Which Pontiac two seater would you buy?

1) Mid-engine, plastic paneled, fiero gt fastback styling, ls1 v8 325 hp, cost 32K.

2) Mid-engine, plastic paneled, fastback gt styling, inline 6 275 hp, cost 26k. Would give the heavier nissan z something to worry about!

3) Front engine solstice, plastic paneled, sc 4 cyl 240 hp cost 25k.

4) Front engine solstice, plastic paneled, 4 cyl 140 hp cost 18.9k


My vote would go to number one. Anyone from GM please pass the results on to Bob Lutz.:D

None! I hate the way plastic body panels look.

The Fiero is dead. I can tell someone unfortunately still weeps...

The fiero was just ahead of its time. I'd buy one of those little buggers with an LS1 in a heart beat :eek: :bow:

Originally posted by Burmite
The Fiero is dead. I can tell someone unfortunately still weeps...

Not in my driveway. If GM wont deliver "Gotta Have" when its time to buy new again (even with dealership employee discount), I would happily buy a low mileage 88gt again.

They are fiber reinforced plastics now, not entirely plastic anymore. GM has done a good job refining this technique and the body panels to prevent that wavy look that most composites have when painted... take a look at our front fenders, rear bumpers, and front noses... take a look at the Vette and many other cars... FRP's are here to stay.

I'd take the mid engine LS1 anyday!

Originally posted by Larnach
They are fiber reinforced plastics now, not entirely plastic anymore. GM has done a good job refining this technique and the body panels to prevent that wavy look that most composites have when painted... take a look at our front fenders, rear bumpers, and front noses... take a look at the Vette and many other cars... FRP's are here to stay.



Yeah, they're better alright.....but IMO they still don't match the finish of sheetmetal.

Nope... but the weight savings are phenomenal which result in a better handling car, better accleration, and better fuel economy... for a little bit of cosmetic sacrifice, you get a better vehicle.

Also no rust,dents and a paint job that still looks great on a 15 year old car. I would take plastic every time over metal. Try hitting a metal panel with a baseball bat and see what happens.

I'll give you dents.

Most steel body panels, however, have been two sided galvanized for awhile now, so rust shouldn't be a big issue...even in the rust belt.

Paint finishes require maintenance to look good, whether they are applied to sheetmetal or plastic.

Oh...did I mention the larger gaps required by plastic panels....they need space to expand and contract.

I'm not so sure about the actual weight savings either.

I agree with Z284. I'm for the steel.

Originally posted by Burmite
The Fiero is dead. I can tell someone unfortunately still weeps...

My "dead" Fiero seems to be doing pretty well too.

But pretty ironic someone would make such a statment on a CAMARO site, don't you think...? Mourning in the 5th gen forum hoping for the best in the next 5-10 years?? The Camaro has been dead since '97...just waited for burial until '02.

I'd take the mid engine V8.... but I don't know about the price. I guess it wouldn't be all that bad of a deal, but it seems like GM already has a ton of cars in this price range... though the mid-engien would make it unique.

My heart is already sold on the Solstice Coupe:cool:

Over half would pick a 240 horse 4?! :eek:

Gee, I though I was the odd man out here. :D

Originally posted by Z284ever
I'll give you dents.

Most steel body panels, however, have been two sided galvanized for awhile now, so rust shouldn't be a big issue...even in the rust belt.

Paint finishes require maintenance to look good, whether they are applied to sheetmetal or plastic.

Oh...did I mention the larger gaps required by plastic panels....they need space to expand and contract.

I'm not so sure about the actual weight savings either.

I deal with galvanized/zinc plated construction connectors at work all the time, they do eventually rust, and thats in a dry environment too. A steel body panel that must be stamped out in multiple peices, welded together or put together with some type of an epoxy, then go through a process of corrosion prevention, is a lot more expensive than making a mold and forming one peice out of FRP's.

Metal fit and finish is unmatched, however you pay a large penalty for good looks... IMHO it's not worth it on anything but a show car, which are not driven on a daily basis, if at all.

Originally posted by Larnach

Metal fit and finish is unmatched, however you pay a large penalty for good looks... IMHO it's not worth it on anything but a show car, which are not driven on a daily basis, if at all.

Just my opinion, but having to look at wavy and crude fitting plastic panels is the ultimate penalty.

Originally posted by Z284ever
Just my opinion, but having to look at wavy and crude fitting plastic panels is the ultimate penalty.

Well keep telling yourself that when I fly by you in my composite bodied car thats weighs less, handles better, accelerates quicker and has lower insurance rates.;)

Just messing with ya.

Z284ever, What year Z28 do you own?

4ths had those lousy looking panels and they were heavier than the steel Thirds. Although they were a little bigger. I've seen steel cars that are from like 40 years ago that don't have anything wrong with the panels. Including some high mileage 1st Gens that weren't that cared for.

I think he has an 89 IROC-Z. :cool:

I highly perfer the dent-resistant body panels.

The cars look nicer for a longer period of time with them.

Originally posted by gtjeff
Z284ever, What year Z28 do you own?

'89 IROC.

Gimme the plastic. Lighter, doesn't rust, doesn't dent, finish is good enough that consumer's can't tell the difference. Besides, after 15 years of accumulating dents and rust, the stell panels start looking bad unless the car is babied.

Fieros usually still look great, even the ones that were beat on, as long as the paint was applied properly (I've seen some 3rd gens peeling pretty badly, so don't even go there...).

Van Nuys........:rolleyes:

So far the results are very interesting. I've said before here that I didnt think GM did their homework (market research) on Solstice, that looks to be the case. Not a SINGLE PERSON so far chose the miata competitor 18.9k, 140 hp which Bob Lutz is adamant about building. Honestly it doesnt fit Pontiac's reborn performance image, the Saturn Sky would do well in this price/hp range. Potential Pontiac buyers want more hp as illustrated by ALL responses so far wanting 240hp or more. A Saturn buyer would probably be happy with 140 hp.

Now the issues with the 240 hp sc4 costing 25k: realistically its doubtful the corvette 6sp will be used on a car this price. Will GM spend the extra money to make a sc 240hp ecotec when other models may get 180, 200 or 220hp? Even the new turbo opel speedster has only 200 hp. Looks like the compromises will be coming soon. It would be much easier to use the 3.8l engine(200+hp). Also this car will be marketed toward younger people-will they be able to afford the insurance for a supercharged engine?

There is definately a market for a 25k+ Pontiac 2 seater as 100% of the answers so far are in this range. Nearly 2/3 chose mid-engine over front engine and also almost 2/3 would choose the fastback gt styling over Solstice.

If this poll was on Pennocks fiero forum, the solstice choices would be lucky to get 20%. I would image on a Miata forum the solstice may do better than even here. This was a good place to put it since it is neutral ground-people who are into performance, but not necessarily biased towards one car or another. Granted this is a small sample size. I used to work for a large market research company. For a survey to be projectible across the U.S. somewhere around 1000 surveys would be ideal.

Originally posted by PacerX
Gimme the plastic. Lighter, doesn't rust, doesn't dent, finish is good enough that consumer's can't tell the difference. Besides, after 15 years of accumulating dents and rust, the stell panels start looking bad unless the car is babied.

Fieros usually still look great, even the ones that were beat on, as long as the paint was applied properly (I've seen some 3rd gens peeling pretty badly, so don't even go there...).


Did I mention that having various plastic panel materials limits color choices? It seems that using different plastic and SMC panels makes color matching (from the factory), a maddening experience.

Does anyone remember the '00 Hugger Orange. It took years of effort to get that in the pipeline....and the end result was something quite abit short of what I would consider Hugger Orange.

True, from the factory gel coating etc. etc. and matching metal parts with that can be a pain in the ass... but now we are quiveling over more of the show items than go items.

Originally posted by Z284ever
Did I mention that having various plastic panel materials limits color choices? It seems that using different plastic and SMC panels makes color matching (from the factory), a maddening experience.

Does anyone remember the '00 Hugger Orange. It took years of effort to get that in the pipeline....and the end result was something quite abit short of what I would consider Hugger Orange.

Yes, covering more material makes paint match more difficult, but, part of that problem could be solved by having the whole car use plastic body panels... unlike the 4th Gen which had metal quarters, plastic fenders and doors, another material on the hood, and yet another on the fascias (I believe that is all true).

I'd be willing to bet that every car built today has more than one material to paint over... steel body and plastic fasicias are on every single car.

Some cars use more than one metal....

An obsticle? Perhaps... a huge issue?... I dunno... :think: I think it is no different than any other car.


PS: Hugger Orange was a 99 color. ;)