Screw CTSv, I got an EVO

I was ready to buy a $35-$40k CTSv, $50K is too much. So for $30K I got:

13.8 1/4 mile
0-60 in 5.0 sec
.97g on the skidpad :eek:
4 weel drive
4 piston brembo brakes
Recardo racing seats
5 speed with 3 syncros for 1st and 2nd gears
aluminum front clip
A rather large back seat
HID's that are adjustable with a button on the dash
Automatic water sprayers to keep the intercooler cool

And best of all, its a 4 door 4 cylinder, so my insurance doesn't even go up:D

Im a chevy guy at heart, but what chevy am I supposed to buy?

Awesome car man. Guys on the site may rag on you for it (the obvious domestic bias), but when you break it down the Evo is an awesome ride. If do a search in the lounge, you should be able to find a post by Robvas in which a guy drove a bone stock evo to a 13.1 quarter at ~102-104mph. I think most guys are pulling mid 13s with them. Its gonna be awesome when guys are running mid 12s with minimal mods.

I'd love to see some pictures of it.

You were never going to wait for a CTSv. The pricing hasnt been released yet. It may be 50 grand it may be 40 grand. But its worth 20K more than the evo. Oh, the CTSv is not a chevy.

A CTSv can be the bargain of the century and be $40k, but if you can't afford it--you can't afford it! It is also a car no one has even driven and is getting a lot of hype on it's drivetrain alone. And at the end of the day, I bet it has comparable performance numbers (or is short of) the Evolution...which costs $29k. Shows you want kind of a bargain it is!

The Evo is an excellent car. Personally, I would have waited to compare it with the WRX STi, which will only cost $2k more than the Evo ($30,995). It'll top all of those numbers posted above for the Evolution.

Originally posted by Evil Turbo SS
You were never going to wait for a CTSv. The pricing hasnt been released yet. It may be 50 grand it may be 40 grand. But its worth 20K more than the evo. Oh, the CTSv is not a chevy.


I don't think it really is worth an extra $20K. It would piss me off to pay an extra $20,000 to look at someone elses tailights:p

JMO

EVO is not my cup of tea, but it is a nice performer.

Congrats.

Originally posted by bigsteve7
I'd love to see some pictures of it.

Me too, It doesn't arrive untill June 10th though. O'well, just enough time to clean up and sell my car. If I wanted one now, it would have to of been white or yellow, I'm holding out for blue.

Hopefully the 5th gen camaro will be a perfect replacement car when it comes out in'07.

For what its worth, the mustang was never a consideration for me.

So for $30K I got:

You forgot to add "One hideously ugly body"

But it IS quite quick. I might be looking at the WRX STi later this summer if any are laying around on dealer lots.

Uh.... you were going to buy a Cadillac, but you went for a Mitsubishi instead? Um....OK. :confused:

To me $30 grand is a little steep for a car like that, but a car purchase is purely a matter of what appeals to someone, so congratulations! It is no doubt one hot car.

Out of curiosity, did you consider the Dodge SRT-4?

EVO's look cool especially in the rear view mirror... :D Its no CTSv but who has time to wait for that. The Lancer EVO is a bit too ricy for me but I can see why people like them. Good luck with it!

Originally posted by guionM
Uh.... you were going to buy a Cadillac, but you went for a Mitsubishi instead? Um....OK. :confused:

To me $30 grand is a little steep for a car like that, but a car purchase is purely a matter of what appeals to someone, so congratulations! It is no doubt one hot car.

Out of curiosity, did you consider the Dodge SRT-4?

Hey, I was with you guys up untill 3 days ago at which point I saw one in real life. Yes, I will shave the wing, but other than that, this is a sharp car, it is not riced out at all.

This car will outperform a corvette, especially in the turns, and you all say $30k is too much. I know most of you will have the knee jerk reaction of hating it w/o even giving it a chance. Keep your eyes shut and remain a bunch of haters, no skin off my back, but this car is the performance bargain right now. Minimal mods and it will run high 12's.

The SRT is another dodge POS. A powerful engine shoehorned in a ****ty car (aka viper).

Well, basically the line of thought is that you're paying 30 grand for a Lancer. Which is an econo-car.

Personally I think the EVO looks silly, but it is quite a performer. It's just sad nowadays because there are no real choices other than the Mustang if you want a "muscle" car.

Originally posted by slt
Hey, I was with you guys up untill 3 days ago at which point I saw one in real life. Yes, I will shave the wing, but other than that, this is a sharp car, it is not riced out at all.

This car will outperform a corvette, especially in the turns, and you all say $30k is too much. I know most of you will have the knee jerk reaction of hating it w/o even giving it a chance. Keep your eyes shut and remain a bunch of haters, no skin off my back, but this car is the performance bargain right now. Minimal mods and it will run high 12's.

The SRT is another dodge POS. A powerful engine shoehorned in a ****ty car (aka viper).

I'm pretty open minded to just about any car, and I'm not going to say the EVO is a bad car... far from it.

However, being that loaded Mitsubishi Lancers pretty much top out at $16-18,000, I just really question as to whether there is enough stuff on that car to justify the $12-14,000 price increase, and if it's really worth the 33% premium over the SRT-4. Nothing more, nothing less. That's all.

None the less, you obviously don't like Chrysler (The SRT-4 engine is from Mitsubishi :p ), so my question's been answered. ;)

Originally posted by slt
I know most of you will have the knee jerk reaction of hating it w/o even giving it a chance. Keep your eyes shut and remain a bunch of haters,...

:think:


Originally posted by slt
The SRT is another dodge POS. A powerful engine shoehorned in a ****ty car (aka viper).

:think: :think:

Id rock an EVO, they're cool looking, but it and the CTSv are not even in the same class of cars.

Originally posted by bigsteve7
Awesome car man. Guys on the site may rag on you for it (the obvious domestic bias), but when you break it down the Evo is an awesome ride. If do a search in the lounge, you should be able to find a post by Robvas in which a guy drove a bone stock evo to a 13.1 quarter at ~102-104mph. I think most guys are pulling mid 13s with them. Its gonna be awesome when guys are running mid 12s with minimal mods.

I'd love to see some pictures of it.

Nice car. But I think new car enthusiasm is going to peoples heads a little.

Er... 271 HP @6500 rpm, curb weight 3263lbs, AWD (with the associated higher drivetrain losses that go with it)? 13.1 seconds and bone stock? :rolleyes: Not in this universe. Such a claim is pure bull****.

Originally posted by guionM


However, being that loaded Mitsubishi Lancers pretty much top out at $16-18,000, I just really question as to whether there is enough stuff on that car to justify the $12-14,000 price increase, and if it's really worth the 33% premium over the SRT-4. Nothing more, nothing less. That's all.



I don't think any current performance car compares to the value of the Dodge SRT-4. The Lancer Evo seems to be a bit quicker, but half a second in 0-60 time and 4 mph of top speed doesn't justify a $10,000 premium. Dodge moved the "import" performance game ahead with the SRT-4.

Isn't it ironic that a Neon has replaced the F-body as the "world's greatest performance value?"

Those are very nice performance numbers, and I'm not "hating." :)But as with the SRT-4, if I drove one daily, I don't think I could shake the feeling/knowledge that my car's original intended purpose was as an economy runabout. Just a personal opinion.

The SRT-4 isn't quite in the same class as the Evo. That $10k premium also buys you a better quality car, awd, much better handling (and no torque steer) and a car with a distinct tradition. I'm sure an Evo enthusiast would also be quick to point out the regular Lancer and Evolution share very few parts, both in skin and underneath it. This is more than a $16k Lancer with a turbo.

Just as you distinquish a class difference in the CTS and Evo, there is also one between the SRT-4 and Evo, despite their .5 second acceleration differences to 60. If you lived on any other continent, you would have no problem accepting this car as a well-engineered, performance bargain.

I'm also into AWD turbo imports, but a stock EVO won't be close to a Vette or CTSv, well, at least at the dragstrip.

Given 3800lb weight & 400hp for the CTSv, I'm confident it'll run high 12's@108mph for the magazines. . .

A C5 would also beat the EVO around a track, not just in a straight line.

I would've waited for the STI. Sounds like Mitsu is really pushing it for hp w/ all the boost. What is it, like 17psi??

Most stock setups (syclones/typhoons, Buicks, DSMs) never go over 14 or 15psi. Heck, Supras only have like 10psi stock.

Anyways, I think the STI will be the bad one, and I think in the right hands it'd go high 12's@ ~106mph, stock w/ some track tricks done.

Mike Green
12.5@114 w/ 2.0
98 Z28 M6 w/ hotcam & headers

Um, I am going with the reality that a Stock Corvette will blow the doors off that evo. Just because it has a turbo does not make it the fastest car around. I guess you think a Corvette will run slower times than a 13.8 that you quoted? Haven't seen many race have you? As far as around a track, I bet the Corvvete would not have a problem either. Not only that but, I bet the CTSv will also do the same.

Originally posted by jrp4uc
The SRT-4 isn't quite in the same class as the Evo. That $10k premium also buys you a better quality car, awd, much better handling (and no torque steer) and a car with a distinct tradition. I'm sure an Evo enthusiast would also be quick to point out the regular Lancer and Evolution share very few parts, both in skin and underneath it. This is more than a $16k Lancer with a turbo.

Just as you distinquish a class difference in the CTS and Evo, there is also one between the SRT-4 and Evo, despite their .5 second acceleration differences to 60. If you lived on any other continent, you would have no problem accepting this car as a well-engineered, performance bargain.

To start with, a Mitsubishi is not a Toyota, Honda, Nissan or even a Subaru - not all Japanese cars are created alike. So we're not talking about a "quality car," just a souped up rally-car version of the entry level Mitsubisi.

Secondly, I've liked the second generation Neon from day one. It's a well designed, inexpensive car. Far better than the Saturn Ion from where I stand. The interior materials, panel fit and paint quality are all 300M quality. Even the rear seating is spacious enough to be adequate. With the new front clip, hot turbo motor and upgraded gearshift, Chrysler has finally answered my last objections against the Neon. For $20k, the SRT-4 is worth every cent.

A Viper is not a POS. A Corvette will not be beat in a straight line, through a turn, on a road course, or anywhere by an EVO. You're comparing two of the finest sports cars on the planet to a tarted-up, turd-polished, jump-on-the-fix-up-the-car-that-mommy-got-me-bandwagon econocrapbox. Sorry. Reality check time.

Originally posted by Z28Marcus
Nice car. But I think new car enthusiasm is going to peoples heads a little.

Er... 271 HP @6500 rpm, curb weight 3263lbs, AWD (with the associated higher drivetrain losses that go with it)? 13.1 seconds and bone stock? :rolleyes: Not in this universe. Such a claim is pure bull****.

The Japanese versions of the car have been known to run low 13's at their "rated" 276hp. They were of course underrated but I see no reason as to why its not possible to run similar time slips with their "rated" 271hp. The time I'm talking about is documented with timeslips and a video where he is at the track racing a fellow board member Robvas.

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=107542&highlight=evo


Theres the thread with a link to timeslips and the video.

For all those who say the Evo isnt worth it, think Mustang Cobra vs. V6 Mustang. One cost less than $20k, the other over $30k. Is the Cobra worth it?

Now think Mustang Cobra vs. Evo. The cars are both top notch. Both have brembo brakes, one has a big supercharged V8, the other a small turbo 4. The evo will outhandle the Cobra, the Cobra out accelerate teh Evo. Subjectively the Evo also has a nicer interior (more modern) Both are high performance cars, just different strokes for different folks. Is the quality of a Mustang Cobra really that good when it shares most of its parts minus drivetrain with a sub 20k car? That seems to be the arguement many are making agasint the Evo.

Hell Camaro SS's and WS6's were going for $30k. How much nicer of a car is a F-body than an Evo quality wise? Theyre just different cars. The Evo will run all kinds of circles around a F-body minus strait line performance.

It seems $30k is a fair price to me. I'm not trying to say the Evo is God or anything. It just seems people are quick to downplay it because of its appearance and its highly regarded status among the import crowd. All I'm saying is that its not a half bad deal.

Here are some interesting #'s from edmunds.com to show how the Evo Stacks up.

Horsepower
lbs/hp

1. BMW M3 coupe - 10.2 lbs/hp
2. Mitsubishi Lancer Evo - 11.1
3. Nissan 350Z track - 11.2
4. Honda S2000 - 11.7
5. Infiniti G35 coupe 6speed - 12.2
6. Subaru WRX sedan - 13.6
7. Acura RSX Type S - 13.9
8. BMW 330i sedan 5spd - 14.6

Torque
This is what lbs/ft lbs looks like:

1. Mitsubishi Lancer Evo - 11.2
2. Nissan 350Z track - 11.7
3. Infiniti G35 coupe 6spd - 12.7
3. Porsche Boxster S (2003 model) - 12.7
5. BMW M3 - 13.0
6. Subaru WRX sedan - 14.2
7. BMW 330i sedan - 15.4
8. Honda S2000 - 18.4
9. Acura RSX type S - 19.6

Originally posted by guionM
\

None the less, you obviously don't like Chrysler (The SRT-4 engine is from Mitsubishi :p ), so my question's been answered. ;)

He called the Dodge CARS "pos's" not the engines. He said it was a powerful engine in a POS car...which I agree w/...

Originally posted by Z28Marcus
Nice car. But I think new car enthusiasm is going to peoples heads a little.

Er... 271 HP @6500 rpm, curb weight 3263lbs, AWD (with the associated higher drivetrain losses that go with it)? 13.1 seconds and bone stock? :rolleyes: Not in this universe. Such a claim is pure bull****.

Look it up man, their all running right around that time...

Originally posted by centric
A Viper is not a POS. A Corvette will not be beat in a straight line, through a turn, on a road course, or anywhere by an EVO. You're comparing two of the finest sports cars on the planet to a tarted-up, turd-polished, jump-on-the-fix-up-the-car-that-mommy-got-me-bandwagon econocrapbox. Sorry. Reality check time.

He never compared it to either of those cars....
...and the Viper is a POS with a powerful engine, exactly what he said. It has no utility use, no luxery, besides the convertable...
And the Evo will keep up w/ a 350 Horse C5 and nearly the 400 HP Z06 in a straight line. So hes just comparing the performance of these cars, and right fully so...

Originally posted by Meccadeth
He called the Dodge CARS "pos's" not the engines. He said it was a powerful engine in a POS car...which I agree w/...



Look it up man, their all running right around that time...



He never compared it to either of those cars....
...and the Viper is a POS with a powerful engine, exactly what he said. It has no utility use, no luxery, besides the convertable...
And the Evo will keep up w/ a 350 Horse C5 and nearly the 400 HP Z06 in a straight line. So hes just comparing the performance of these cars, and right fully so...

So what do youi consider "keeping up"?......................within 15 car lengths?

Originally posted by SNEAKY NEIL
So what do youi consider "keeping up"?......................within 15 car lengths?

What does a corvette run stock, right around 13.5 & 0-60 in 5 sec. what does a stock corvette pull on the skidpad, .85??

Corvette vs Evo
13.5 sec vs 13.5 sec
5.0 sec vs 5.0 sec
.85g vs .95g
45K vs 30k

Originally posted by slt
What does a corvette run stock, right around 13.5 & 0-60 in 5 sec. what does a stock corvette pull on the skidpad, .85??

Corvette vs Evo
13.5 sec vs 13.5 sec
5.0 sec vs 5.0 sec
.85g vs .95g
45K vs 30k

Actually a well driven Vette is capable of a high 12 et. but then again a well driven Evo is capable of a high 13 so its not exactly blown out of the water. Your point still stands, I'm just tryin to cover your but a little bit.

The one place the vette has you beat though is trap speed. Then again, the Vette did cost $15k more...

Its kinda of dumb to argue which is the better car. Theyre so different. Its all in what you want and how much you have to spend.

anyways, like it or not, these new 4 door cars are definantly raising the bar of performance.. be it a M3, Evo, WRX, Neon, CTSv


back to the orig topic, I don't blame you for looking at the Evo instead of the CTSv. If I had the money laying around I would definantly be considering it..

Originally posted by slt
What does a corvette run stock, right around 13.5 & 0-60 in 5 sec. what does a stock corvette pull on the skidpad, .85??

Corvette vs Evo
13.5 sec vs 13.5 sec
5.0 sec vs 5.0 sec
.85g vs .95g
45K vs 30k

Just to let you know, your Vette numbers are a bit on the "soft" side ;) Anyways, congrats on the new ride and have fun!


-Mike

Gee....we actually are now comparing Corvettes to FWD sedans?? :D

Look, the EVO is a great little car. I even congratulated slt on his purchase. It's hella quick, handles hella well, and is chock full of the latest street high-tech. In it's class nothing can touch it outside of the upcomming WRX and the SRT-4 (the difference to 60, let alone in the quarter mile can still be a tossup in the real world), so I don't know how it ended up being compared to the Vette.

Meccadeth, Chrysler has a reputation (well deserved) that far exceeds their actual cars today, which I wouldn't exactly call a POS. My mom has a Neon which was a problem child after 30,000 miles. A co-worker back in San Diego had a newer one he ran the wheels off without a hitch.

As for the Viper, it isn't for everyone because it's a purpose built car, just like the original Cobras. If one want's luxury or utility use, I don't think that person would buy a Camaro, let alone a Viper. But enough people want one that Chrysler has always had a pretty sizable waiting list to get one.

Not every car is for every one. I would have prefered the SRT-4, slt prefered the EVO, that's all.

It's not like he chose a Silverado SS over a Lightning. ;)

Originally posted by guionM


Meccadeth, Chrysler has a reputation (well deserved) that far exceeds their actual cars today, which I wouldn't exactly call a POS. My mom has a Neon which was a problem child after 30,000 miles. A co-worker back in San Diego had a newer one he ran the wheels off without a hitch.

As for the Viper, it isn't for everyone because it's a purpose built car, just like the original Cobras. If one want's luxury or utility use, I don't think that person would buy a Camaro, let alone a Viper. But enough people want one that Chrysler has always had a pretty sizable waiting list to get one.



I'm going to slap myself for SLT because I'm hijacking this a bit...

Chrysler does have a deserving reputation, but Dodge gets undeserved credit in my mind. I shouldnt have called the Viper a POS, but if you take away that engine, then it is a basicly a POS...but it is a fast one at that...And as for that sizable waiting list, doesnt Dodge sell like, 2000 of those a year or something? And last I heard, they took a loss in $$ in their 1st gen Vipers.

Once again, sorry SLT...

Originally posted by slt
What does a corvette run stock, right around 13.5 & 0-60 in 5 sec. what does a stock corvette pull on the skidpad, .85??

Corvette vs Evo
13.5 sec vs 13.5 sec
5.0 sec vs 5.0 sec
.85g vs .95g
45K vs 30k

Those are numbers for a Vette from over 10 years ago, except for the skidpad, so if that's what you were going for then fine. I can't remember when a Corvette had such a low skidpad number.....................I think the Beatles had thier first album that year.

Originally posted by guionM
Gee....we actually are now comparing Corvettes to FWD sedans?? :D

AWD;):)

Id wager that the Cobra would be every bit as fast, if not faster, than the EVO on a road course.

Somebody send the DEA after slt he must be smoking from the largest stash of wacky tabaky in the US!!!

13.3 @107.5 R&T stock c5 350 hp
12.90 @ 108 GMHTP stock c5 350 hp

I have never seen a c5 below .90

I have driven my old 99 C5 to a 13.2 @106
I have driven my z06 to a 12.1 @ 116mph on stock tires I have seen others go into the high 11s in a 02/03 z06. The z06 does over 1 G in some tests has better stopping slolom ect....

Hell, my 01 SS went 12.90 w 11k on the clock, stock.

Give me any paved surface and any test of performance (besides 0-15 mph)Put me in my z06 and put any driver you want in the evo and I will win. Oh, hom many groceries you can haul 0-60 isnt a performance test.
:cool:

THe new Evo is quick, but it is a cheap $12,000 car with a $20,000 suspension and powertrain upgrade. I have seen old Chevettes do 10 sec. in the 1/4mi.

Plus it doesn't have that classy look of an M3 or CTSv.

if I was going to pay $30K-36K on a new car I'd get the CTSv, no need to cheap out to save 3 or 4 grand. if you really wanted to save some cash you should have just got the SRT-4 there is only like a 2/10th sec difference in the 1/4mi.

chicks will think you gay in your Evo. (not that there is anything wrong with that):D

But there is something wrong with thinking your evo can beat any C5.

Im sticking with my under the influence theory.

Congrats on ur purchase slt. not exactly what im into but hey different people like different cars.

But as much as you'll like ur Evo, there is no way its gonna outrun a C5. And against a Z06, forget about it. not flaming on you or anything but thinking a turbo 4 sedan can take a world class sports car in the twisties is a little far fetched. now on the rally course, thats a different story :D

Originally posted by guionM
Gee....we actually are now comparing Corvettes to FWD sedans?? :D



Geeeeez this is exactly what I'm thinking. I've been sick all week and I come back to read this......man we need some new convo.:D ;) :rolleyes:

Originally posted by slt
AWD;):)

I'd better update this a bit since we now are comparing the EVO sedan to CTSv's and the Corvette/EVO comparison has elevated to a Z06/EVO comparison.

I'm just waiting for someone to drag out the Space Shuttle or a Nimitz Class carrier for a g-force or horsepower comparison next. :D

They gotta go though John Force first!

Originally posted by Meccadeth

...and the Viper is a POS with a powerful engine, exactly what he said. It has no utility use, no luxery, besides the convertable...
And the Evo will keep up w/ a 350 Horse C5 and nearly the 400 HP Z06 in a straight line. So hes just comparing the performance of these cars, and right fully so...

Just curious, not to stir flames, but why is Viper considered a POS vehicle? Isn't it a pretty solid performer? If you say Viper is POS, wouldn't Corvette be too?

And who the heck buys those car for utility? Really, do you think I will ask the saleperson "gee, I'm wondering, can I fit a pair of skis inside? I'm thinking of going to Aspen come this January."

Evo will beat C5 right off the line, possibly to 60 mph. C5 does have good advantage at higher speeds, as is attested to by trap speed. It does pull lower Gs, that is for sure, but I do not think they're below .90.

As for Evo/Z06... It is absurd that a car that traps 12 mph less in the quarter mile would "keep up".

Having said all of the above, I think Evo is a great package. :thumb: Congratulations :thumb: on acquiring such a neat piece of machinery, I am certain you will enjoy it in the years to come. And this is no sarcasm either :D, I mean it.

Originally posted by Z28x
THe new Evo is quick, but it is a cheap $12,000 car with a $20,000 suspension and powertrain upgrade. I have seen old Chevettes do 10 sec. in the 1/4mi.

Plus it doesn't have that classy look of an M3 or CTSv.

if I was going to pay $30K-36K on a new car I'd get the CTSv, no need to cheap out to save 3 or 4 grand. if you really wanted to save some cash you should have just got the SRT-4 there is only like a 2/10th sec difference in the 1/4mi.

chicks will think you gay in your Evo. (not that there is anything wrong with that):D

Read an earlier posting on base V6 Mustang vs. Cobra. Same difference.

As great as SRT-4's straight-line performance is, it's no good handler. And it IS only FWD, and has LOTS of torque steer. It doesn't even compare to Evo. SRT-4 is designed to be an econobox car with great engine. Evo is designed to be a solid performer in all respects (handling, breaking, not just acceleration). And we will see which car will start to fall apart in 3 years, you bet your shiny metal ass my money is on the Neon. (Italics Bender's)

Jeez, some of you guys are really downplaying the LS1 alot.

Saying an Evo can beat a C5 is rediculous. Add the Z06 to the mix and it's straight up no contest.

Originally posted by Schismblade
Saying an Evo can beat a C5 is rediculous. Add the Z06 to the mix and it's straight up no contest.

You guys are missing the entire point. Wasn't it just last week everyone was raving that a misquoted BobLutz had said the 400hp CTSv would be available for $36k. 0-60mph in about 5 sec or less for mid $30s. Everyone was signing up for it.

Now it is all but confirmed that the CTSv will sticker for $40k+...but this Evo is pulling off just as impressive performance for UNDER $30,000!! :eek:--and near everyone is slamming this guy for buying one!! It is a credit to the Evo that it is even being mentioned in the same breath as the Corvette. I would hope a Vette/Z06 will outperform it---it costs $20k+ more!!

And for those who insist on drawing comparisons or making the case for a SRT-4 (which is "only" a half second slower to sixty and a full second in the quarter) because of a cheaper price tag is like suggesting someone buy a Mustang GT over a Trans Am WS6. It's the same type of car, right? Why not save some coin and get close to the same performance?? We all know there is more to those two cars, just as there are more that separates the Evo and SRT-4. It's just a matter of the people on this board knowing nothing more about them than what the magazines print on the last page.

BTW, I think many would consider the Viper "less than spectacular" in areas outside of its engine and performance numbers. It is still an $80k muscle car, and--certainly moreso with the first gens--was known to have low quality interiors and heat issues for its occupants. Why do you think the Vette is usually the winner in the head-to-heads? It's delivers almost the same performance and is a higher quality and more livable car.

slt, what minor mods can be done to get the EVO into the 12's?

Originally posted by CLEAN
slt, what minor mods can be done to get the EVO into the 12's?

Not sure, I'm new to the Evo sceen, but I know my GF's turbo GTI repsonded very well to a chip and a 2.75" catback. Remember there are some of these (evos) running 13.1 stock. There is a WRX across the street from where I work that has about $3,000 in it, alot of that in the suspension, that runs consistent 12's at the track, not bad since those only cost like $24k new.


I'm not saying this car is a corvette killer, I'm comparing the two more for dramatic effect. In all reality, stock vs stock, the Corvette would win more times than it would loose, BUT it would be a damn close race and Evo would definatley win in the hadling department, all for $15,000 less. The EVO beats the corvette at it's own game when it comes to affordable performance.

And if the CTSv does come out @$36,000, I will eat my $500 deposit I layed down for the EVO and buy one.

Originally posted by Z28x
THe new Evo is quick, but it is a cheap $12,000 car with a $20,000 suspension and powertrain upgrade. I have seen old Chevettes do 10 sec. in the 1/4mi.

The EVO is not a 12K lancer with just a power train upgrade, Major structural reinforcements give it twice the rigidity of a lancer. I could wast a lot of space going over the differences/improvements. The two share very little in common. This is not a neon w/a turbo.

Plus it doesn't have that classy look of an M3 or CTSv.

Can't argue with that, doen't have a $50k price tag though, either

if I was going to pay $30K-36K on a new car I'd get the CTSv, no need to cheap out to save 3 or 4 grand.

For an extra 6k, I would buy a CTSv too.

if you really wanted to save some cash you should have just got the SRT-4 there is only like a 2/10th sec difference in the 1/4mi.

Again, the SRT is just a Neon w/ a turbo. It doesn't compare to the EVO.

chicks will think you gay in your Evo. (not that there is anything wrong with that):D

If chicks think I'm gay for driving an EVO then they will think you are a hoosier with an insecurity problem for driving a Camaro. One of the first things my GF noticed about the EVO was the possibilities with its large backseat. Her exact words went something like "you cant do that in a G35";)

Hope you enjoy it--at least it has power to back up all the scoops ect. Still a pretty impressive car any way you look at it. Peronally the sound of the Subaru flat-4 is supposed to be wicked but to each his own. PLEASE ditch the wing!

Originally posted by 305fan
PLEASE ditch the wing!

Consider it done:D

Originally posted by slt
The EVO is not a 12K lancer with just a power train upgrade, Major structural reinforcements give it twice the rigidity of a lancer. I could wast a lot of space going over the differences/improvements. The two share very little in common. This is not a neon w/a turbo....

...Again, the SRT is just a Neon w/ a turbo. It doesn't compare to the EVO.


Actually.... it a Neon with a Mitsubishi turbocharged engine. :)

What you pointed out is pretty much exactly the point a few people here are raising. Despite massive structural improvements, it's still (at least in passing) a $14K cheap sedan being sold at $30K. Even if next to a more reasonably priced regular WRX (with much of the same pieces & reinforcements) it still costs $6,000 more!:eek:

Though the SRT-4 isn't a rally car with a history built on a rally race circuit or video games, will still no doubt be considered by the same people who would buy a WRX or EVO. DCX basically went the old fashioned route of mating a relatively extremely powerful engine with one of their lightest cars and created a godawfully quick rocket-sled at little more than the price of a Mustang V6 w/ automatic! Maybe it torque-steers like crazy, but no debating the fun-per-dollar factor (and that on dry pavement, the outcome of a race with the $30K AWD cars isn't guaranteed). :)

Hold the phone! The 2.4L that DC uses is a Mitsu motor??? Are you sure? The Turbo is definaltey a Mitsu but I thought the 2.4L was DC---it has a very low reline like most domestic 4 cly.

Originally posted by 305fan
Hold the phone! The 2.4L that DC uses is a Mitsu motor??? Are you sure? The Turbo is definaltey a Mitsu but I thought the 2.4L was DC---it has a very low reline like most domestic 4 cly.

DC motor, Mitsu turbo.

Originally posted by guionM
DCX basically went the old fashioned route of mating a .....

You seem to really like the SRT:) I think the SRT will be a very fun car to drive, but for enthusiasts it leaves alot to be desired, much like my GF's GTI. It will be interesting to see if it gets any credit, it tag line in it's demographic right now seems to be "yeah, but its a neon"

I just think the SRT-4 is the deal of the century (I'm a cheap bastard :D). At the price they're going for, and the fact that kids today are into FWD & turbos, I think Dodge just struck a gold mine.


BTW, this was on Autoweek today, regarding the new EVO:
http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carboard&loc_code=index&content_code=07968955


On a related story(since we are on the EVO/SRT-4 subject)....the next Neon will be based on the Lancer! (you can't make this stuff up):

Chrysler's next-generation Chrysler Sebring and PT Cruiser and Dodge Stratus and Neon will be developed from the same Mitsubishi Lancer platform. Mitsubishi plants also will be equipped to assemble the Chrysler and Dodge versions.

http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carnews&loc_code=index&content_code=04203847

Originally posted by slt
You seem to really like the SRT:) I think the SRT will be a very fun car to drive, but for enthusiasts it leaves alot to be desired, much like my GF's GTI.

The SRT will be a very fun car to drive... in a straight line. Hope they put extra handles inside the car to hold on to when taking a turn.

Actually, the SRT-4 is an exceptionally good handling car, so the extra handles would be for passengers to hold onto as the car digs into corners.



http://www.allpar.com/neon/neon-srt-4.html (everything you'd probally want to know about the SRT-4):
"...Almost unheard of in the compact car enthusiast arena, superior driveability from a production car is a Dodge Neon trademark that continues with SRT-4. Like autocross devotees, SRT-4 owners also will enjoy the car's agile handling capability made possible by 17-inch aluminum performance wheels, sticky 50 series tires, specially tuned strut and spring assemblies (front and rear), sway bars (front and rear), updated knuckles and a unique K-member"

"...This car is really put together in a way that my old Neon never was (regardless of the power train)..."

http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/roadtests/2002/december/0212_roadtest_srt4.xml (Car and Driver's article on it)

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/24.html (everything you'd want to know about the 2.4 engine)

I see the SRT-4 targeting the riced out civic people more than the Evo and WRX, but.... people looking for a fast econobox will no doubt be looking at the Evo, SRT-4, and WRX.

As far as the handling argument goes, how many people that buy one of these 3 cars need something that can pull .90+ g's? It's not like the SRT-4 corners like a Ford Aerostar (which is the most top heavy thing I have ever drove) Unless you are driving on a road corse the SRT-4 will handle fine. Plus most of the racing people do it stoplight to stoplight in a strait line.

I think my 99 Grand Pix handles great, not as good as my SS, but it is just enough for the type of driving that I do. I, just like most people, don't push my car to the limits as far as cornering goes (unless I'm ripping donuts;) )

What I don't like about the Lancer Evo 8 is that they took the Sh!ttiest car they make, and put it with the best powertrain and suspension they make. Why couldn't they have put all that stuff in the eclipes????????

271HP AWD Eclipes for $30,000 would have been a lot nicer:bow: even you slt must agree with me on that.

Who wants to guess what guionM next car will be?:D :p ;)

I just read that EVO is already running 19lbs of boost, stock. What else can you do to these things to eeek out more hp w/out having some major durability issues?

Originally posted by guionM
Actually.... it a Neon with a Mitsubishi turbocharged engine. :)


I'm reasonably sure that the turbo 4 in the SRT-4 is a Dodge engine, in fact, I remember reading that it's the only 4 cylinder that Mitsu/Chrysler is making currently that's still made by Dodge, and after a few years it will be phased out for exactly that reason.

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/24.html

Anywho, cool car slt. As others have said, I'd prefer the WRX, but a fast car is a fast car. :)

Edit: I noticed you posted the same link as I did...I didn't see where on there you got that it's a Mitsubishi engine?

Originally posted by stars1010
Who wants to guess what guionM next car will be?:D :p ;)

So far, GTO or El Camino.

I have a reputation to uphold! :D

Originally posted by MunchE
I'm reasonably sure that the turbo 4 in the SRT-4 is a Dodge engine, in fact, I remember reading that it's the only 4 cylinder that Mitsu/Chrysler is making currently that's still made by Dodge, and after a few years it will be phased out for exactly that reason.

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/24.html

Anywho, cool car slt. As others have said, I'd prefer the WRX, but a fast car is a fast car. :)

Edit: I noticed you posted the same link as I did...I didn't see where on there you got that it's a Mitsubishi engine?

I was wrong on that....kind of.

It's a revised Chrysler engine, but it was done in Mexico, not Japan, and is also used by Mitsubishi.

Damiler/Chrysler & Mitsubishi are still working on a new 4 cylinder engine. The turbocharger system is from Mitsubishi, and is pretty much the same as the Lancer's. Also, aparently, there will be plenty that can be done that will gain even more horsepower from the SRT-4.

So, to correct myself, the 2.4 engine isn't a "Mitsubishi engine", it's a "reengineered Chrysler engine" that's also used in Mitsubishis.

Either way, you will still find this engine in Mitsubishi, and the Turbocharger is from Mitsubishi.

Guess that makes it a techicality. ;)

BTW: Here's the Lancer Evolution8 site :
http://mitsubishicars.com/MMSA/jsp/evo/features.jsp

OK 2 things I have to add...

1) The CTSv will come in at $52k...I confirmed this at the NY International Auto Show on Friday with a Caddy rep...car is gorgeous, but 20k over an exisiting CTS? Oh well, GM screwed up again...:confused:

2) I'd love to ask slt why in the world he ordered an EVO with the wing and claims he'll take it off when THE WING IS A $600 OPTION!!!!! I'd wave the BS flag here, but I'll wait and see what he has to say :D BTW, I confirmed this fact looking at a window sticker on an EVO at the same show...

Originally posted by Jason E
OK 2 things I have to add...

1) The CTSv will come in at $52k...I confirmed this at the NY International Auto Show on Friday with a Caddy rep...car is gorgeous, but 20k over an exisiting CTS? Oh well, GM screwed up again...:confused:

:bs:

PRICES HAVE NOT YET BEEN SET FOR THE CTSv!!! I was at the NY auto show this weekend and asked the Caddy rep and she said "prices are not yet set" .

She also didn't know any thing about the Escalade V-series V12 :(

Hey, wave BS flags all you want my friend...she said prices, and I quote, "will be right around $52k, but EXACT pricing is not firm yet." I take that to mean around $52k, which is why I said what I did. What, you think its gonna be something drastically different??

Wave it all you want man, but maybe the Caddy rep I talked to was a little more loose tounged than yours. Just like the 2 different Pontiac reps I talked to...one said the GP would never go RWD along with the MC and Impala, while the other said she would not be surprised to see the GP get rear drive AND a stick, with a sly grin on her face! Depends on who you talk to it seems!

Don't act like I'm here wasting my time...I've got better things to do than spread rumors :mad:

Originally posted by slt
The SRT is another dodge POS. A powerful engine shoehorned in a ****ty car (aka viper).

Man, that's a funny comment from someone who just bought a Mitsubishi. You do realize how bad their quality has been over the last 20 years, right? Maybe they've cleaned up their act with the continuing influence of DCX, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Originally posted by Jason E
Hey, wave BS flags all you want my friend...she said prices, and I quote, "will be right around $52k, but EXACT pricing is not firm yet." I take that to mean around $52k, which is why I said what I did. What, you think its gonna be something drastically different??


That is a very believable number, and sadly, would be the death of the CTSv. There are lots of desirable cars for $50K+, and a CTSv looks like horrible value when you can save $5-grand by getting an Audi S4, or add $7,000 more to get a S6 Avant.

I thought a $36K CTSv was too good to be true.

Well, in all honesty, I knew 30s was too good to be true...I was thinking 40-41k...when she said 52k, my mouth dropped. She probably figured I was nothing more than a kid who didn't know what the value of the car was I was looking at...but that car is no value.

So we have a 41k Corvette
A 32-35k GTO
A 52k CTSv

Oh yeah, GM sure is in overdrive...at least with their pricing...

Originally posted by Jason E
Well, in all honesty, I knew 30s was too good to be true...I was thinking 40-41k...when she said 52k, my mouth dropped. She probably figured I was nothing more than a kid who didn't know what the value of the car was I was looking at...but that car is no value.

So we have a 41k Corvette
A 32-35k GTO
A 52k CTSv

Oh yeah, GM sure is in overdrive...at least with their pricing...

A $41,000 Corvette?! Where, where! Show me!! ( I know, you meant $51,000 :))

GTO's pricing is $2-3000 more than a GTP, and running right where WS6, live axled, 20 year old chassied, early 90s quality Trans Ams were, so complaints about it's price is nothing more than whining. If Pontiac (not the dealers) price it over $35,000, then I'll join you. Till then, GTO's price is right where it should be.

CTSv's $52,000 pricetag is astronomical!!!! :shock:
The best way to keep it in perspective is that the typical Lincoln LS V8 is $48,000!

Not much of a consolation, but it helps.

Originally posted by guionM
A $41,000 Corvette?! Where, where! Show me!! ( I know, you meant $51,000 :))



Vette pricing starts at around $44k.

Originally posted by slt



I'm not saying this car is a corvette killer, I'm comparing the two more for dramatic effect. In all reality, stock vs stock, the Corvette would win more times than it would loose, BUT it would be a damn close race and Evo would definatley win in the hadling department, all for $15,000 less. The EVO beats the corvette at it's own game when it comes to affordable performance.



Comparing the "hadling"...not sure, but comparing the handling?Step away from the bong....:no:

Congrats on your excitement over your new purchase.

:rolleyes:


Wow, some of these replies are amazing!!!

First, congrats on your new purchase, it's ALWAYS exciting to get a new toy! :D


However, by some of these replies, it is obvious that some people don't think things through to well...

#1 and probably the MOST important issue: GM would have to be the STUPIDEST company on this planet to price the Caddy CTS-V in the $30K segment! PERIOD. There $50K price for the CTS-V is DEAD ON!

... The CTS-V is NOT meant as an upgrade for F-Body crowd! Somehow I always thought this was OBVIOUS since day one, but I guess not.
... The target market for the CTS-V is the M3 and AMG folks.
- THAT target market would NEVER consider a CTS-V if it was priced in the $30K segment EVEN if the CTS-V KILLED them in EVERY ASPECT (performance, fit/finish, etc.. etc.). Why? Well, first of all, people looking at M3's & AMGs will not STEP DOWN to a "CHEAPER" product! Yes, in the world of dollars are easy, the "image status" among that demographic would see it as a "cheaper car" and thus INFERIOR based on PRICE ALONE! Secondly, it seems that $30K is becoming a very affordable price these days even for "kids." Caddy is starting to move up again in the word and the last thing I would want to see is a bunch of kids swerving through traffic in CTS-V... Nothing would kill Caddy target market of upscale cars and trucks like giving a bunch of punks affordable killer cars that they can rice out!!!

#2 Wow, comparing EVO's, SRT's, WRX's to a Corvette. :( Definitely shows what the current generation thinks of an american legend. I guess I shouldn't be shocked as it's the same generation that believe that a 5" exhaust tip gives you performance and the leaf blower gone mad sound of the exhaust from these 4 bangers is music!
- Again, these are two TOTALLY different demographic targets.

In most cases guys that are hard core V8 people and love the V8 sound wouldn't be caught dead in a 4 banger that sounds like a leaf blower on steroids. I'm one of those people I guess, but then again, I've owned only V8's (fbodies & vettes). I have own 4 bangers as beater cars for winter transportation, etc, but they were just that... utilitarian, not a way to hop it up and get myself to "believe" I have a performance car.

Yeah, the new crop of 4 bangers, etc are fast and may corner well, etc.... but to compare, confuse and mix them with V8's??? I say bring it on!!! All the more to display what a V8 can truely do. ;)

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
:rolleyes:

Wow, some of these replies are amazing!!!

The CTS-V is NOT meant as an upgrade for F-Body crowd! Somehow I always thought this was OBVIOUS since day one, but I guess not.

Considering most new FBody buyers were in their 40s, it is not as much of a stretch as you might think.


Wow, comparing EVO's, SRT's, WRX's to a Corvette. :( Definitely shows what the current generation thinks of an american legend. I guess I shouldn't be shocked as it's the same generation that believe that a 5" exhaust tip gives you performance and the leaf blower gone mad sound of the exhaust from these 4 bangers is music!
- Again, these are two TOTALLY different demographic targets.


You are right, these are cars that will attract different buyers. It only makes sense though, to compare performance cars against the current benchmark. That someone would be shopping for one and the other at the same time, that is not likely the case. In terms of numbers though, it is in fact not an absurd comparison at all.

It is, however, absurd to lump these cars in with the trash you see running around on a daily basis. That they are four-cylinders is where the similarities end. If you look closely, you'll see a large number of tacky V8 third/fourth gen cars running around on a given day. I don't base my opinions of Corvettes on them though. :rolleyes:


Yeah, the new crop of 4 bangers, etc are fast and may corner well, etc.... but to compare, confuse and mix them with V8's??? I say bring it on!!! All the more to display what a V8 can truely do. ;)

Which is what? Some of those in that new crop are more than capable of giving your ego a setback.

Jerry - As you pointed out, I should seperate the "high dollar" WRX's, EVO's etc, from the civic fart pipe crowd and I understand how you would demand this seperation. :) However, around here it is more common than NOT that even such a nice car as a WRX gets the "ricer" treatment. Sad, but I see it way more then riced out 4th gen F-bodies...

As far as a EVO or WRX setting my "V8 ego" back, those owners of these new crop of "performance cars" will have to spend quite a few dollars on performance mods all around instead of money for 5" pipes, etc before they hurt my "ego." :p

No offense Jerry, but do seriously see a WRX being a classic 30 - 50 years from now??? I just can't see it but you never know I guess, people didn't think that 5" inch + fart pipes would catch on years and years ago either! :)

Although, I do believe that history will record the WRX as the car that paved the AWD performance car market. I just don't consider it or any of the new runners as "sports cars"

I hate to tell u this but the new wrx sti will definitly give a stock ls1 fbod a run for its money.
dont think that im a 4 banger lovin kid, i love the sound of a nice v8 as much as the next guy ( cant wait to get the GTO running), but my cousin has a wrx and that thing is cool ( as much as i dislike imports) and frankly the new evo and sti get me excited.(although they can keep those ricer spoilers ;) )

Hopefully the CTSv will come in the low $40Ks, if it does come out at $52K it will make the GTO look like a pretty good deal.

for $52K it better be LOADED, nav system, DVD and all.

Now if it was a 450HP V8 for $52K that would probably be worth it.

for the record these other cars start at:
M3 = $46,500 (bmwusa.com)
S4 = $45,000
C32 AMG = $51,120 (mbusa.com)

Pricing the CTSv over these Luxury hot rods would be a bad move, even if it is faster.

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
[B
#1 and probably the MOST important issue: GM would have to be the STUPIDEST company on this planet to price the Caddy CTS-V in the $30K segment! PERIOD. There $50K price for the CTS-V is DEAD ON!

... The CTS-V is NOT meant as an upgrade for F-Body crowd! Somehow I always thought this was OBVIOUS since day one, but I guess not.
... The target market for the CTS-V is the M3 and AMG folks.
- THAT target market would NEVER consider a CTS-V if it was priced in the $30K segment EVEN if the CTS-V KILLED them in EVERY ASPECT (performance, fit/finish, etc.. etc.). Why? Well, first of all, people looking at M3's & AMGs will not STEP DOWN to a "CHEAPER" product! Yes, in the world of dollars are easy, the "image status" among that demographic would see it as a "cheaper car" and thus INFERIOR based on PRICE ALONE! Secondly, it seems that $30K is becoming a very affordable price these days even for "kids." Caddy is starting to move up again in the word and the last thing I would want to see is a bunch of kids swerving through traffic in CTS-V... Nothing would kill Caddy target market of upscale cars and trucks like giving a bunch of punks affordable killer cars that they can rice out!!!

[/B]

Thanks for the lecture on snob appeal. However, in the real world, Cadillac has about zero credibility as a luxury performance brand. They are starting at a lower image base than Lexus did when it was introduced in 1990. Would anybody pay more for a CTSv than a M3 or Audi S4? Perhaps a few successful pizza parlor owners.:rolleyes:

Isn't it odd that the new $45K Audi S4 offers the same drivetrain as last years $80k S8? The European brands are offering greater performance with every model change, but they're also upping the stakes in technology. That's where prestige comes from.

Cadillac is offering a Corvette motor that bears a substantial resemblance to the V8 in my $25k Camaro. Cylinder heads aside, this alloy lump could be my very own LS-1. I don't see the prestige, and considering the decades of negative associations, I don't see the value in a $52k CTSv.

snob appeal? LOLs... you need to crawl out from under the rock your under. Seriously, WHY in your mind would Caddy price the CTS-V in the 35K? That's what the GTO is for.

That would be like saying, hey BMW, lets price the next M3 to compete with a 350Z or G35... sheesh

Okay, so you don't like the LS6, I guess in your eyes a Corvette is cheap and not worth the 44K-52K, that's your right also.... just like I don't believe that an EVO or STI is worth $30K+

Personally, if I was in the market for an M3 or AMG or Audi, I would now have to consider the CTS-V... why? If it's all they make it out to be, it'll put a kick some butt and because it has the LS6!!! Imagine a 422ci LS6 in that cruiser... ;) Who needs Northstars complexity and added expense. :D

We'll agree to disagree I guess, but man, why would ANY manufacturer price a specialty vehicle cheap? I mean, heck if Mitsu can price the EVO at $30K and call it a day, then why would a CTS-V only be priced 1-5K above it's base model when it offers SO much more???

JAS_LS1--thought you made some good points.

I think Cadillac is predeterming the number of CTS-V cars. If they do that--then they wouldn't price it cheap. Less profit. When positioning their product in consumers minds against the BMW, Audi, Mercedes, price, like everything else must be close.

Originally posted by slt
Recardo racing seats

:lol::lol::lol:

gt

Originally posted by 305fan
JAS_LS1--thought you made some good points.

I think Cadillac is predeterming the number of CTS-V cars. If they do that--then they wouldn't price it cheap. Less profit. When positioning their product in consumers minds against the BMW, Audi, Mercedes, price, like everything else must be close.

Either LS-6 heads cost $15,000 to manufacture, or Cadillac has decided that the CTSv should have an Escalade-sized profit margin.:barf:

It looks like Cadillac's engineering staff is concentrating on performance while the marketing department is going to experiment with consumer proctology.:shock:

SO many people making oblivious rushes to judgement, based on what ONE uninformed GM representative may have said. And I can't really take anyone seriously who was considering a Cadillac but settled for a Mitsubitchy instead. Maybe it's a good thing if the CTSv's end up in the hands of more responsible people than that. I mean all of a sudden lately it's "52k oh my god!!" when none of us really have any idea as to the price. Is anyone in touch with reality? Reality is.. you don't know the price, so give it time. Put my guess down for high 40s, max. Jeez, give it time, at least, before you write off a car based on an unsubstantiated figure..

gt

Originally posted by 1fastdog
Vette pricing starts at around $44k.

41k, 44k, wherever....all too damn much for me :D

Originally posted by redzed
Either LS-6 heads cost $15,000 to manufacture, or Cadillac has decided that the CTSv should have an Escalade-sized profit margin.:barf:



You must have missed the list of other things that are included on CTS-V besides the "LS6 heads" then, right?

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
[BYeah, the new crop of 4 bangers, etc are fast and may corner well, etc.... but to compare, confuse and mix them with V8's??? I say bring it on!!! All the more to display what a V8 can truely do. ;) [/B]

Well, I picked up the EVO on Friday (couldn't wait for the blue on so I picke a white one off the lot) and it has been a fun weekend. No one around here (St Louis) really knows what an Evo is. Alot of people seem to think it is just another all show, no go civic. :D :D Well I want to put 1000 miles on it to break it in but I have already had 3 mustangs try me. 2 old LX 5.0's with the big tires on back, Big tack on the dash, and pizza cutter tires up front, and 1 newer mustang GT. None of them have kept up. I'm loving it.

Hate all you want, but this car is more of a sports car than than a mustang or camaro. There is already (this car went on sale like 6 weeks ago) a stage 1 kit with a video documenting a 12.5 1/4 on stock tires. It's pretty much just 3" exhaust and a K&N

Originally posted by 1fastdog
Comparing the "hadling"...not sure, but comparing the handling?Step away from the bong....:no:

Great arguement:rolleyes:

Originally posted by Jason E
2) I'd love to ask slt why in the world he ordered an EVO with the wing and claims he'll take it off when THE WING IS A $600 OPTION!!!!! I'd wave the BS flag here, but I'll wait and see what he has to say :D BTW, I confirmed this fact looking at a window sticker on an EVO at the same show...

Hey smart guy, just go out and try to find an Evo, never mind what options it may or may not have. Out of three dealerships, around me, there was only one Evo. They get around one Evo a month.

And I have changed my mind, the wing is staying:p

Originally posted by slt
Hey smart guy, just go out and try to find an Evo, never mind what options it may or may not have. Out of three dealerships, around me, there was only one Evo. They get around one Evo a month.

And I have changed my mind, the wing is staying:p

Well, I think his point was legitimate if you ordered the (blue) car like you said you did, and then said you were going to remove the wing anyway... ;)

Originally posted by Darth Xed
Well, I think his point was legitimate if you ordered the (blue) car like you said you did, and then said you were going to remove the wing anyway... ;)

I didn't order it, it was the dealerships 4th Evo, scheduled to ship at the begining of June:p They are getting a yellow one in May if any one is interested:D

Originally posted by slt
I didn't order it, it was the dealerships 4th Evo, scheduled to ship at the begining of June:p They are getting a yellow one in May if any one is interested:D

Ya, I got that from your last post...

The way it read before, I thought you had ordered one to your own specifications, too...

Makes more sense now. :)

Slt--if you don't have the latest M/T go get one.
Big shoot out--exotics, Viper, Z06, Lightning and...an EVO! They really liked it.

0-60=4.59--faster then Mustang Cobra
1/4 mile = 13.08@105--Cobra just got ahead here.
600ft salom= 71.4mph---second highest

Admitledly the Mistu placed 2nd or 3rd form the bottom in most tests but it's still damn fast,
and way cheaper then everythihng else. Impressive for the only 4 door and lowest power ratings.

Originally posted by slt
Well, I picked up the EVO on Friday (couldn't wait for the blue on so I picke a white one off the lot) and it has been a fun weekend. No one around here (St Louis) really knows what an Evo is. Alot of people seem to think it is just another all show, no go civic. :D :D Well I want to put 1000 miles on it to break it in but I have already had 3 mustangs try me. 2 old LX 5.0's with the big tires on back, Big tack on the dash, and pizza cutter tires up front, and 1 newer mustang GT. None of them have kept up. I'm loving it.

Hate all you want, but this car is more of a sports car than than a mustang or camaro. There is already (this car went on sale like 6 weeks ago) a stage 1 kit with a video documenting a 12.5 1/4 on stock tires. It's pretty much just 3" exhaust and a K&N

Haha, you killed Mustangs... well, I guess I did say V8. Shame on me for not specifing. Now go pick on some real V8 cars! ;)
Well, I guess you should get the stage 1 kit so that you can keep up with a bolton LS1 car. ;)

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
Well, I guess you should get the stage 1 kit so that you can keep up with a bolton LS1 car. ;)

I guess you missed this post:

Originally posted by 305fan
0-60=4.59--faster then Mustang Cobra
1/4 mile = 13.08@105--Cobra just got ahead here.
600ft salom= 71.4mph---second highest


Nevermind the fact that you can make some modifications to the Evo as well. Numbers like 4.59/13.08 sound very respectable to me. I'll be very surprised if the $40-50k CTSv is quite that fast.

Originally posted by jrp4uc
I guess you missed this post:



Nevermind the fact that you can make some modifications to the Evo as well. Numbers like 4.59/13.08 sound very respectable to me. I'll be very surprised if the $40-50k CTSv is quite that fast.


Okay, if you guys DON'T quit quoting MAGAZINES then you will be in for a rude surprise at the track and even on the street. ;)

What does it matter if a $50K CTSv is faster? Do you SERIOUSLY think that you will get one to race you on the street, or for that matter an M3 or AMG to run you on the street???? :confused:

Heck, most V8 guys (mustang, LT1, LS1, etc) won't run you guys. Not for fear of loosing, but because you blend in with the "sport COMPACT" market and who needs to get arrested just to prove that he or she beat a 4 banger. :p ;)

How old are some of you guys???? I'm betting teens to low twenty somethings...

BTW, yes, "sport COMPACT" not "sports CAR"... if you think its a "sports CAR" then I have some cheap beach front property for sale for you in Nevada! ;)

I still can't believe that you guys are comparing this new wave of "sport compacts" to vipers, ZO6's,etc... now... That would be like me comparing my LS1 TA or LS1 vette to a 200K Lambo or other exotic, just because my cars are just as fast or faster then they are!!!! That's just CRAZY talk guys.... crazy talk....

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
I still can't believe that you guys are comparing this new wave of "sport compacts" to vipers, ZO6's,etc... now... That would be like me comparing my LS1 TA or LS1 vette to a 200K Lambo or other exotic, just because my cars are just as fast or faster then they are!!!! That's just CRAZY talk guys.... crazy talk....

Funny, that's exactly what that MT issue did.

You can call the cars whatever you want. You've got the hangups on what everything is classified as or labeled. It just sounds like you're having a tough time swallowing the fact that your LS1 car isn't as "invincible" as it once was. I'm a fan of the LS1 F-bodies as well, but I give credit where credit is due.

I should ask how old you are that "street racing" is such a major part of your life. I've stopped doing that and I'm 24. It's not worth having your license suspended regardless of what you're racing. :rolleyes:

Anyhow, I think this topic has been beaten to death by now.

Your right--if speed was all that mattered
(the F-body would have sold like hot-cakes for one..) we'd all be driving dragsters.

To me, the CTS-V will be an awesome car. Best thing to come out of Cadillac in...well...ever.
Most people buy what they like...not what is faster.

The only thing that stops the EVO from being a sports car---is the 4 door body.

Originally posted by jrp4uc
Funny, that's exactly what that MT issue did.

You can call the cars whatever you want. You've got the hangups on what everything is classified as or labeled. It just sounds like you're having a tough time swallowing the fact that your LS1 car isn't as "invincible" as it once was. I'm a fan of the LS1 F-bodies as well, but I give credit where credit is due.

I should ask how old you are that "street racing" is such a major part of your life. I've stopped doing that and I'm 24. It's not worth having your license suspended regardless of what you're racing. :rolleyes:

Anyhow, I think this topic has been beaten to death by now.

LOLs.... MT is in the business of making MONEY!!! Like any good business you give the customer what they want. If that means comparing a polished turd to a vette or viper, I'm sure the publications would jump on it if the public demanded! ;) Fact still remains that the sport compact market is the craze among the young folk and the WRX and EVO ARE classified by the industry as "sport compacts" This is good AND bad. Good in the fact that there will be a HUGE aftermarket because of the current craze and bad because those nice cars (WRX & EVO) will get pigeonholed as a "sport compact" fad by anyone over 25.

LS1 "invincible".... haha, now that is funny!!! If you only knew my thoughts of the LS1 you'd be laughing with me.

I haven't street raced for a long time now... however it does piss me off when a "sport compact" drags water out onto the starting line because they had to do a "front wheel" burnout!!! Now WHY does a 15-18 second car have to do a massive burnout again??????? :confused: :p

Face it, you guys are comparing "sport compact" craze cars to cars that are in a totaly different league because A) they may be just as quick, etc and B) the MEDIA craze trying to make money of off the latest craze!

Originally posted by slt
Hate all you want, but this car is more of a sports car than than a mustang or camaro.

Just wondering, did you own or at least driven a Camaro or Mustang before?

Not trying to cut you down, just want some more detail..

I've been eyeing this area lately... I wish they made a cheap light RWD sports coupe with a turbo 4... that would be interesting...

Originally posted by 305fan
Your right--if speed was all that mattered
(the F-body would have sold like hot-cakes for one..) we'd all be driving dragsters.

To me, the CTS-V will be an awesome car. Best thing to come out of Cadillac in...well...ever.
Most people buy what they like...not what is faster.

The only thing that stops the EVO from being a sports car---is the 4 door body.

:cool:

Agreed... but consider that when insurance is cheap on these little rockets, there ARE a lot of outside influences that affect sales. Heck, my vette insurance is CHEAPER than my f-bodies! Crazy isn't it????

What will keep the EVO and the WRX from being thought about as world class sports cars is the fact that they DID get stuck being smacked into the "sport compact" market.

Now the Supra was/is a "sports car" despite being an import! :)

before espeically in the mid 90's, I've always viewed V8 f-bods at least dominate in straight line performance when compared to anything else around it in its price range, and at least hold its own against much higher priced sports cars..

now almost 10 years later, we have these turbo I4's right up there in performance, all while being more pratical and comfortable..

I could care less what the "current fad" is.. (although I don't like the EVO's looks)... hence I love and drive my Camaro.. if I had the cash and credit now, I'd be looking at an Evo too..

besides, if I was drivng an Evo, and the other person underestimated it, think how much sweeter the look on their faces is when the Evo lauchs off and pulls away?

Originally posted by Ken S
Just wondering, did you own or at least driven a Camaro or Mustang before?

Not trying to cut you down, just want some more detail..

Yep, alot of my friends are muscle car fans and drive Mustangs, Camaros, and old muscle cars. I've been having this same arguement with them.

Just come back and let us know the odometer reading when you blow up that poor little overloaded motor. I don't think it's in it for the long haul if you're already racing in the break-in period.

And I'd venture to say that you're not really out to please yourself and have fun with this car, you're only out to impress others, since you're obviously careless with the first 1000 miles or whatever, and since you couldn't even wait for your favorite color. Instant gratification will only get you so far.

So in that regard, I'm glad you chose a shlzubitchi. A Caddy deserves more attention than that :)

gt

Originally posted by slt
Great arguement:rolleyes:

Comparisons to the Evo and the Corvette are fine, as anyone that drops dough for a new car looks at all the possibilities that fit their desires and budget and make their own comparisons...logical or not so logical.

I clearly see you are sold on your purchase, that's great.

Where should I start here, to assist you in understanding that a difference exists, that I believe you a a bit overboard in your enthusiasm...mmmm your suggested comparisons that the Evo "smokes" the C5 have little backing. Yep, there are 2:73 rear geared vettes with soft suspensions. They are formidable nonetheless.

Z51 six speed 'vettes are gonna give you a tough time on a roadcourse. Z06's will hand you your ass in an embarrasing fashion.

You have a car that makes you happy and has some power and grip... don't get carried away. Most folks that post here have a measured appreciation for cars and that's a good rule to follow. There's also a certain something that an automotive platform has that includes, yet isn't summed up in, just the stats. Maybe it's "character", for lack of a better term. Numbers are easier to come by than "character". Camaros have always had "character". C5's have "character".

I don't think stating that those that disagree with where you rate the Evo are "haters" as being at all accurate.

You think the Viper is a POS, ...OK... I disagree. Well balanced? No, POS?...NO.


I am thrilled you find your new purchase stacks up to just what you want. New car smell will do that. If you are a street stormer with something to prove, by all means go for it.

What kind of numbers does the Evo turn at Nurburgring? There's the paradigm for world class in the Sport car frame of reference.

It's never just the car, it's what the car will do with you in it.

Ok, this is beating a dead horse now but i took our wonderful competitor and based it up against the Evo with the stats right off of Mitsibishi's site: (sorry for the sloppy chart)

--------------------Evo---------------------------------Mustang Mach 1
Price--------------28,987----------------------------------28,680
HP-----------------271@6500----------------------------305@5800
Torque-----------273@3500-----------------------------320@4200
Width-------------69.7 inches-----------------------------73.1 inches
Height-------------57.1 inches----------------------------52.4 inches
Curb W------------3263 lbs.-------------------------------3465 lbs.
Fuel Ec-------------18C/26H--------------------------------17C/25H

So for a car with the same price as the Evo u get a wider car with a lower roofline that weighs only 200 lbs. more with more horsepower and torque and gets just about the same fuel economy. granite the Evo does have some niceties such as the momo wheel and brembo brakes (those brakes are nice) but i think it goes to show that comparing an Evo to a Corvette (which outclasses the Mustang in spades) is more bs than fact and even comparing an Evo to a Cobra is also more bs than fact. also it was mentioned earlier that with some modification the Evo can run 12's but runs a 13 something stock. Muscle mustangs and Fast Fords ran 12's in a showroom STOCK Mach 1! So please no more comparisons between the Evo and the Corvette or Cobra. The Evo is an awesome little car and once again congrats on ur purchase slt but i think comparing it to an SRT-4 and WRX is a little more realistic.....
sorry for the long post guys thought i'd put some facts out there.

zipping up flamesuit :D

I could never see myself owning a Ford

BUT

as final as that sounds, I can see myself with a Ford way before any Mitsubitchy. Those Mach 1 stats are pretty compelling when seen side by side with that steroid-pumped import heap

Originally posted by kizz
I could never see myself owning a Ford

BUT

as final as that sounds, I can see myself with a Ford way before any Mitsubitchy. Those Mach 1 stats are pretty compelling when seen side by side with that steroid-pumped import heap

Now I would probably purchase a Mustang Mach 1 before a Evo too, but only because I'm a muscle car guy at heart. However, am I the only one who sees the Evo beating the Mustang in every category but strait line performance? And then in the quartermile you have to admit itd be pretty close.

I guess I just dotn get why people are going at such lengths to bash or talk down on a car that offers awesom performance at a great price. You might not like the looks of it, but you have to admit the performance is there.

Originally posted by bigsteve7
Now I would probably purchase a Mustang Mach 1 before a Evo too, but only because I'm a muscle car guy at heart. However, am I the only one who sees the Evo beating the Mustang in every category but strait line performance? And then in the quartermile you have to admit itd be pretty close.

I guess I just dotn get why people are going at such lengths to bash or talk down on a car that offers awesom performance at a great price. You might not like the looks of it, but you have to admit the performance is there.

Exactly. :confused: I'm sorry, but Mustangs are not worldly-sports cars either. This Evo is just as respectable.

Gee, this thread is still going? :)

The Evo is a great little car, as is the new WRX. I simply find it amazing that this has degraded to a EVO vs CTSv/Mustang/Corvette/etc... comparison. :confused:

There's no debating these little things are very quick, and alot of fun. The only issue is are they worth the price considering what fully loaded versions of the cars they are based on. Some people feel they are, and that should be respected. This is a totally different situation than the $40,000 Silverado SS that clearly get's smoked not only by competitors, but by cheaper versions of itself. With the EVO & WRX you clearly are getting something spectatular for your money.

slt, you started this entire thing when you claimed you were waiting for a CTSv but settled for an EVO instead, which from the outside looks totally ridiculous considering the difference between the 2 (a Corvette powered, full sized, Rear Drive, American luxury sedan, or a sub-compact turbocharged, AWD, Japanese rally car :confused: ). Pop it down a notch: I was going to get a V6 CTS but I settled for a Lancer instead??

JAS_LS1 in retrospect is right in retrospect (a high performance, LS1 CTSv for just $1,500 more than loaded CTS V6?!). I'm a bit embaressed thinking that myself! :o

enough, someone lock this thread so it goes away

Originally posted by slt
enough, someone lock this thread so it goes away

slt - You now have an EVO, you said you've own Fbodies. The point is, instead of everyone and their grandfather quoting MAGAZINES, why don't we have people speak from experience such as yourself.

guionM made an excellent point about waiting for a CTSv and then getting a EVO instead. Two TOTALLY different cars. I'm willing to be that even IF the CTSv was 35K and killed the EVO you would still get the EVO because 1) your probably young and the EVO has more respect among your peers than a Caddy 2) see #1. ;)

Heck, I would venture to say that if you had to choose between an EVO and a GTO, you would probably go with an EVO... :)

As much as people like to not admit, AGE has a TON of influence on what you buy! Somehow, I see most WRX and EVO drivers are going to be sub 25 and I'm sure that was the intended target. (Although, I will note, Honda really missed the boat on age demographics with the ELEMENT! :eek: )

So, SLT, serious, WHY did you buy an EVO and didn't wait for the CTSv or even the GTO which will be close to the 35K target???

Okay SLT, at least do me ONE favor...

at the track, go AROUND the water box since you have 4wd instead of through it like all the other "sport compacts" :)


Thanks buddy and have fun with the car! :D

Originally posted by slt
enough, someone lock this thread so it goes away

You have the option of deleting it, just hit the "delete thread" button.

Originally posted by JAS_LS1
guionM made an excellent point about waiting for a CTSv and then getting a EVO instead. Two TOTALLY different cars. I'm willing to be that even IF the CTSv was 35K and killed the EVO you would still get the EVO because 1) your probably young and the EVO has more respect among your peers than a Caddy

Actually, none of my friends know what the Evo is. Ive been having fun showing them :)

heck, I would venture to say that if you had to choose between an EVO and a GTO, you would probably go with an EVO... :)

Good question, 2 big problems with the GTO for me. 1. It comes out after summer and I've been wanting to get out of my current car for a while now. 2. Its a lame duck model. Isn't a newer and improved model coming out shortly afterwards.

So, SLT, serious, WHY did you buy an EVO and didn't wait for the CTSv

B/C it costs $50k+ This is a company car, I had to keep the payments below $600. I can afford to put down $4-5,000, but $15,000 is too much for a car. I've got a house to buy in October.

or even the GTO which will be close to the 35K target???

My car is just as fast, handles much better, has a large back seat, is much more exclusive, will have better resale vale,

and my insurance doesn't go up at all with an Evo.

"will have better resale value"


Yeah, probably, assuming the "sport compact" fad doesn't go away for quite some time and fast and the furious movies keep coming out! :D


Sorry couldn't resist. :)

However, if you bought ANY car for resale value as one of your top 5 reasons than all I can say is, DON'T drive through the water box. ;)

Originally posted by slt
This is a company car, I had to keep the payments below $600. I can afford to put down $4-5,000, but $15,000 is too much for a car. I've got a house to buy in October.

My car is just as fast, handles much better, has a large back seat, is much more exclusive, will have better resale vale,

and my insurance doesn't go up at all with an Evo.

Compared to a $52K? CTSv, your Evo will definitely have lower depreciation. However, considering the cars in this category will be driven, don't count on having a "collector car" that appreciates with time.

I'm also glad that your insurance didn't go up with the EVO. Sometimes, when insurance companies don't have any previous loss experience to go on, they give a new model the "benefit of the doubt." As strange as it might seem, even a Z28/SS Camaro can be cheap to insure at a few small, highly selective insurance companies.

From where I stand, you can feel happy about your purchase. At very least, you'll have spent a bit less than if you had waited for the GTO. Being a cheapskate, I probably would have sacrificed some speed for a cheaper 350Z, G35 or 325i - but that's just me.