69 1/4 mile times?

I swas trying to look up 69 camaro quarter mile times and stumbled upon this page. I just had delivered my new 69 RS camaro (Bought it off Ebay). The car is real nice , it is an original #'s matching stock 350ci engine 2 barrel 4spd with 255 horsepower (from factory). The guy I bought it from added an
Edelbrock 600cfm carb, with Edelbrock Performer manifold. Brand new Richmond T-10 4 spd tranny, with Hurst super comp shifter. Hooker headers with new duall exhaust system. It's a 10 bolt posi with 3:73 gears. Anyway my question is what is the ball park range if you had to guess (Approx) this car should run in the Quarter mile. Reason I ask is I just got it 2 days ago and a buddy of mine was instantly pestering me to run it using this G tech thing he bought for his mustang. Its a little thing you plug in your cigarette lighter and its supposed to tell you your quarter mile time,0-60 and hp and stuff based on the cars weight and something to do with G's. So I ran it today and I dont know too much but I thoght it would do better then it did. I dont want to reveal what it ran until i can get some responses here. My second question is are these tihing accurate at all? I thought the car would be alot quicker then it did but maybe i was expecting to much. Any help or guesses of what it should run and not what it did run would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. Cazz

probably in the 15's range on a good day...255 hp isn't a lot when it comes to a steel body

I would expect mid to high 15's with that engine stock. But since it's modified maybe mid to low 15's. But if it hasn't been tuned properly, you might actually lose power since it was an original 2bbl engine.

Thats what I was thinking high to low 15's. We ran it 5 times and best was 16.98 and 17.2's consistanty. I drove it three times him twice. I got the best time. I thought for sure that it should do a little better then that. Now on to my next question. Obviosly im not happy with 17's, what can I do to get it to the 13.5 -14 range. Any ideas? also any ideas on how much it will cost to get it there? And is that considered pretty fast with out making it a race car. It's all stock looking and I want to keep it that way. Thanks for the quick answers and any help in the future. Cazz

Originally posted by cazz69rs
Thats what I was thinking high to low 15's. We ran it 5 times and best was 16.98 and 17.2's consistanty. I drove it three times him twice. I got the best time. I thought for sure that it should do a little better then that. Now on to my next question. Obviosly im not happy with 17's, what can I do to get it to the 13.5 -14 range. Any ideas? also any ideas on how much it will cost to get it there? And is that considered pretty fast with out making it a race car. It's all stock looking and I want to keep it that way. Thanks for the quick answers and any help in the future. Cazz

Have your heads machined, and while your heads are off do a cam swap. Prolly want to look into a new intake too.

That's really bad for a car with 3.73 gears regardless of the engine. There is something wrong with the engine combination. Maybe the 4 bbl isn't opening properly. Do a basic tune up and check the timing, look at the spark plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc. Bone stock, a 69 Camaro SS350 with 300 hp is good for low 15's to high 14's so a 250hp engine should still be good for mid to high 15's. Unless you put some information into the G-tech wrong like the gears or tire size.

Thanks for the input guy's. All the G tech asked for is the cars weight witch I put in 3420 Car is 3050 according to regi and 190 for me and 180 for my friend. I think that G tech thing stinks. Must noy have been reading correct. As you might be able to tell I was not to happy seeing the camaro running 16.9 to 17's. So I tried it on my other car a 2000 Lincoln Ls (bone Stock) and I got a 15.5 in the rain. And the camaro feels a bit quicker. So I definately think something was wrong. Anyway in a realistic way is it possble if I was to change the intake/ carb setup and have the heads opened up and done to 202 i think instead of 194 and put in a different cam could I be in that 13.5-14 range. Just so you know the reason I want to be in that range is cause my buddys mustang runs 14.2 constantly at the track and I want to be able to beat him. I am very happy to have found this message board. Seems like there alot of cool people here who know what there taslking about. Thanks Much Cazz

I would think so. But really with an old car like that, they spit out a whole lot of power stock. They just have far outdated suspensions. Although I still think you should to the upper engine work, you will probably see bigger 1/4 gains with some well placed suspension mods and drag radials.

I think you're off on the weight of the car. It's probably closer to 3200-3400 lbs without you and your friend. You have to put the tire size in as well, don't you?

This paticular G-teck doesn't ask for tire size. I think you might be right with the weight thing maybe we had the wrong weight programed in. Actually now that I think about it my friend set that up so I don't even know what he put. Maybee it was sabatoge on his part to freak me out. Im gonna try it out again as soon as I can (It's been raining alot here). On to my latest obssesion. What would be some recomendations to get this puppy to run solid 13's? Cause I think thats my goal right now. I dont want to make a rocket out of it and I think 13's would be fast enough for me. I went on to see what a stock Z06 Corvette does and according to the Chevy website it will do 12.4@116mph and a stock regular Vette will do 13.22@109mph. I would ultimately like to be right around 13 flat. Just being able to take the regular Vette. I know it's impossible for anyone of you to tell me exactly what to do to get it to run 13 flat. But you guys seem to know a hell of alot more then I do. So any suggestions would be awsome. Im so excited just thinking about trying to get this camaro to run in the 13 range. Anxiously waiting for responses. Thanks again Cazz

Well what do you know about the motor other than its numbers matching? I mean when is the last time its been rebuilt? I wouldt think that with a few suspension mods Im not very good with suspension get someone else to help with that. A cam, headwork, headers and exhaust, and some good tires would get you around where you wanna be.

But thats assuming the motor is fresh.

Congrats on your car! got any pictures?

Im gonna try it out again as soon as I can (It's been raining alot here).

HAH. Sorry that's the only reason I wanted to reply to your post! I'm From NJ, and this weather blows! isn't this like the third week of rain we are having? I mean granted, a few days here and there were nice, but still a crap load of rain! I can't even take my car out to drive :/

Kosta

Sorry no pictures yet. I got to get my camera back from my sister. I have no idea when the motor was done or what was done to it. I have been thinkink it over since my last post and think im just gonna leave the car alone and forget about trying to making it faster. I Would love for it to go as fast as it looks nice but I don't know...
Everyone looks at it when it I drive it, so I should be happy.
It just dosent make sense to spend $2000.00 more just to go a little faster. And knowone can promisse me I can get it to were I want to be with those mods anyway. Who knows maybe ill change my mind again and decide to have the heads redone and change the cam, intake /carb. I definately thank anyone who responded. And would like to hear more oppinions. Should I go for it or leave it? save money and be happy? Who knows this stuff can drive someone crazy. Thanks Cazz

The weight of the car on the gtech only matters for hp and not et or mph..
The gtech is within a tenth or so of the track et and about 5mph higher than track et although your car really is going
the g tech mph ,the track reads lower because of averaging last 60ft.
You car is very slow for that power range
but it could easily be traction problems with those 3.73. The g tech doesn't give the critical 60ft time so we can't see how bad that first 60ft is on your car.

I have a mild 400 in my 80ta..a small edelbrock 600,dual exhaust and dynomax,no cat converters..no cam and
stock intake as far as I know..I got the engine with the car without any info.
I ran three in a row consistent 15.10 to 15.20 with 94 to 96mph with around 2.47
60fts. I did run a 16.7 by letting the car shift itself.I ran the 15.1 by shifting manually at 5000 to 5500rpm. My downshift isn't hooked up and the tranny was shifting at like 3000 at wot in drive..Also not sure but think I have only 3.08 or 2 series gears.I get almost zero wheelspin even when brake torquing the car. Stock tas ran mid 15s I think I read with the 400 engine.
My car has the air taken off but otherwise stock weight and the 400 is heavier than 350 chevy I think and my car weighed 3675 full tank of gas me out.not light. Also I am at 1900 feet altitude.This hurts like 3 tenths and 3mph or more.
For comparison with my estimated 450hp at the engine 99taws6 so far best has been a 13.35 at 109mph or so with a 2.27 60ft.These times are on a tazzo vpc and the mph is dead on the same as track mph and the et is usually within a tenth.
If you really want way better times assuming your engine is running right..
then you need drag radial type tires.
Stall converters are great in autos like 2500 to 3000 stall..you already have lots of gear..and then its time for headers..cam..better heads and or nos,etc. I still think you should be getting low to mid 15's for sure unless you are like at 5000 feet above seal level.Check fuel pressure with gauge,,change fuel filters..change plugs..check that all wires are on..
set timing play with advance curves..
thats about it and if still in doubt time to check compression ,leakdown etc.
but again if you let the car shift and you have no kickdown and it shifts at 3000 rpm like mine there is your problem.

Thanks for your input. I ran today and got best 16.6. Car is a 4 spd. Traction is a big issue I think. I come out of the hole as fast as I can without spinng the tires and I think thats were it sucks. Too slow. The car already has Hooker headers and a brand new exhaust with Floormasters. Im gonna bring it down to the neighborhood race place the guy over there is supposed to be great. Im gonna let him look it over. Several other people told me that the car should definately be in the low to mid even high 15's. It could be that the 4 barrel is not opening up soon enough or posibly not at all. Timing could be way off. I dont think the motor is all that tight. Something definately wrong and im gonna have the guy find out. Im toying with the idea of doing the motor over but its a 2 bolt main and my friends says if your gonna do it get a 4 bolt main.Im even thinking of a whole new motor. One that is built to run and do what i want. Can I get a 350 to run 13 sec? whats up with a 383 stroker? or am I gonna have to go to a big block 396,427,454,502? I am in such a pissy mood cause I can't decide if I should just leave it the way it is or go for something better. Hate to sound like a cry baby but it feels good to have an outlet like this site to come to, cause my family dont want to hear about this damn car anymore. Cazz

Originally posted by cazz69rs
Thanks for your input. I ran today and got best 16.6. Car is a 4 spd. Traction is a big issue I think. I come out of the hole as fast as I can without spinng the tires and I think thats were it sucks. Too slow. The car already has Hooker headers and a brand new exhaust with Floormasters. Im gonna bring it down to the neighborhood race place the guy over there is supposed to be great. Im gonna let him look it over. Several other people told me that the car should definately be in the low to mid even high 15's. It could be that the 4 barrel is not opening up soon enough or posibly not at all. Timing could be way off. I dont think the motor is all that tight. Something definately wrong and im gonna have the guy find out. Im toying with the idea of doing the motor over but its a 2 bolt main and my friends says if your gonna do it get a 4 bolt main.Im even thinking of a whole new motor. One that is built to run and do what i want. Can I get a 350 to run 13 sec? whats up with a 383 stroker? or am I gonna have to go to a big block 396,427,454,502? I am in such a pissy mood cause I can't decide if I should just leave it the way it is or go for something better. Hate to sound like a cry baby but it feels good to have an outlet like this site to come to, cause my family dont want to hear about this damn car anymore. Cazz

For what you seem to want to do I wouldnt think that the 2 bolt main will be a problem. And you can stay with it to keep the car numbers matching. And yes you can make a 350 do 13's lol. You can make a 350 run single digit 1/4s mile times. 383 stroker is just a little easier to build for power with. These days you can build one of those just as cheap as building a 355. (.030 over 350)

It depends what you wanna do really. Cause if you wanted to shell out the cash you could drop a big block in really easily but its not at all necassary. But again like i said before on stock 1969 suspension your gonna have to put out a hell of a lot of hp to run a low 13. If you just spend a little cash tightning up the suspension it will make your job much easier. Its just like you said traction is your big problem, and building the motor is only gonna make that worse

If you have plenty(quite a bit) of money, what I would do is pull the original(numbers matching) engine out, prep it for long term storage, and put it on a stand. That way if you for some reason should hot rod the heck out of it and blow your engine, you'll still have the original if you decide to sell it down the road(worth a lot more). Then, I would either build a 350, 383, or some odd big block, or just buy a crate motor. You won't have to tear into your sweet numbers matching block or have to worry about messing it up, especially if you are like me and like to get on it quite a bit. If that doesn't interest you, or you don't have the money, or don't care about the numbers matching block, yank it and build it ground up, or at least cam and heads. Some fat tires or drag radials would probably help alot too, to avoid wheelspin or having to slip the clutch to an oblivion. A posi wouldn't hurt i'm sure, or even a locker, if you don't already have one. Good luck with the project and I hope my two cents helps a little. Oh, by the way, You should be fine into the thirteens w/ a two bolt main block if that's the avenue you choose to take. Look at all the rustangs doing it on two bolt blocks. If you choose to go with another engine though, might as well opt for four bolts if you're going to have to spend the money anyways. A little extra strength never hurt anyone.

Thanks for your input. Like stated previously I just cant make up my mind on what to do. Few ?'s Is it possible by getting new heads,im looking at the Edelbrock Rpm heads(http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/index.html) and a mathing Cam I could get 13's out of it. Would you think I should change the manifold and carb also? Then could I be there. One thing I think I decided is that Im not going with a big block. A few things have to be changed to put one of those in and I dont want to get into that. Is it worth it to Stroke out my 2 bolt main 350 to a 383? Im starting to learn a little but im still confused. What Small Block Create engine will get me to 12.5 to 13's. I want to keep up and possibly take a stock Z06. Thats my main focus now cause I think I really want one but cant afford it so since I have this nice Camaro why not be able to go as fast as the vette. Where can I look at create motors? How much HP do I need to be were I want. All you guys really know your stuff and I appreciate all the help so far. I just wish it was a simple as someone saying do this,that, and this and you will run 12.5 to 13 sec. I now understand its not that easy. Thanks again for any suggestions. Cazz

With heads and the cam you might be able to pull a 13 on slicks. But on street tires you would probably still have to many traction problems to be where you want. Carb could probably stand to go a little bigger maybe 650 or 750, but your manifold should be alright.

For crate motors look at GM performace catalogs, summit, or Jegs magazines. You could stroke out your 2 bolt probably wouldnt have a problem with it, but you can go pick up a 4 bolt main 350 block from anywhere for not much $ at all.

You could build a motor with the same hp as a Z06 and still not be able to touch it because of 30+ years of suspension work. Ive said it before and Ill say it again. With a car from the late 60s that may very well be on the suspension it rolled off the lot with you will see much bigger gains in times if you get to work on your suspension that if you concentrate soley on the motor. Youll never get that beast to hook up otherwise.

p.s. Try to separate your thoughts a little bit using separate paragraphs lol. It gives me a headache trying to read one of your posts.

13's are easy in old cars. My 70 SS ran 12.90 in street trim (it did have Mickey Thompson SS tires but not slapper bars or anything) w/ ported heads and when I changed it up ran a 13.36 w/ stock long block but w/ a Lunati cam.

Since your engine doesn't need to be rebuilt, might as well use it. What you would need to do is get a better intake. Weiand Stealth or Edelbrock RPM if you. Get larger carb: 750 CFM Quadrajet or Holley. AFB's just don't do it for all out performance. Cam choice is critical. I'd suggest w/ your gears a Lunati Street master .507" lift IIRC 236* duration (any cam manufacturer's cam w/ similar specs should work), but get the correct springs and lifters for the cam. This set up w/ some softer tires (drag radials, Mickey SS, or something like that) should get you well into the 13's w/stock heads. I ran my 13.36 w/ this set up, granted I did have 4.11 instead of 3.73 but that won't make that big of difference. I was also running a th350 w/a 10" converter and HEI w/accel coil. IF you want faster, same set up w/ good flowing heads. If your looking for a manifold and are going to get heads anyway, check out the vortec heads and a manifold that'll fit them.

I agree with Darth, do some suspension work and you'll see more of what your engine can do.

Thanks for the advice. Ill try to seperate my thoughts a little better.
I got an appointment with the local speed shop on tuesday. Im gonna see what he suggests and go from there.

I am basicly gonna have him look this motor over and see if its running correctly then see if it's worth putting New Heads(Edelbrock Performer Rpm) mathing Cam, Performer Rpm Intake and 750cfm Holley Carb. If he thinks the bottom half of the motor wont hold up or if it's just not worth it then Im gonna have him build me a Small Block 350 4 bolt main probably stroked to 383 or something like that.

This might sound extremely dumb but what are other things that can be done to a 350 small block and what would the end result be in cubic inches.

The only thing I was told about was strokeing it out to a 383 witch to be very honest I still dont understand what that is.

What are some things that can be done to the susspension? I know nothing about the that.

Any Ideas on a web site were I can get tires for the rear that would "Hook UP"?

Greed for speed Whats AFB's?
Thanks again Cazz

Cazz,

Where in NY are you?

Here's my 2 cents:

1st and foremost:

Just ENJOY your car this summer by driving it.

DO NOT trust any speed shop guys yet - you're new to this, you don't know much and you might be taken for a ride! No pun intended.

Learn to tune the carburetor yourself. There's usually some power to be found.

Start reading about small block chevy's - pick up chevy hi-performance mag, hot rod, etc. to learn the basics.

Frequent the tech boards on the web. Just lurk and read along because there is plenty to learn.

Make a few visits to the local drag strip to see what your car will trap at (1/4 MILE MPH). This will give you a good idea of how much power the car has. The ET's can improve with practice and you can find the ideal shift points. Seek out others at the track with small block chevy's (plenty out there) and ask questions - most folks will be very open.

By the time the winter comes around you'll have a very good idea of what you want out of your car and how to get there. You may even find it to be a lot cheaper and easier than you thought originally. Then you have all those crappy winter months to get the car ready for next spring and drive it.

Good luck.


By the way...it's FLOWmasters not FLOORmasters.

Arizona302, I visited your musle car page and in one of the pic's I noticed 2 of Suffolk's finest in the back ground so we must be close. You had some cool cars. Im in Holtsville. How about you?

Thanks for your input makes alot of sense. I'll probably end up having a motor built in the winter months and be ready for next spring. Thats a great idea and gives me more time to save some loot. Also thanks for the heads up about mispelling flowmaster.
CAZZ

Lots of good advice here. I've always had good luck with 400sbc motors. Even mild 400's (406ci) with a good set of heads, cam, intake, carb etc. will get you in the low 13's easily. The 383 is a great engine too. It's all a matter of what you want to spend. If it were me, I'd get the current motor tuned (timing, carb etc) to see what it can do. You could be losing 50+HP just from lack of proper tuning. Are you getting full throttle? Like you and others have mentioned, if the bottom end is good, throw on a set of aftermarket heads (under 200cc) and a cam like a 270 Magnum.

Most of all, have fun with it and enjoy your classic Camaro. Ask some of the other guys here, getting your car exactly how you want it is usually a long term project. It takes time. Good luck!

Originally posted by cazz69rs
Arizona302, I visited your musle car page and in one of the pic's I noticed 2 of Suffolk's finest in the back ground so we must be close. You had some cool cars. Im in Holtsville. How about you?

Thanks for your input makes alot of sense. I'll probably end up having a motor built in the winter months and be ready for next spring. Thats a great idea and gives me more time to save some loot. Also thanks for the heads up about mispelling flowmaster.
CAZZ

I live in Huntington. Have you been to Bald Hill on Tuesday nights? I was down there this past Tues - it was packed. Let me know if you're planning on going. Would love to see your car. 1st gen Camaro's rock!

Arizona302 , Absolutely I was there Tuesday night great turn-out. I have been there a couple of times last year. Last Tuesday was my first this for this year. I try to make it there when I can. Maybee I will run into you up there. CAZZ

An AFB carb is an Edelbrock or Carter. Its just a certain design of carb.

I agree w/arizona. Learn some stuff before you jump in. This limits the amount of "D'OH!"s. I got bent a few times when I was new to the game. Definately get some car mags like he said. I'm getting rid of my old ones, too bad you're not close. I'd give them to ya.

The 383 is a 350 block bored .030 w/a crank out of a 400. These engine make great torque at lower RPM. Don't live too well on oval tracks. Prolonged high RPM isn't their forte anyway.
Other SB engine combos that you can do: 377, its a 400 block w/350 crank. This is a higher revving combo great for road racing, oval track, etc. You could also build a long rod 350. Basically 6.0" rods instead of 5.7". I've seen a 6" rod 350 run circles around a 5.7" rod 350 on an oval track, and the 5.7" had the larger cam. I'm not sure there is as much benefit to it in drag racing.

In all seriousness, if you need a rebuild. Don't think you have to have a 4 bolt main. Also if you need a crank your 350 can use a 305 crank. They're usually cheaper for some reason and are the same throw etc. I've heard they're balanced better, but have no proof. Also, don't limit your parts choices to Edelbrock. There are many others out there. Shop around. Check out summitracing.com and get a free catalog if you want. This is a good sorce for parts or just to browse. Lets you see more of what is out there.

As for hooking, there are a lot of tricks. Common things, lift or slapper bars, adjust pinion angle, sticky tires. If you want to really hook up, get some subframe connectors BEFORE or you'll get those nice cracks in your paint at the body area above your side windows (towards the rear) from body flex.

To make it handle better: poly urethane bushings, larger diameter sway bar. There are also tubular A-arm kits for 1st gens if you want to go that far. Also larger/wider rims and lower series tires. FYI: Shorter sidewalls aren't a good thing for hooking up on launches.

gtech pro's are actually really accurate. i have one myself, i found 2 things though, you have to have it perfectly .00 level.
and take off about .5 of a second if u go to a track because of traction. i can only launch at 1200 on the street, where at the local strip i launch at 2500 cuz of the rubber.

i took it to the strip when i ran, it said i ran a 15.10 @ 95 mph. when in actuality i ran a 15.23 @91.2. the mph's are known to be about 3-5% to high. but the time's are very accurate.

i can't wait to go back this year, i dumped about $1500 since the 15's.

my 0-60 on the street is 5.8 so im happy with that considering traction problems.

Ok well I was bored one day and I took my Gtech with me to the drag strip. I ran a 13.8 and my gtech told me a 13.6 but where it was WAY off was the MPH it told me 108 Mph where i ran a 102.

If you want to run 13s. Get the heads worked on and put a hot cam kit in. The car will sound a bit rumpy and be totally drivable with your 3.73s. A good dual plane intake will work best with a hot cam and a 650 to 700 carb will more than likely put that thing into the miod 13s which is a respectable time for an old camaro.