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The Camaro ZL1 is built to be run hard, no doubt about it. "Track-ready" is the word of the day from the engineering team. (And we're out at Bondurant to prove it., more on that later) But it takes an extra-large bucket of stones to use a competitor's owner's manual against it. More »



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JasonD

...and one of the first comments to that article is:

Right there in black and white, it shows how the ZL1 outperforms (and nearly embarrasses) cars that cost over twice as much. That's the comment that should be left?

90 Z28SS

For the sake of sounding like a fool, I hope the ZL1 really can beat the 2013 GT500. Confidence as well as pride in your product is good and all, and so is all the smack talk( keeps it intersting ), but this is gonna be a huge embarrassment for the GM camp if the GT500 comes out on top. He's been so vocally adement the ZL1 has nothing at all to worry about, and Ford remains silent. At any rate, this will be once of the most epic car comparo's in recent history. And Im sure the controversy to follow will be even more epic.

OutsiderIROC-Z

jroc7

I have to think that GM realizes that even the current GT500 has trouble utilizing its power (it only beats a SS by 0.1 seconds in a 1/4 mile and gets off the line slower), and unless major upgrades are done to the 2013 model other than just putting in a big engine, it'll just be more tire smoke than speed. To have a fair test when the 2013 Shelby comes out, they should have to test it with no mods done. That's the whole point, afterall.

Freak

They're doing more than just putting a bigger engine in it. It's supposedly getting a launch system of some sort, though I am skeptical of how good it will be. If it's like the Boss system It wont be great, as that system is more of a 2 stage rev limiter.

Gearing is also completly revised, and it will actually put LESS torque to the wheels than the current one in first gear. That should help make it easier to control wheel spin. The gearing will also allow for no shifts when going to 60, and possibly one less shift in the 1/4.

Speaking of 1/4 mile times, if you think the 2012 Shelby is only .1 sec quicker than an SS, you must be comparing slow times of the Mustang to fast times in the Camaro. MT got 12.3 out of the 500, I don't know what the best test of an SS , but I'm willing to bet it wasn't 12.4 (and keep in mind, Evan Smith was quite a bit faster, but I throw his out unless he drove both, and I don't know that he did.)

And finally, I've never seen a Magazine test a modified car unless it was testing the before and after results of the mods themselves. So there's no reason to think any upcoming tests would be of modded cars.

King Moose SS

Ford and GM are taking 2 different approaches, to solve the same problem of building the best track ready pony car.

Ford determined on it's mustang chassis the best way to go about it is the keep weight down, place a lot of down force, and have a monstrous engine. As much as we will complain, the performance guys at Ford wanted to put an IRS in the mustang, and they wanted to have fatter tires, and they wanted to have track ready coolers for the car to be standard equipment. The problem is it would of priced this car out of the market. (much like the Japanese sports cars in the mid/late 90's)

Chevy on the other hand was lucky. It was much easier for them to accomplish what they wanted, because many of the components the ZL1 is using, were already developed (LSA, the auto and manual that go with the LSA, Magnetic ride, ect.) The Chevy team knew with the car they had, there was no way in making it a hard-core stripped down racer. (like many of us wanted.) However they did go about the ZL1 in the best way possible to make it the fastest car on the Zeta chassis, IMO.

It's going to be interesting to see how these car compare. I think though, that since the GT500 and ZL1 have branched out from each other. It's going to be like comparing a 1996 Supra vs 1997 RX7. They've became the to top dogs, but the method in which they approached it are completely different.

Bob Cosby

Good analysis, IMHO.

STOCK1SC

Unfortunately on most car sites it seems people tend to do that with the times on cars, they take the absolute fastest time ever recorded for their car and the absolute worst time posted for the other car they are trying to make a point about. It's amazing how many people actually believe the Gt500 is a 12.8 car as gospel but have no trouble quoting 12.9's for the Camaro SS. The Gt500 having it's gear ratio actually reduced from the 3.73's on the performance package will actually help improve it's 0-60 times, I never understood why Ford thought it was a good idea to make the 3.73's an option when the 3.55's were barely hanging on for dear life.

Fbodfather

Who'da thunk it?

Remember when we thought 275HP out of an LT1 was the cat's jammies?

...........and then the LS1 at 305HP???

The good news is that competition makes us ALL better!

The jury's still out on what will happen to a complete comparison (strip and road course) btw the 2013 GT-550 and the ZL1 - but it WILL be fodder for many more controversial threads on this and many other sites........

Lotsa conjecture......

There's one way to have solved the Camaro weight 'problem' if you will........

............that was to not come up with the Camaro Concept in 2006......

I for one am glad we did the concept - and frankly we listened to America and Canada - the message was loud and clear: Build it and DON'T CHANGE A THING...........perhaps that's why the 5thgen Camaro is still turning heads nearly three years later.

Meanwhile - there are still a lot of things to surprise and delight the owner of a new ZL1.

A couple of things:

1. - it's a powerful car that's also 'liveable' -- you can turn to the person sitting next to you -- while travelling at 70mph -- and talk with them in a normal voice..........it's that quiet at speed.

2. -- the ZL1 rides incredibly well - (provided that you don't put it in track mode!) You can drive it across country and arrive feeling great - not like you just went several rounds with *insert name of favorite boxer here*



Oh - and I couldn't resist:


(this IS, after all, www.CAMAROZ28.com....)

Slappy3243

Now now my friend. Does anybody still believe the LS1 was rated properly at 305 HP? At the wheels perhaps, and that's being conservative.

STOCK1SC

I still miss my 02 LS1 I'd probably buy it back if I could find the owner. I could actually see out of it compared to the 5th gen although it's nice to see the hump gone from the passenger side floorboard.

Freak

Very true. I don't get the my car can beat up your car mentality anyway. I only care that I enjoy driving whatever car I have.

Incidentaly, the 3.73's were put on the performance pack soley to make up for the difference in the rear tire size (the PP tires are about an inch taller). I have a feeling the much taller gearing in the 2013 is going to make the car feel a bit more sluggish than the previous models, which I think really benefit (as far as the fun factor goes) from deeper gears. Then add some decent tires, because the stock ones blow goats.

I am a Mustang owner and I approve this message.

2010_5thgen

so your blaming the weight issue on the consumers because we wanted the camaro back?

SSCamaro99_3

A suitable chassis did not exist in 2006 that would have allowed the weight we all would like; while still appealing from a ride, safety, and cost perspective that the market could live with. They effectively did the best they could with a "basically" off the shelf piece that would cover as broad a spectrum of price, performance, and cost as they could.