HUGE STARTER PROBLEMS - This will be 7TH STARTER IN 2 YEARS
09-07-2010, 06:39 PM
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HUGE STARTER PROBLEMS - This will be 7TH STARTER IN 2 YEARS
VIDEO of current Hi-Torque Mini Starter problems - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soUQ3Ai1Po4
I am currently on my 6th starter. I have gone thru 6 starters in 2 years. The car has headers and every mechanic I've gone to and have looked at the car has blamed the HEADERS for having too much heat and burning out the solenoid on the starter. After Lordco (For those in the USA, Lordco is similar to AutoZone) finally stopped offering replacements on the starters after one shop made the dumb move and TOLD lordco I was coming down in behalf of their shop to pick up a starter to replace the starter that was burned out by my headers.. Unfortunately they now have me on record and can't return any starters to them.
As I asked around (and even on here) was told it WAS my heaters and to go to a Hi-torque MINI starter and are literally guaranteed to last the life of the car as the headers won't effect it. I took it to another place (who has rave positive reviews) and they said they too would warranty the starter for years because the starter can't be effected by the headers.. So I put up of the $300+ for the MINI starter. They even welded a heat shield to provider further shielding from the heat of the starter solenoid.
No problems until 2 months later.. The car started to do the same.. Starter locking.
I went to my work and put the car on the hoist. Took out my video camera and conveniently remote started the car.. The 3rd start and it LOCKED. On video I can clearly see (with the flywheel cover removed) that the starter gear is SMASHING against the flywheel teeth.
Now I called the shop that installed the MINI and they said that if it were the shims, it would have been noticeable right away, and that the heaters would not have any effect on it so It has to be the flywheel however they cannot deal with the flywheel as they don't have a hoist (They are a starter/battery install place only and jack cars up with manual jack and crawl under) But the shop itself has a A++ Better Business Bureau and has been in the business for a LONG time.
I took it to another shop to have it looked at and was able to get starter to lock up against the flywheel teeth again so they can see for themselves. They claim it's the headers doing it and it's NORMAL to have to replace the starters in 2-3 months with headers. They are trying to convince me to pay another $300 for another MINI starter plus install because it is very unlikely the original shop will warranty it since they claim it's the headers at fault and not the starter.
Now I'm being told it could be the flywheel by some mechanics, but the shop who has the car now says they want to experiment with the starter because replacement of the flywheel would be like $600cdn (Flywheel and removal of tranny).
I CANNOT GET A STRAIGHT ANSWER FROM ANYONE!!!! One group of mechanics and shops say it's the starter, then another says it's the HEADERS and this is normal to replace 2-3 months each time, other say it's the flywheel even tho the shop says the teeth look fine.. And now being told the start pin in not coming out all the way but it is CLEAR it IS coming out because it's hitting the flywheel. You can see this in the video.
FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL.. HELP me get this fixed!! WHAT is at fault?? HOW do I stop this was dying all the time??? I mean COME ON.. 6 starters in 2 YEARS is just a tad over excessive and RIDICULOUS don't you think??
I am currently on my 6th starter. I have gone thru 6 starters in 2 years. The car has headers and every mechanic I've gone to and have looked at the car has blamed the HEADERS for having too much heat and burning out the solenoid on the starter. After Lordco (For those in the USA, Lordco is similar to AutoZone) finally stopped offering replacements on the starters after one shop made the dumb move and TOLD lordco I was coming down in behalf of their shop to pick up a starter to replace the starter that was burned out by my headers.. Unfortunately they now have me on record and can't return any starters to them.
As I asked around (and even on here) was told it WAS my heaters and to go to a Hi-torque MINI starter and are literally guaranteed to last the life of the car as the headers won't effect it. I took it to another place (who has rave positive reviews) and they said they too would warranty the starter for years because the starter can't be effected by the headers.. So I put up of the $300+ for the MINI starter. They even welded a heat shield to provider further shielding from the heat of the starter solenoid.
No problems until 2 months later.. The car started to do the same.. Starter locking.
I went to my work and put the car on the hoist. Took out my video camera and conveniently remote started the car.. The 3rd start and it LOCKED. On video I can clearly see (with the flywheel cover removed) that the starter gear is SMASHING against the flywheel teeth.
Now I called the shop that installed the MINI and they said that if it were the shims, it would have been noticeable right away, and that the heaters would not have any effect on it so It has to be the flywheel however they cannot deal with the flywheel as they don't have a hoist (They are a starter/battery install place only and jack cars up with manual jack and crawl under) But the shop itself has a A++ Better Business Bureau and has been in the business for a LONG time.
I took it to another shop to have it looked at and was able to get starter to lock up against the flywheel teeth again so they can see for themselves. They claim it's the headers doing it and it's NORMAL to have to replace the starters in 2-3 months with headers. They are trying to convince me to pay another $300 for another MINI starter plus install because it is very unlikely the original shop will warranty it since they claim it's the headers at fault and not the starter.
Now I'm being told it could be the flywheel by some mechanics, but the shop who has the car now says they want to experiment with the starter because replacement of the flywheel would be like $600cdn (Flywheel and removal of tranny).
I CANNOT GET A STRAIGHT ANSWER FROM ANYONE!!!! One group of mechanics and shops say it's the starter, then another says it's the HEADERS and this is normal to replace 2-3 months each time, other say it's the flywheel even tho the shop says the teeth look fine.. And now being told the start pin in not coming out all the way but it is CLEAR it IS coming out because it's hitting the flywheel. You can see this in the video.
FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL.. HELP me get this fixed!! WHAT is at fault?? HOW do I stop this was dying all the time??? I mean COME ON.. 6 starters in 2 YEARS is just a tad over excessive and RIDICULOUS don't you think??
09-08-2010, 12:18 AM
#3
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09-08-2010, 01:09 AM
#4
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Starter should never smash the gear against he flywheel like that. there should be like .05" or so of gap. I can not see headers doing enough damage to warp the shaft either. Looks like it is not shimmed properly really. I have known people to go years and years with headers and not change a starter. Unless the header is actually sitting on the Starter, I do not thing it is the headers fault. If the starter is not shimmed properly, it will burn out in 2 to 3 months.
People go with mini starters because they can not fit a regular starter in after headers. pretty much the only reason.
People go with mini starters because they can not fit a regular starter in after headers. pretty much the only reason.
09-08-2010, 06:18 AM
#5
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Location: Fort Myers, FL
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I'll throw this out there
If you have a bad spot on your flywheel, it could cause this issue, especially when its on the 3rd or 4th start.
Yes, it could still be the starter.
I would try to find a used LT1 starter and go from there. I've used them successfully on both of my 3rd gens. I think the last one only cost $40 off of the forums.
good luck with your issue
-jason
If you have a bad spot on your flywheel, it could cause this issue, especially when its on the 3rd or 4th start.
Yes, it could still be the starter.
I would try to find a used LT1 starter and go from there. I've used them successfully on both of my 3rd gens. I think the last one only cost $40 off of the forums.
good luck with your issue
-jason
09-08-2010, 10:52 AM
#6
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Location: Friendswood, TX, USA
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and to go to a Hi-torque MINI starter and are literally guaranteed to last the life of the car as the headers won't effect it.
It looks to me like you have never properly shimmed the starter. Or you have a bad spot on the fly wheel.
You have access to the ring-gear of the flywheel so it wont be that hard to inspect it for damage.
09-14-2010, 03:07 AM
#8
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So according to the mechanics at the new shop, they are indicating to me the headers were apparently installed wrong and are installed way too close to the headers. Here are pictures of my exhaust, what is wrong? Are they saying the truth? How should it have been done?
The Cats will be reinstalled for Emissions testing and then the rest without the cats.
http://www.camarosource.ca/temp/
The Cats will be reinstalled for Emissions testing and then the rest without the cats.
http://www.camarosource.ca/temp/
09-17-2010, 10:28 AM
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After looking at the vid. and picts. again it appears that you have provided some conflicting info. What you are showing is NOT a mini-starter! It's a standard Chevy starter.
Look here: http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...Id=10002&Nty=0
these are mini-starters.
I don't think the headers were installed wrong. Bad choice of words. It does look like the "Y" pipe could have been install with more clearence for the starter.
It's clear from the vid. that the starter solenoid is working, ie. trying to ingage the starter drive gear. But it does not appear that the starter is turning. There also appears to be to much movement of the starter armature shaft.
I believe what is happening is that the starter is getting overheated by the proximity of the "Y" pipe and losing lubrication, causing premature ware and failure. I would get a real mini-starter and wrap it in one of these: http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/32000/10002/-1
Look here: http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...Id=10002&Nty=0
these are mini-starters.
I don't think the headers were installed wrong. Bad choice of words. It does look like the "Y" pipe could have been install with more clearence for the starter.
It's clear from the vid. that the starter solenoid is working, ie. trying to ingage the starter drive gear. But it does not appear that the starter is turning. There also appears to be to much movement of the starter armature shaft.
I believe what is happening is that the starter is getting overheated by the proximity of the "Y" pipe and losing lubrication, causing premature ware and failure. I would get a real mini-starter and wrap it in one of these: http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/32000/10002/-1
09-17-2010, 01:47 PM
#12
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: vancouver, BC, Canada
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After looking at the vid. and picts. again it appears that you have provided some conflicting info. What you are showing is NOT a mini-starter! It's a standard Chevy starter.
Look here: http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...Id=10002&Nty=0
these are mini-starters.
I don't think the headers were installed wrong. Bad choice of words. It does look like the "Y" pipe could have been install with more clearence for the starter.
It's clear from the vid. that the starter solenoid is working, ie. trying to ingage the starter drive gear. But it does not appear that the starter is turning. There also appears to be to much movement of the starter armature shaft.
I believe what is happening is that the starter is getting overheated by the proximity of the "Y" pipe and losing lubrication, causing premature ware and failure. I would get a real mini-starter and wrap it in one of these: http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/32000/10002/-1
Look here: http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...Id=10002&Nty=0
these are mini-starters.
I don't think the headers were installed wrong. Bad choice of words. It does look like the "Y" pipe could have been install with more clearence for the starter.
It's clear from the vid. that the starter solenoid is working, ie. trying to ingage the starter drive gear. But it does not appear that the starter is turning. There also appears to be to much movement of the starter armature shaft.
I believe what is happening is that the starter is getting overheated by the proximity of the "Y" pipe and losing lubrication, causing premature ware and failure. I would get a real mini-starter and wrap it in one of these: http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/32000/10002/-1
09-20-2010, 07:03 AM
#13
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Location: Carrollton Texas. Just north of Dallas
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Just from the video to me it looks like it needs to be shimed, it's not meshing with the gears. Also I would either wrap the headers or get a set that has been coated for heat. Even a heat shield will only do so much.
09-20-2010, 11:20 AM
#14
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i've wrapped the starter, and the TES are ceramic coated already. I've taken it to 3 shops, and they have all tried shimming it and can't figure it out. Now it does it 9 / 10 times when I start. If I crank it multiple times right after the other it eventually will break thru and get into the flexplate gear to start. Or if I bang in the seat to rock the car at the same time as I crank over it usually starts. Everyone is blaming headers but that tells me it is NOT the headers.
09-20-2010, 05:11 PM
#15
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Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 151
This issue of the starter hitting the flywheel and actually not engaging the teeth is another cursed Chevy problem. I've seen it on some cars and no matter what starter the owner puts on, it does not solve the problem.
No, headers don't normally cause this problem.
Usually the issue can be resolved by shimming the starter but it's not as easy as it sounds, it takes an experienced person to do it. That's why most wrench monkeys just offer to install a new starter, hoping that it will fix the problem. But what do they care, it's not their own car.
Find somebody who deals with starters and knows what the word "shimming" means and take it to them.
Maybe a silly question but does your flywheel have the correct tooth-count?
Lou
No, headers don't normally cause this problem.
Usually the issue can be resolved by shimming the starter but it's not as easy as it sounds, it takes an experienced person to do it. That's why most wrench monkeys just offer to install a new starter, hoping that it will fix the problem. But what do they care, it's not their own car.
Find somebody who deals with starters and knows what the word "shimming" means and take it to them.
Maybe a silly question but does your flywheel have the correct tooth-count?
Lou
