used to changing Intake gaskets ;) Use LOTS of ground straps they help :D

Since I have the self aligning pro-mags, I'm gonna trim the guide plates.
Bret and I discussed the cam, and I like where he's going with it so I think that's the grind I'm gonna use.

Get used to changing intake gaskets alot......that sounds like a warning to me.

I'm gonna make sure it's grounded well. If I come across any ground straps from stress cone kits for high voltage cable, I'll use those.

Originally posted by OneFlyn95z28

BTW....Get used to changing Intake gaskets ;) Use LOTS of ground straps they help :D

Could someone please explain to me what he meant by that?
thanks in advance,
brent