Bearcat Steve

Shorty headers get you nothing -- appearance only.

2010_5thgen

well i dont think i would say you get nothing from shorty headers. you dont get as much as long tube but you get better air flow than the stock manifolds.

Bearcat Steve

In all of my years, I have never seen a set of shorty headers add any amount of HP at the rear wheels than could be measured.

1fastdog

And I agree with your thought on "shorty headers". Long tubes do work better, if designed to do so, if the collector is maximized.

Long tubes can minimize the operation of catalytic converters becuase they put the cats too far down the exhaust path to allow proper exhaust temperature to be achieved, thus the cats won't work effectively.

Picking up power and still passing state mandated emission tests is not a bad thing.

Any time you deviate from the validated system you need to consider all of the ramifications, only then can you know what issues might arise in the negative column.

A lot of thought went into the shorty headers.

2010_5thgen

i dont have emmisions where i live so my camaro will not be having catalytic converters. just long tube headers and a good sounding exhaust.

1fastdog

I have my index fingers in my ears, and I'm saying "LA, LA, LA, LA, LA"....

2010_5thgen

im serious. we dont have to pass emissions where i live. technically i can take the cats off and not have to worry about it. thats what ive done in the past.

Bearcat Steve

States and county rules vary as to whether you need to pass an emmissions test or not.

However, federal law states that you cannot remove the cats or change the location at all. Of course, I don't think there is anyone to enforce the law.

Logansneo

I know that I have been notorious for comparing cars to the SS Camaro that most feel shouldn't be (my GT500 thread being the most recent comparator) but continuing on my obsessive research I couldn't help but make one with the recently reviewed Aston Martin V8 Vantage Roadster. Here's there test numbers:


VEHICLE TYPE: front-engine, rear-wheel-drive, 2-passenger, 2-door roadster

PRICE AS TESTED: $153,170 (base price: $135,950)

ENGINE TYPE: DOHC 32-valve V-8, aluminum block and heads, port fuel injection
Displacement: 289 cu in, 4735cc
Power (SAE net): 420 bhp @ 7000 rpm
Torque (SAE net): 347 lb-ft @ 5750 rpm

TRANSMISSION: 6-speed automated manual

DIMENSIONS:
Wheelbase: 102.4 in Length: 172.4 in Width: 73.4 in Height: 49.4 in
Curb weight: 3840 lb

C/D TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 4.5 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 10.6 sec
Zero to 150 mph: 27.9 sec
Street start, 5–60 mph: 5.1 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.9 sec @ 111 mph
Top speed (drag limited, mfr’s claim): 180 mph
Braking, 70–0 mph: 175 ft
Roadholding, 200-ft-dia skidpad: 0.87 g

FUEL ECONOMY:
EPA city/highway driving: 13/19 mpg
C/D observed: 15 mpg


With similar dimensions, nearly the same weight, horsepower, and upon further inspection wind drag, but with far less torque it will be quite interesting to see how the SS Camaro stacks up against a car costing nearly $120,000 more, in performance at least.

christianjax

I think people are underestimating the science that goes into well designed CAI's. Most OEM intakes use accordian style tubes from the airbox (which has a small inlet) to the throttle body. Notice that all aftermarket CAI's have SMOOTH and bigger tubes? That plus a much better flowing filter, and a location that actually get's cold outside air, why wouldn't it create up to 20 hp more? SLP offers a "smooth" bellow that goes between the MAF and the throttle bodie that replaces the accordion OEM one. SLP claims about 10 hp for this 6 inch pipe. (for LS1 fbodies) Unfortunately, when I put it on my T/A I couldn't get my airbox lid to fit snug because the ducting lost flexibility. But It did make a difference powerwise while it was on. (combined with the lid, high flow MAF sensor, K&N filter). It's all about getting as much air into the motor as possible. The colder that air is the denser it is. And looking at the stock intake system on the new SS screams rooms for improvement. Add headers, a smooth bend exhaust (and drop the cats) and you should see substantial hp increases.

1fastdog

Yes there are states that don't have emission checks. I live in one. They used to have tests but determined it was a "hook show" to have what was essentially a yearly tax...

The federal laws with vehicle emission devices are pretty explicit. I'm not offering a sermon. I think what folks do with their cars is their business. I only offer there can be ramifications.

At the very least, keep the parts you take off. If you ever sell the car you can reverse the mods as one must vouch that the emission devices have not been tampered with. That situation WILL come back to bite you.

The shorty's are an alternative for folks that don't want the possible hassles which can come with reprogramming their PCM, voiding their powertrain warranty, dealing with the exhaust smell, and dancing outside of the laws.

Again. I offer no sermons. I'm an enthusiast as well. I like having all the horsepower I can get.

No one wants you to enjoy your new Camaro more than I do.

1fastdog

Unless a car has a horribly designed pre-throttle body intake, 20HP is too high of an expectation, IMO. 5-10 HP is more like it. Worth it? Yes, I think so.
Just avoid a filtering media that allows too much garbage to pass through. There a safer ways to "hone" cylinder walls...

Cold air is more dense and power assisting. What is key is keeping the IAT < Intake Air Temperature >sensor seeing temps that don't require timing being rolled out to prevent detonation. This doesn't "make" any more power, but it keeps you from "losing" power to timing retard. The IAT sensor is a ruthless dictator.

SSCamaro99_3

What a manufacturer claims is pure marketing. 10hp from a smooth bellows was never put up on any dyno run I ever saw. On LS1 F-bodies you would do well to see a 10hp gain from a FTRA/SSRA, air lid, and bellows (total waste of money in my opinion). Vast majority of that gain comes from the lid.

toegead93

In the past catalytic converters were bottle necks in the exhaust system so it made sense to put straight pipes in their place. But with todays high flow catalytic converters you don't lose anything you'll notice, unless you have an abosute racing beast with gobs of HP. That's why my '93 LT-1 Camaro had no cats and my new SS will have LTs and high flow cats. I'm not worried about testing here in FL but I just don't see the point in taking them off any more.

I saw the G8 RT guys are getting up to 38RWHP with Lid + tuning (most from the tune).

christianjax

So the G8 crowd are getting just lids instead of a CAI? The stock lid isn't like the lids on LS1's. All that sound chamber crap was nothing but a speed bump for the air going to the motor. The airbox for the G8 and the SS Camaro look very similar.