I have a few options....the first being the Super Victor high port....which is what I am leaning towards at this point. However, I want to use the stock hood (or ram air hood at most). Using this manifold would force me to run a monoblade TB and a custom elbow. The elbow is the part I am most concerned with since I would have to fabricate something.....I doubt a std cross sectional 90* elbow is going to not incur significant flow loss.

The next option would be a sheetmetal unit. I am not prepared to drop $2k plus on a Hogan; however, I could fabricate one.....but I dont have the knowledge/experience IMO to think that I could actually make something worthwhile.

I am interested to hear the opinions of the guys that have actually taken measurements under the hood. Ideally, I would like to run a 4bbl throttle body, but I dont see that happening as there would be hood clearance problems and no way to run a filter.

I am looking for something that will not be as restrictive as an LT1/4 intake on my motor. The goal is 675hp NA. AFR 215 raised runner heads, ~330cfm intake/235cfm exhaust, 255/260 solid roller (~.700" lift), 396ci.

Thanks for any help
Jason

 

Hey Jason,

I'm curious about the Super Victor swapping on to the AFR heads designed for the LT4 you made comment about the swap from the OEM mini ram to the Edelbrock? What part number where you told would fit? And would it bolt right up? I didn't think Edelbrock offered a Victor for the LT1/LT4 that was direct fit without and welding or modifaction?

If you seen a Victor installed on a LT1 or any information about this please list the site? I have heard of people doing the swap but have yet to find out what intake they used and what was required to make the intake fit?

I like the fact of using a high rise intake with my combination. I don't see any reason why it wouldn't pickup more CFM.

As for your intake search what you found out is about what I found out. There is one other intake that I'm told is cheaper than a sheetmetal intake but has good flow qualities from mid range to high end, TPS makes what they call there Mini Ram.

Thanks for the info,
Jim

 

measure up the entire amount of room you have to work with and get to milling....LOL

here is my setup
http://home.earthlink.net/~tt3rdgen/intake.html

Z9s shop milled the plenum flat and then down, then they cut off almost .850 off the elbow and then milled that flat

gives me enough room to fit the elbow and the intake (victor junior only 4.5" tall i believe, edelbrock has the height listed on their site) under the hood of my thirdgen.

edit:

i forgot that after the intake was milled so much the elbow/plenum opening was really mismatched...i had my porter fix everything for me. Also, this is a n/a application right? Just run a 4bbl TB instead of an elbow to save room

 

Jim,

I'm just did a Super Vic conversion so it will fit on a set of LT1 heads. Jay should see it tommorrow at the shop, all that's left to be done is to put the intake holes in it at the right angle. I've done that already to another intake. I'll try to get a pic of it up soon. It's for a carb distributor setup, but I can just as easily install fuel injector bungs, a fuel rail and turn a piece to ap of the distributor hole too.

The intake will flow more and it will give you more tuning pressures at mid and high RPM to give you a big bump in power.

I've seen Procharged's setup before, even though it's for a SBC setup not a LT1. Still it's a nice job at how you EFI a carb intake.

Bret

 

Jim, nothing is a direct bolt up anymore Especially getting into this level of stuff. Machine work, machine work, machine work!

The Edelbrock part number I am referering to is #2926. I am also looking into the GM raised port single plane (part# 10051103).

I have taken measurements a few times. An elbow seems to be the only way.

89....nice intake The problem for me is that this is an NA application. Your elbow has a consistant cross section area thru the bend.....with boost, that is not a problem. However, in vacuum conditions airflow incurs alot of loss in a design like that.

Jeff Taylor (HotRodHawk) has a beautiful setup on his car that fit under his old factory ram air hood. However, he had the resource of his brother to make mold him that elbow.

Thanks, Jason

 

Jason/Bret why again isn't 89ProchargedROC's set up good for an NA application? At first glance I thought that it would immediately clear up the problem of fabbing up an extensive elbow with that addtion to the intake. Doesnt the stock rubber elbow that we all run have the same cross sectional design throughout?

What would be an optimal design than?

As you both know Ive been looking into the same idea so I may have to ride your coatails with this one.

 

does anyone have any actual before and after results of doing thsi swap on a high reving lt1...I would like to know if its actually worth the major effort to do this.

Tim

 

Jason, true that in theory you would want the cross section to increase at the bend, I would imagine that a 4" elbow would flow enough for the power you want..

 

Hey Jason,

I looked at the same thing for quite a while so I'll throw you what I came up with.

You have a few high port intakes.... The Super Vic being the shortest @ 5.91" to the pad (according to Edelbrock but to me that seems short ). The Brodix intake is 7.035. The GM and Dart RR intakes... dunno about them but it's only a phone call to find out. The other option..... run a "standard port" intake with spacers to correct the port alignment. Then you have the choice of some shorter intake manifolds that will still be shorter with the spacers in place.
But, you will probably be giving up a little power with that approach. Then again, you've got a firebird right? Not too much additional hood height in the ram air either is there??

Another thing. Looking at a friends Dakota RT the other day.... it uses a really low profile molded bonnet over the throttle body. I don't know if the seating diameter is standard Holley 5" or not but if it is... you'd be in business and could run a 4bbl throttle body and that bonnet with very little extra height. How much hp it costs would be real easy to find on the dyno (with bonnet/ without).
Other option, ATI use to make an aluminum bonnet for their blow-thru carb setup. Now they have that big refrigerator box thing the use but if could find one of those... same deal. It'd be low profile and you could just run a standard CAI.

Might think of more later....

-Mindgame

 

Jordan and Game,

When Jay was at the shop today we discussed both of those things. The 4" elbow flowing enough and the 4bbl TB with a truck type intake bonnet. Old SStroker and him discussed some more things but, somehow in there we will find a way to fit it under the hood. The Super Vic is actually that high I checked some that I have vs what they say and they are right on. It's good that they are short here, bad for other things.

Bret

 

Thanks for the info Jordon, Mindgame.

Ideally, a TB on top of the intake with a elbow on the top (like on the 4.3L vortec truck engines, etc..) would be a good way. However, those little truck hats are tiny....for airflow like this, I am thinking it would have to be pretty big (~3" high I would think). All adding up in the height dept. The ram air hood for Firebirds gives an additional 1.5" of height.

I also think that the raised runner version of the super vic is going to be slightly taller....I will call Holley tomorrow and check that out, as well as take some measurements on my car.

Tim, there are a few guys that have done the swap with great gains IMO. HotRodHawk gained 30hp and 40lb-ft on his 355. Darren Hardin did the conversion a hyd roller 355 NA car and gained like 40hp and 60lb-ft. On a 355 like yours, I bet it would be awesome....you would gain alot of power and driveability.

Mindgame, just sell me your motor....that is all I want
Thanks, Jason

 

ok..I think you just made up my mind on this. What all do I need to do/get to make this work. Does anyone out there do the conversion or do I just get the machinist local to tap the intake/weld up dist. hole etc.? Gonna start the wheels rolling just need to know what to do.

tim

 

would this help ?

pic1
pic2

looking at the 2nd pic, it would really add alot of room i think

 

Wow, those are some nice gains from the swap. That'd be well worthwhile IMO.
I'm still kinda leaning towards trying this with mine but I think I'd have to go to an aftermarket hood. You Firebird owners have better looking choices than us Camaro guys. Not real swift on the cowl hood on these cars...... and I can't find much I really like next to the SLP ultraZ and it seems that all the added height for that hood is more towards the nose of the car.

On the plastic bonnet thing..... you could always get that sucker up off the top of the carb as high as you have room for. Just have an aluminum spacer ring made, slap a gasket on both sides and you're good to go. I have a machinist friend who could do that no problem for cost of material.

As for my bullet.... I think by the time you finish, I might be wanting yours Jason.

Tim,
Just talk to a professional engine builder. Most of the more "race" guys won't even balk because they're used to modifying stuff. If they have the machines, they can do the work no problemo. Check out Force Fuel injection... they do alot of the same kinda stuff (converting intakes etc).

http://force-efi.com/

got hp,
Now that hood just screams "racer".
Of course that's cool as long as you can back it up. Maybe I'll tell the story of the 95-ish V6 Mustang I see every morning on the ride in to the office with a 3" cowl hood..... ...... nevermind.

-Mindgame

 

Thoughts:

I met Jason Short for the first time yesterday, and again today.

I was very impressed. He's a knowledgeable, intelligent, personable guy, and has gears for brains (aka gearhead), and 5W-30 in his veins. What's not to like about that? He's close to his ME degree, and I think he'll go far.

You folks should consider listening to what he says.

It looks like maybe a Wilson 100 degree elbow on top of a Super Vic will move a TB far enough forward to keep uni-body cutting to day surgery rather than an admission.

The hood is still a bit of a problem, by not a terminal one. This is going to work!