1983Z

First post on this board in the Thirdgen section, so I'd like to start by say "Hey" to everyone!

I've had my Thirdgen for quite a while, and have been posting on another board for years. But, to the topic - I've had traction issues for some time, and my winter project is to improve it somehow. And I'm not too proud to admit it, I've gotten whooped by a Hemi Charger twice from light-to-light on the street....but at around 40 MPH or so (when I quit spinning) I start catching up with a vegence.

I don't expect miracles, but I have a couple of parts to install so far. I got some Spohn weld-in LCARBS that'll be going on along with a UMI TQ arm relocation bracket (not so much for traction, but to take the stress off my tailshaft).

I already have a UMI TQ arm, Spohn sway bar brackets attached to a Moser 9 inch with a Detroit Truetrac and 3.70:1 gears. I know I have horrible tires for traction (BFG "Excentias" P245/60/15's on stock rims) - and I'll be getting new wheels and tires to hopefully correct most of this issue...(open for opinions here too)

Any thing else I should look at getting?? Bear in mind, the car is 95% street driven, and I only intend to take it to the track and embarass myself on an occasional test-n-tune day.

ZZ

Are you running an auto trans or manual? Stall speed? A decent drag radial and an air lift air bag on the right can't hurt. I don't have anything too fancy, just boxed stock stuff, bigger rear swaybar, poly bushings and air bags with crappy 275/60/15 BFGs and it hooks pretty good. SFC won't hurt either.

redneckgames

First place you always have to look is something you already mentioned. tires.

The best suspension setup and parts in the world wont do a thing if you have poor tires on it.

Z28SORR

Ditto: Also with the correct "offset" you can get some reletively wide wheels & therefore tires on the back.
Something like this would make a world of difference.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....o&autoModClar=

1983Z

Thanks for the replies so far guys...

ZZ - I'm running a G Force built T-5 trans, and Spohn weld-on SFC's (in sig) - I have the stock '83 swaybar in the rear, and Energy Suspension poly bushings all around. I also have Lakewood lower control arms on it.

redneckgames - Yeah, seems like everyone agrees tires will make it or break it. I guess I'll need to make tires the priority. I've been contemplating going to a 17" rim since there doesn't seem to be a big selection of 15" sized tires anymore - at least good streetable ones...

Z28SORR - Thanks for the link! I've looked at those tires along with many others, like Nitto's, Nexxan etc. Seems every wheel I like (i.e. American Racing Torque Thrust M's) offer offsets not very Thirdgen friendly. I do like the looks (and price) of some of the OE knockoff Vette wheels, but I'd rather stay away from running spacers...I don't want 40 lug nuts on the car just to run wheels...I like the old school 5 spoke designs though...

To add to my plans, I'm also looking into getting Lakewood 70/30 struts up front, not sure what shocks I'll put in the rear yet. I'm trying to avoid putting bags in the coils since again, it's mostly street driven...

AutoRoc

You need a 275/50/15 Drag radial. Mickey thompson makes a nice one.

A 275/60/15 would be about 2" taller. It might hurt acceleration slightly but will give more top end speed and lower cruising rpms..

You should be making some good power with that combo, get a real tire on it and you will only put a "normal" tire on it for giggles.

Marc 85Z28

400" with a positive displacement blower going through a manual trans with 3.70 gears and junk street tires is about as bad as you get

Start cheap. Go with some adjustable LCA brackets to setup proper LCA angle. Then move to a better tire. Nitto DR at a minimum, or even BFG. Mickey Thompsons will work best, but tread life isn't great. If you still have problems you may want to invest in a taller gear and/or larger rear sway bar. A stock WS6 or 1LE bar would do.

Chrome383Z

I'm running 315 Toyo DRs on 17" wheels and they are great for street duty, even in a light rain it's not terrible. In a heavy rain I have to slow down to about 30mph though (at least).

Traction is eh... much better then street tires, but nowhere as good as a MT or MH. I'd do something with a good street drag radial, and then get a set of 15" wheels w slicks when you really want to tear it up.

AutoRoc

To compare a Nitto Drag radial to a Hoosier or Mickey Thompson drag radial... my car is over a half second slower in the 1/4 mile with a Nitto Drag radial. I could go 11.0's all day on a hoosier/M/T radial and 11.70's on a Nitto 555R (best was 11.57).The nitto is a lot better than a normal street tire but light years behind a good Drag Radial.

1983Z

Thanks for the replies! So Mickey Thompson it is. I assume you mean the S/R's correct? They look like nice tires to me.

Not too concerned about the tires wear rating since the car is just a toy not meant for a DD.....I couldn't afford the gas if it was!

So far as wheels, I'm kinda digging the looks of these:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ARE-420516155/
But nothing is set "in stone"...lol

They're the AR 200S, 10" wide with a 5.5" backspace. On the front, I'm kinda unsure...most likely I'll go with something skinnier.

One thing though....if I mount 275/15's on the rear with a 5.5" backspace, will they tuck in all the way? I asked on another site, and some say the 275's "might" stick out a bit. Anyone know for sure? I just don't want any sidewall slicing due to them sticking outside the fender well.


I'm considering the 60 profile (taller)...I don't see them hurting acceration at all, and I have 245/60's on it now and 1st gear is almost useless as is. I catch myself shifting to 2nd gear before I can make it through an intersection.

Marc 85Z28

No. Mickey Thompson ET Street Radial.

275/50r15 will stretch onto a 10" wide wheel and tuck nicely, it's what I ran for years. Do NOT attempt 275/60r15 on a 5.5" backspacing.

ws6transam

or worse, a 285-60-15!

285-60-15 ET Street versus 275-40-17:



285-60-15 in a thirdgen fenderwell.



These things required 4mm spacers, plus hammer blows to the inside-forward edge of the fenderwell, plus they required the rolling of the inside fender lip and an adjustable panhard rod to center everything. In the end, I still ended up skiving off little bits of rubber when the fenders nipped the sidewalls, I think.

You can fit them but boy, what a pain. I sold the ET streets after using them only once.

1983Z

Ok...So I'll go with the ones you guys are saying - the 50 profile. But a couple more Q's if you don't mind....I looked up the Mickey Thompsons and they don't run in a standard P275/50/15 size...instead they have a 26x11.50/R15 and it appears they are 1/2" wider in tread with than the regular P275's are. Also if the Summit website is to be believed, they call for a max wheel width of 9.5" for those tires...

So if the wheels I'm looking at are 10" wide, will it still work?? Just trying to be sure before I "Pull the Trigger" and actually buy these things...

EDIT: OK...now after I did more researching, I find out that the backspacing I'm attempting (5.5") may very well end up with the tires sticking out of the fenderwell. Now I'm reading that I'll need 6.5" of backspacing which really limits my selection of 15" wheels A LOT more...AND I'll need to remove my bump stop and cut up the inner fenderwells to boot!!

I'm not dead set on 15's...I'll go up to 17's....heck, 18's I don't care - so long as they tuck and I can get as much rubber under there as I can...this is getting frustrating. Do tire centers generally have a selection of different sized wheels/tire combos that a person can try on their car to see what'll fit??

ws6transam

A 15 x 10 x 5.5 backspace will work on your car, assuming you have the 1st-gen disc brakes; or drum brakes. I don't think 6.5 inch backspacing would be a good idea. Your wheel will rub in all sorts of places and your tire will touch the inside of the fender well, requiring you to mini-tub your car, relocate axle mounting points, shock mounting points, axle bump stops, etcetera. As far as the wheels sticking outside of the fender well, I dont think that will be the case with a 5.5 inch back space. Even when I had the huge 28 inch tall ET streets, the tread stuck inside the fenders. It was the sidewall that would touch the fender lip, as well as the edge of the bump stop on the inside of the fender. As I recall, that was what actually nipped the tire, not my outer fenderwell edge. Stick to a 26 or 27 inch tall tire, keep the width reasonable and it should work nicely. The nice thing about a 15-inch wheel is that you get extra side wall on the tire which will aid in spooling up torque for your launch. It also cuts the reciprocating mass of the wheel by moving the metal closer to the center of your rotating circle.

- - - Now, in regard to the 15 x 10 x 5.5 inch backspace:

If you have a 1989-up PBR caliper you will have interference issues with the wheel unless you run a 4mm spacer and also shave the caliper like this:



In terms of tire width, I think Marc summed it up. I just sold my 15 x 10's, and they were shod with Hoosier quicktime pro 27 x 11.5 x 15 drag tires, which did not have any interference problems at the drag strip. Therefore I think a 26 inch version would probably fit fine.

1983Z

ws6transam - I really do appreciate the help...and I'm not implying you guys are giving me bad info. What seems to always happen is the more I research, the more and more conflicting info I get - and after a while you're just not sure what the heck to believe!!

I JUST got done reading a post on another board which basically said you need to run at LEAST a 6" to 6.5" backset when you run 10" wide, 15" diameter wheels....AND in addition, inner fenderwell mods are needed...so I hope everyone can see where my frustration is coming from..

Anyway. my car has a Moser 9" rear with Explorer 11" drums. The width is supposedly the same as the standard thirdgen. I don't anticipate any brake interference issues...really I'm just looking to get it right the first time...I'd rather not spend a lot of $$ on nice wheels and rubber that I may have to sell at a loss later because they don't fit..if that makes sense...lol

Marc did indeed say: So I gotta ask then...Do you think the wheels tuck in OK with 10" wide wheels with 5.5" backspace and the Mickey Thompson 26x11.50/R15's ???